To suggest everyone's DC train as roofers, builders and other "trades"?

[PolkerrisBeach]

Because I've spent about a month trying to get people to do work in the house and NOBODY'S INTERESTED. Nobody wants to come and quote for smaller jobs like putting four skylights in an extension ceiling, taking down a wall between two rooms and plastering.

They're all too busy doing 50k extensions and loft conversions.

So if anyone has a child considering their future, send them to learn to be an electrician / builder / roofer / carpenter - they are all so busy that they're turning work away.

DH and his Dad have only ever done domestic gas. I think DH has 10 "additional" things to his basic qualification. We live in an area where there is enough LPG usage to make it worth it, and even LPG is divided up, so he has a couple of those.

He doesn't have the worry of work and struggles to fit it in especially now it's just him. But that's largely because he's got the benefit of his dad having been established for a gazillion years! Plus you have to keep a balance of what you charge. There's a fine line between pricing yourself out and maintain a sensible charge that covers everything. It does also mean we're pretty tied to this area, as I think starting over elsewhere would be a huge challenge.

Couldn't agree more and I've been banging this drum for years. It's very hard to get tradespeople in my areathey are far too busyand they are certainly not interested in 'small' jobs. All the tradespeople I pay to do work on our house earn far more than I ever have, for all my academic qualifications (degree and further degree).

My DDad is "in the trade" and it was always famine or feast when were were kids. If theres no work (like when the financial crash happened, or just before the brexit vote etc) he can't pay the mortgage. At the moment he's ok as there is plenty of work around. I wouldn't wish that life on my kids! It's one of the main reasons I have a very steady job and married a guy with an equally boring steady job!
Also my BIL is bricky by trade, early 30's and his back is already giving him grief. He was always worried about being off sick, as off sick = don't get paid, holiday = don't get paid. He's now moved into a slightly different (albeit related) job, where he gets a pension and sick pay.
Ultimately I'll support my kids in whatever they want to do, but I wouldn't push/nudge them into a trade.

I do think schools should be making apprenticeships sound much more lie an equal choice to pupils. At present they really don't, esp for those achieving higher grades. Its all about university. Apprenticeships are very much on the sidelines. At both Y11 and Y13 apprenticeships are still seen by many as the 'other' option and not as good as staying on to do more education. This thought process needs to change massively really.

have family who have worked as joiners, plasterers etc and it’s OK when you’re young but as you get older it’s crippling work. The pay is not amazing either.

We have family and neighbours who are in trade and seem to have nice lifestyles but all have told their children not to go into trade.

FIL is unusual in that even now post 65 he is in demand - brick layer - though many other skills and is turning work down - what you don't see is the joint problems which are still getting worse that he suffer from early 30's.

Neighbour next door does okay in 50s because he set up and runs own business employing younger backs - but he goes out and works and then has to deal with all paper work on top.

FIL and DH cousins spend a lot of time away from home working going where the work is. That's less true for other family members in trade.

All the family are too far away to help us out very often so do know how frustrating and hard it can be to find and get people in.

Last house needed a lot of work small and big jobs and we got messed around a lot we often found people who would quote through local friends - though it was hard to get recommendations or details and often only could get one quote and if it was reasonable we'd have to proceed. Good thing was once we'd found people they would come back for other jobs - we paid very promptly and were flexible and got good work in return.

You're right, it takes more than qualifications but neither DH nor I could have our careers (literally) without graduating and then having post grad qualifications in our fields.

Same here. I have the degrees and the graduate profession I qualified for 12 years ago. I still don't earn enough though!

I think it must be harder for youngsters to get into the trades properly now - lots of the well regarded technical and FE colleges have become not particularly distinguished Universities turning out not particularly well regarded degrees and the old structure of true apprenticeships to skilled tradesmen with college day release has largely disappeared.

Traditionally, there's been quite a bit of nepotism in trades.

Pretty much everyone I know in trades started off working with their father, or uncle, or someone their father knew. I wonder if its the same now, if apprenticeships are so difficult to get?

Suspect not for the larger firms, but I reckon it must have an impact.

I'm not sure I'd encourage ds's to go into trades. As pp's have said, in your 50's they are crippled physically, like my bil, and then "some old lady asks you to do a job for a tin of whiskers"

If you want to learn a trade you need to get in at 16. NMW makes it difficult for anyone over the age of 18 to actually get started and make it all the way through the apprenticeship. I used to work in a Jobcentre and we got loads of people wanting to learn a trade, 18/19 years old, and it was virtually impossible to get one. Anyone going to 6th form first and then thinking of starting an apprenticeship will struggle.

