Women being pitted against each other - ecs vs natural Labour

[Poptart4]

Firstly i dont care what way you have chosen to give birth. Its your body and whatever works for you is fine by me. I believe women should have the right to choose whats best for them. But....

I have noticed on these boards and others that whenever the subject of women choosing to have a c-section over a vaginal delivery comes up, the women who have had an elective c-section go on the defensive and start attacking and insulting women who've given birth naturally.

Comments like 'id rather have a section than a saggy vagina' or 'at least im not incontinent'.... And other nasty comments.

As a woman who has given birth vaginally 3 times including a forcep delivery i dont suffer from either and find the statements highly insulting.

Yes i know that these are possible side effects to giving birth and alot of people unfortunately do suffer but a lot don't. And why should the women who do suffer be put down for giving birth naturally.

Whats never mentioned is the bad side effects to having a c-section. I know a woman whose scar got infected and the poor woman spent 2 years with green smelly ooze leaking from her tummy. I know others who are left with a flap of skin hanging over their scar. I could go on but my point is there are pros and cons to both c-section and vaginal deliveries and women should be informed on both.

There is an article in a British paper today about ecs and the comments board is full of women pointing out the possible side effects to a natural delivery in a nasty way and again nothing is mentioned of the possible side effects of a c-section.

I just find it sad that women feel the need to attack each other. If your happy and confident with your decision then you shouldnt have to put other women down to justify your decision.

Why cant we just support each others right to chose without the insulting put downs??

Oh and i did use paragraphs but they don't seem to be showing on my phone :(

Another situation where women are in pointless competition with each other (as with BF vs FF).

Giving birth is hard whichever way it happens, there are risks and side effects with both. To be able to do it at all is an amazing feat considering what our bodies have to go through. No competition needed!

IRL by the time your children are 3 ish and beyond, it doesn't even come up in.convo how they arrived in the world, or how they were fed. Sometimes the real world is nicer than Mumsnet

I think that in the 21st century we’ve lost sight of how dangerous childbirth is. Neither vaginal or c-section comes without risk. I gave birth to DD two months ago. I had a natural labour which lasted 3 days! I ended up with an assisted delivery and lost nearly half my blood volume. Was it an ideal birth experience? No. Are we both alive and well now? Yes. If this was 100 years ago would we both be dead? Most probably. I think we need to concentrate more on the outcome than the way we got there. I’d rTher have a saggy vagina or a c section scare and be ALIVE

I've been here for years and never seen a thread like that.

I and I think anyone I've spoken to in real life couldn't care less how anyone else gives birth providing everyone comes out if it alive.

YANBU OP. It’s not a competition. If baby is safe and out, the end justifies the means.
Another one that really gets my goat- the no pain relief badge
Some knobber got a shout out on Chris Evans’ breakfast show this week for his wife (he didn’t actually name her in his text to the show) who’d had his baby “without any pain relief”. WHY does that matter?! Who cares?! Ooh you’re a better mother than me, you didn’t get any pain relief. To clearly love your baby more.

I've been here for years and never seen a thread like that

Same here

Having said that i mainly lurk on AIBU, chat and FWR so that might explain it

if your happy and confident with your decision then you shouldnt have to put other women down to justify your decision

Also feel i shoukd point out that a elc isnt always a choice

I've been here forever and I've never seen anything about c-section v vaginal birth. Feeding fights, yes plenty, but no birth fights.

I think it cuts both ways - both sides of this debate have been on the attack and again with the ff vs bf. It’s personal choice of course but when you feel judged and criticised you will fight back. Fo your bit - don’t get involved in the bun fight!

I agree we should support women in whatever their choice.

I think it goes both ways though. People who have C-sections are told they haven’t had a “natural” birth or that it’s the easy way out, which is untrue. There is also an issue of the risks of vaginal birth being downplayed as women are discouraged from caesareans.

So while I don’t think it’s one way traffic, I agree women shouldn’t be pitted against each other in how they give birth, feed their child etc

I have never seen such an arguement on here.

However it's often missed that both vaginal and c sections have serious risks, even if most turn out ok. Neither is better or easier than the other.

