To suggest everyone's DC train as roofers, builders and other "trades"?

[PolkerrisBeach]

Because I've spent about a month trying to get people to do work in the house and NOBODY'S INTERESTED. Nobody wants to come and quote for smaller jobs like putting four skylights in an extension ceiling, taking down a wall between two rooms and plastering.

They're all too busy doing 50k extensions and loft conversions.

So if anyone has a child considering their future, send them to learn to be an electrician / builder / roofer / carpenter - they are all so busy that they're turning work away.

We are in Scotland - not the "south east bubble" we're all hearing so much about. I must have contacted a dozen builders/roofers over the last month. Have heard back from two of them, and just one has been round to look.

A friend recently had a similar problem getting someone round to rebuild a 2 foot retaining wall in their garden which had started to lean. No brickies interested as they're all busy on bigger stuff.

And that is fair enough. I am sure that most of us would not take a day's unpaid leave from our well-paying job to look at a job that we don't have time to do and may well not get paid for.

So you are right it is a supply and demand problem but all of us would take a straightforward, longer term, better paid job than otherwise wouldn't we?

Hope you don't enjoy watching TV, films, documentaries, reading media journalism, using social media, using websites or any of a number of other things that media studies students are likely helping you do Bruce 😂 it's a fairly useless false comparison as there's no guaranteeing that the media kids would be any good at plumbing - I know I'd be shite and do more harm than good, no matter how much you trained me.

You would go to work one day for half wages, why should tradesmen?

I'm self employed and I know what you're saying. But I'm not the only one with a 2 day job which needs doing rather than a 2 month job. I've also made it very clear that I'm hugely flexible - if a builder phones and says that he can do it but will have to start tomorrow then that's fine. Or fit it in around other work in a month - also fine.

There's also the option to subcontract or own larger building companies. Then you are looking at serious money.

The firm I work for turns down most domestic work. We still do small works for businesses.
There is no money in domestic work, everyone tries to screw you down, complains when the cheaper option doesn’t work as well even when it’s been fully explained in advance & quibbles about paying. Oh, & they all seem to want a discount for cash.

What's irony when your pipes burst?

I hope my children both attend university; then they'll be able to afford 50k extensions.

Don't count on it.

Then you do understand OP - but I'd say that you are in the minority.

I'm also self-employed and spend a lot of time discussing what people want - for nothing. I now rarely bother with people who do that.

(I once spent weeks including driving 80 miles to meet a prospective client, quoting and re-quoting only to be told that she had changed her mind!).

If I work with businesses direct I quote and they say yes or no - and it is a long-ish contract - usually!!

Although I haven't gained financially from my degree, my sibling has. It's just worth making sure trades aren't discounted for kids as they probably have been in the past. Just as its important they have access to higher education if they want it.

Exactly AlexanderHamilton exactly!

I don't want my dc to go into the trades. We have family who have worked as joiners, plasterers etc and it’s OK when you’re young but as you get older it’s crippling work. The pay is not amazing either.

Like the principle, but if DS did want to do a trade, I think I'd also look to see if there are any courses around to teach you how to be an effective self-employed business person as well, and hope that it included skills of communication, assertion, and self-esteem! You do need those skills if you're going to be self employed, I think, and the lovely general builder we used to use, last time I saw him, looked like he was heading for a breakdown. He was the kindest and most trustworthy man on the planet, but just so chaotic, his business was in a terrible tailspin. Combination of undercharging and spending too long on jobs, fixing mistakes by the people he hired who were never very good, getting delayed on other jobs. Not everyone's cut out for working for themselves, I think.

Larlarland agreed that it is difficult in the longer term.

I hope my children both attend university; then they'll be able to afford 50k extensions.

And I have a first class undergraduate degree and a masters degree.

I'd really like to see decent apprenticeships within trades (and other jobs) where young people get nationally recognised qualifications that are a bit more involved than ticking boxes as I've seen on some NVQs. I know some like electricians can do this. However, they also need to learn how to run a business, how to do accounts and HR regs. I see far too many self-employed people not maximising their profits imply because they don't know how to plan and budget.

