Tipping is not the done thing.

[Lyndaishistory]

You are not expected to tip in the UK! I'm not sure why some people think otherwise.
I would only tip if service was above and beyond but it is not an expectation and I wouldn't "cave" if it was crap service.

Husband and I had a rubbish meal at a well known resturant chain for our anniversary. I complained at the time but nothing was done about it.
Left husband to pay the bill and he tipped them. Bloody hell, I want my fiver back!
Seriously considering LTB over this.

I've worked retail and waitressing and I wouldn't say either was "harder", and the only one I've had to clean up other people's excrement in was retail.
I got more tips waitressing (probably about 50% of people, but I'm not in the UK) but I didn't work harder or do a better job. From my personal experience customers treat retail staff a lot worse, and I very rarely get offered tips (probably about twice in the 3 years I've worked in retail) which I can't accept anyways. Regular customers tend to bring chocolates in at Christmas, which we're not really supposed to accept either, but if we don't they just leave them on the counter and walk out so we might as well .
I'm not rushing out to get a waitressing job in order to get all your generous £1 tips because I much prefer working in retail. Just like waiting staff aren't rushing to take retail jobs to get away from their abysmal conditions, because there are other things about the job they enjoy.
If you're supposed to tip waiting staff because they expect it and have budgeted for it, then really that puts them above minimum wage doesn't it? So why would a minimum wage worker ever tip someone making more than them? I really am failing to see the logic in that.
Oh and care workers should just be paid more IMO.

I've been going to a bistro for years for my morning cappuccino. The staff are great, very friendly, always smiling and love to chat. It's one of the main reasons I go. However they do not get the tips left in the tip tray. The owner keeps them. (twat)
So I tip the staff personally. Tipping staff personally is something I've always done. If I'm out in a restaurant and there is service charge added I always ask the staff if they get their share.
Bad service gets nothing mainly because they have spoilt my evening by their attitude.
Food is a management problem and should be addressed to them directly.

So what's this "above and beyond" that would make you inclined to prise open your wallet and leave a tip or a bigger tip? Tuck your napkin in? Cut your meat up? Bow and kiss your hand? I don't get it.

From the point of view of someone in the industry, it's anything that your job title doesn't strictly encompass, that you do to help the customer to ensure they enjoy themselves. Something that you wouldn't expect as a customer but happens anyway. Examples I've had would be -
Speaking with the chef to make something that's not on the menu, but is possible to make with the stock we hold, for a child who's a fussy eater and also once for a lady suffering morning sickness. It's not always possible to do that, and of course small additions or things slightly changed are expected but arranging a meal that's not actually on the menu, that takes some negotiations with the chef!
I've pushed fractious babies round in prams so a parent on their own can at least eat, if not in peace!
Table service for drinks when it's quiet enough when it's not offered as part of the service.
Held dogs while people go to the loo.
Also diffusing situations that could potentially be an issue. Running children, getting in everyone's way and on everyone's nerves - instead of just asking parents to control their children and demanding they behave appropriately, I have cleared an area, printed children's activities off the computer and set them on with that and other games/toys we have, making it seem like a special thing for them. That's not my job, to entertain other people's children, I could just plonk a colouring book in front of them and ask the parents to keep their children under control.
I've even gone to the local shop to get some nappies for a guest who ran out.
That kind of thing I'd consider above and beyond, and obviously the opportunity to do things like that don't always present themselves, because some guests don't need it. I try and give great service to everyone, and when someone needs it, go above and beyond. In some of those examples I've been tipped, and some not, makes no difference to how I'd respond next time.

@sweetsomethings

2up exaclty those saying working waiting tables is harder than retail etc . Just isn’t true ( obviously haven’t woke up at 2am to work a Next sale on Boxing Day) 😂

Done both and care, and honestly all 3 are on par for how hard you work, how you get treated and the conditions. I prefer hospitality, not because of the tips but because I just enjoy it more. And all 3 don't tend to pay enhanced pay for anything (bank and public hols etc) and no, I haven't got up at 2am to work the Boxing Day sale - but then I'm usually clearing up still after a Christmas night bash at 2am on Boxing Day

Due to caring responsibilities I can't work - I am educated to post-graduate (masters) level but only get carer's allowance, not paid at the level of minimum wage. £5 represents a substantial percentage of my monthly income. I would miss it. But sometimes I want to get out of the house and eat a meal that I haven't cooked. We don't go anywhere 'posh' or expensive (even though I would love to) because I can't get/afford carers/sitters for ASD teens and the menu etc would be a nightmare if they were present.