@summerFruitPudding

Haha I'm plenty successful thank you. Far more than a builder or welder. My point was that it's the person and their drive and creativity, not the degree.

Most of the people I went to school with who went into plumbing/building/electrical type roles are far better off!

It depends. THey might be now, but university degrees often pay off long term ... and when you're being asked to work until you're nearly 70 years old, that is easier to do in an office job than out in the miserable wet, cold weather doing physical labour. Plus injuries and worn out bodies are more likely in the physical trades...

Yes, we need people to do all sorts of jobs, but think about the big picture when you're 'requiring' your children to learn a trade before university...

I also know carpenters who emigrated because they couldn't get work here in the downtimes ... hard to pay your bills when the economy is in the toilet and no one is spending money on their homes...

Great in the up times; scary in the down times.

I had a young plasterer work for me on a crumbly house we were doing up room by room. He eventually didn't want to do any more as he was doing a university course. We got him "out of retirement" on one last occasion in the summer holidays. The trade wasn't for him long term but he will have that skill for his own homes in the future.

It's not the answer to a national skills gap but from a personal development point of view I thought he'd taken a useful path.

If you aren't academic then trades are the way to go. I now someone training to be a plumber with the gift of the gab who'll do great on their own in a few years. We may contribute financially to get him going.

OP - go to a few builders merchants and ask the staff if they can recommend anyone. Often there are tradespeople in there anyway who may even help you.

I've suggested looking into what's involved in taking on an apprentice to DH. He won't entertain it as his dad took on a YTS, only for the scheme to close when the course was only half-way through and would have let the young man without a qualification. His dad then covered the final year.

I think being a good trainer also requires a certain amount of skill and diplomacy. Not sure DH really has the temperament!

Trades still don't pay enough though do they? Unless you are running a business employing several people or you are doing something highly skilled learning a trade will only land you in a position where you are very busy but still not getting paid that much. You might as well be a slave at a big law firm, at least that way you get the chance to try for partner and making a good amount of money one day.

Trades are certainly not careers to be sniffed at. I've seen plenty of them collecting their kids from school which means a great work-life balance.

I used to work in Central London and an electrician we had come into our office told us that he worked 3 days a week in Central London then went back to his family in Dorset for 4 days a week as the money working in Central London was so good.

Don't you need to be quite skilful to do a trade - ie you need to be practical and creative as well as having amazing problem solving skills.

I don't think it's as easy as saying "learn a trade" - you need the aptitude for it.

I have found one particular trade I have used in the past few years seems to have been taken over by ex public school boys.

One had even brought a younger guy who was from his old school. Talk about old boys network

When you look at the amount of house-building going on across the country it doesn't seem so surprising that there is a shortage of builders for small domestic jobs. I need a section of guttering replaced and I can't reach it to do it myself. It's very difficult to find anyone who will quote for it.

Training as a roofer, builder, plumber, plasterer was always a good idea, although you have to be prepared to take on the aggravation of running a business and sorting out your own health insurance, pension, etc. if you want to make a good thing of it.

My sons both did degree courses, both in subjects that don't lead directly to jobs but as they were passionate about what they wanted to do they both found jobs after graduating quite quickly. I'm pretty sure they would have been rubbish at anything needing practical skills. I certainly think young people should give more thought to employment and long term aspirations.

I've got a friend who's just set up business as a handyman. He completely underestimated the demand for work. He's picking up a ton of work that plumbers/electricians/builders don't want.

Dh is a tradesman as is db. Ds is an apprentice (with another family member). Getting an apprenticeship is like plucking hen's teeth (we are also central Scotland). There are next to no apprenticeships. When we initally started looking for joiner apprenticeships for ds there was 2 listed for the whole of Scotland, and unfortunately none near where we lived. Fortunately family member gave ds apprenticeship and it was purely because of relations, otherwise other family member would not have taken any one on. There is a severe shortage of tradesmen and it is only going to get worse as people retire and there is not the young force to replenish it (because no one wants to take on apprentices anymore). And due to the severe shortage it does mean that trademen can be more picky with the jobs they choose.