I taught TEFL for a short while and taught some Swiss students aged around 18 and 19. I was intrigued why they were doing this quite advanced English course and wondered if they were university students. Nope, they were apprentices learning to be electricians, engineers, mechanics and English was a required part of the course. I'd be surprised if our apprenticeships were so stringent.

My dh is a plumber [we've had our own business], he was adamant he didn't want our ds's being plumbers if they had the brains to get to university and achieve more.

Yes it's a trade and when the times are good it brings in a decent wage but it's not as easy as ' train to be a plumber' and you'll make a shed load of money.

If anyone has a child interested in trades, get them to look into bricklaying as a career. I work in new build house sales and we have a serious shortage of bricklayers at the moment. The company I work for are offering 40k plus benefits to anyone experienced for a 7.30-3 working day Mon-Fri. That's twice what I'm paid.

At the moment we have an abundance of people educated to degree level, yet a serious lack of tradespeople. So much so that 'graduate' jobs in major cities start at as little as 15k. Once you've bought a season transport ticket and work clothes etc you aren't making much at all. Wish I'd gone down the trade route myself, would love to be a plasterer!

The really wealthy builders I know made money building and selling their own homes or subcontracting, not everyone is cut out for that. A business course or degree and trade would be a good plan. My dh could make more but isn't really cut out for that side of things. I have offered my services, my degree is in marketing, but he's not playing

It’s hard to get tradesman in for minor jobs. You could look at foreign skilled workers for smaller jobs but anything that needs certifying is a struggle.
On the other hand if you’re self employed or on a daily rate paid by a builder, you just need one long term illness and you can’t feed your family. (Unless you have savings.)
Also I think it wears your body down quicker (not our builders, they didn’t start work before nine, one hour lunchbreak, packed up by 4. But the guy who out our flooring down in a weekend and was here by 8 in the morning and left at 7pm.)
If you manage to find someone to the the small job they’re also taking the piss by giving you a ridiculous quote. (I just had someone in wanting £300 for a 3sqm tiling job with the tiles supplied by me.)

RedPanda Not sure bricklaying is a good one, there are now machines for that.... literally doing the brickwork. Crazy.

My DC are all fairly young but none of them are particularly practical like me so I can’t see a trade going down too well.

My DM trained to be a hairdresser after leaving school and even now she does a few relatives and friends hair on the side. It can be useful to have but I’m so impractical I can barely change a lightbulb so .

We do need decent apprenticeships - I also worked with swiss and German apprentices and agree with what gallicgirl has said.

And the small business skills that Dolores mentions are absolutely crucial - especially now with the level of admin and legal stuff required to run a business.

And yes - my lovely reliable (poor) plumber has finally given up at sixty as his knees and shoulders are absolutely wrecked.

Sometimes the attitude towards tradespeople, (and small cafe owners "who charge £3 for a teabag and hot water!!") is almost Victorian. They should be grateful to work for us for what we think they should be paid and they must be "happy" without the stress that all the rich people have.

(Not you OP nor other posters on this thread but I have seen it so very often on MN and amongst people I know.)

The trade bit is the easy bit - it is the rest that is a nightmare

Exactly this. DH has taken over running the business (domestic heating engineers) from his dad as his dad has now retired. DH had always done some admin but it's a real struggle to juggle everything. He's in a constant state of stress worrying in case he's made a mistake on the VAT return/errors on the accounting system on top of returning calls and chasing up unpaid bills. I do some but this responsibility of the other stuff is where the stress is for him.

Plus some trades can be very hard on the body - joints and especially knees.

He does love problem solving and fixing boilers that BG others have deemed irreparable so it's not all doom and gloom.

I'm hoping my 4 find something else they'd rather do though.

Imagine if all doctors, nurses and teachers had been forced to do the same by their parents, and then after the years of learning their trade had lost their passion for their degree subject
Then they’d be in well paid jobs with plenty of work, instead of being underpaid and screwed over by the government!