I have noticed on posts where OP asks for ELCS advice a lot of people jump on with, oh the recovery time, oh the risks, oh the long term issues. However they seem to forget all of these can be problems for people who have had vaginal births too.

I've had a vaginal birth, it was horrific. I'm planning an ELCS this time, not because it's easier, not because I am ignorant to the risks etc, but because of my previous experience it's the best option for me and my baby. The sheer amount of people who don't get that and try to tell me I'm wrong is staggering!

I honestly think this is an online thing. Mums I meet face to face....we never fall out about this crap!

People are always trying to pit women against each other for something FF vs BF, CS vs VB, SAHM vs WOHM, make up vs no make up, slutty vs frumpy.
Don’t get swept up in it most women just do what’s best for them and don’t care about what other women do.
I had a EMCS which my NCT classes has portrayed as the ‘worlds worst thing’ it was fine just like my friends VBs were fine. No need to compete and compare.

Where the fuck have you been seeing comments about saggy vaginas and "at least I'm not incontinent"

What I have seen, however, is lots of discussion of the downside of having c-sections, which you also have so helpfully included in your post about not judging people.

I suspect you're on the wind up and having a subtle dig about women who've given birth via elective c-sections.

Comments like 'id rather have a section than a saggy vagina' or 'at least im not incontinent'.... And other nasty comments.

I’ve been here 10 years and never once seen a comment like that about vaginal birth. And if I had seen it I would also have seen the poster getting short shrift for it!!

lockheart to be fair to the OP I’ve seen those negative comments she describes.
I’ve got no axe to grind I had an EMCS myself but people say awful things about both birth methods here.

Do you have any links, gamerwidow? Like other posters on this thread, I'm a reasonably long-term poster (> 6 years) and have never seen a comment like that.

If anyone said that I imagine they'd get their arse handed to them quick sharp.

I had an elcs for several reasons.
I have never once said or even thought anything about how other women choose to give birth. Not saggy vaginas, not incontinence, nothing.
Maybe some people are just arseholes, that's always my look at people saying shitty things on the internet.

Having a straightforward, vaginal delivery is usually the expectation when you first become pregnant. Usually, I'm guessing here, you have to have a c section when things aren't going too well. Women may become defensive over feeling they haven't done it right, maybe? Which of course is a load of crap, there is no right way however I can see how the feeling may arise.

Kind of like when people tear down another's appearance to make themselves feel better. I wouldn't choose a c section as I've seen others go through the recovery and it can be awful, but in the same way I wouldn't choose to tear all the way to my bottom.

Giving birth is personal and shouldn't be used as an attack. Tom fletcher recently posted about his 'brave' wife needing no pain relief, that pissed me right off. I saw my mum bleed out due to a prolapsed cord and her child almost die. She went into shock and had to force her body to stop shaking for an epidural and the whole experience was horrendous. That's brave, being lucky enough to have a straight forward birth is just luck, not a measure of ones courage.

Oh ffs. Is this STILL a debate? I had a c section AND I didn't bf. Both of these were for medical reasons. I was made to feel second rate and a pain in the arse by the MWs on the ward (attending MW was fab) and then by the HV at home. Made my life hell with chronic PND as a result. I champion ANY woman who gives birth full stop, howsoever that happens. I'm pretty sure the majority do too.

Comments like 'id rather have a section than a saggy vagina' or 'at least im not incontinent'.... And other nasty comments.

I've never seen any comments like that on Mumsnet. What boards are you reading?

lockheart no I do not have links and I’m not trawling mumsnet to find them to prove myself to you. Perhaps you could consider the possibility that you haven’t read every single thread on mumsnet and that I have no reason to make up comments that don’t exist?

Well since it would appear from the other comments on this thread that I'm far from the only one who's never seen anything like that, it would be interesting to see them. I'm not asking you to "prove yourself to me" and I've never claimed to have read every thread.

I've seen it online but luckily never IRL, when people have discussed birth options it's always been sensible/polite/non judgy.
Maybe because it's such an obviously medical thing? No one really doubts someone saying 'my dr/midwife said'...

(I have had RL friends be bitchy about bf/ff and co-sleeping/CC though)