It is bizarre that people who desperately need a break/night out but earn minimum wage or less should feel pressured to adopt middle class etiquette (lest they appear rude) and be shamed into pretending that they are wealthy enough to tip other minimum wage workers - even if they are students, don't have dependents and can afford to use tips as a saving fund.

How can posters be so concerned about the hardships of servers but not of others like carers? Is that empathy or snobbery?

I almost always tip at least 10% in a restaurant. I would only not tip if the service was exceptionally bad, which is very rare. Every I ever go out with also assumes we will tip. Yes I think it is an expectation.

Of course if service is included then I don't tip. That does seem to be a bit more common these days, especially in London.

I always tip in restaurants - 10% rounded up to the pound. The only time I haven't was in a restaurant where the waitress rather sneakily upsold to me. I called the manager and told her I didn't like that, and not only did I not tip, but I refused the pay the service charge. Apart from that, I would only leave no tip if the service was substandard, and in that case I'd probably complain about the meal.

I tip my barber and restaurant delivery drivers a couple of quid. I don't tip retail workers because the procedure for doing so - they'd probably think I was mad if I handed over some extra cash when buying something and also the interaction with them is so short.

I think it's very rude and socially inept not to tip after a satisfactory meal. I've read on here about people leaving 5p tips, which is even more insulting to the waiter.

Interesting. I have two jobs one public sector and the other wAitressing. No previous experience however I in the main enjoy it. It’s hard work on a hot summers night dealing with over 250 guests. I always tip at least 10% have been brought up tobe that way. From the other side poor service isn’t always the fault of your server. Could be kitchen, chef, management. It’s the one profession however where I have had the occasional person look down their nose at me, snotty rude arrogant people. Amazingly we aren’t allowed to be as rude to them as some have been to me! It’s also much more hard work serving large tables they are more demanding. It’s minimum wage and tips help massively, we could manage without the job but in refurbishing our house means less debt to pay back.

People think nothing of spending 400/500 on a meal but can’t between 15 people leave anything for the two waiting staff? It’s happened plenty of times and it’s terribkr manners

Buswanker that does not sound like much fun at all . Not sure who I would rath deal with drunk people or people who push kids out the way to get a half price top😂 Both as bad as each other I guess .

Sorry badlad but not leaving a tip when you can’t afford it isn’t rude. Making a mess of the table is rude, talking down to staff is rude. Letting your child leave a mess on the table is rude. Going out for a meal not leaving a mess and saying thank you before you leave is hardly rude.

You aren't the final authority of what's rude and what isn't, sweetsomethings. I think not tipping (assuming a decent meal and service in a restaurant) is rude. I accept that some people disagree but that does not make me wrong.

Retail isn't necessarily a shorter interaction. DP used to work in a fairly high end bike shop where he would help customers buy bikes and accessories costing thousands, and could take half an hour to an hour to sort all the options, custom fit, sort finance or bike to work etc etc.

He would then build the bike and then do a follow up satisfaction/service call. All for a few pence an hour more than NMW. One or two customers a year would bring in a box of beer to show appreciation, but apart from that, zero tips. But apparently, carrying plates, upselling and then upselling again (all that do you want more drinks, extra sides etc isn't service, it's upselling) and being generally pleasant is worthy of 10% extra or else the customer is mean .

That's hardly what most people imagine when they hear the word "retail", though, Barbara.

I suppose the nearest I've ever come to that is buying a new car, when the salesman did spend quite a lot of time with me, although he didn't build the car, of course. I have never tipped a car salesman because, as I mentioned, there was no obvious procedure for it, and probably because I presumed he was on commission.

That’s fine badlad if you choose to believe that those who have less money are rude as they can’t affod to just give it away that’s your choice . Just remember none of us know what the future holds are karma is a bitch

That you Barbara that sums up exaclty my day to day work in Retail. I can spend up to an hour with certain customers even helping them in and out of clothes . Looking after their kids while they try stuff on etc

That’s fine badlad if you choose to believe that those who have less money are rude as they can’t affod to just give it away that’s your choice . Just remember none of us know what the future holds are karma is a bitch

It's clear from this thread that for many non-tippers that the reason they don't tip has nothing to do with being unable to afford it.

I think that AHardMan would be successful anywhere doing anything because they seem extremely inventive and perceptive at providing excellent customer service.

I'm not moved by posters saying that tips help bring their debts down. Well quite. It would help anybody, wouldn't it?

I don't want overly attentive table-service. The job is what it is and the server gets paid to do it. I don't want them to do anything else and there's a limit to what a server can earn. I can't earn more in my role than I do, however well I do it. What's the difference?

The tipping culture is outdated now that NMW is established. Just because waiting staff and some people think that it's the 'done thing' doesn't make it so and some of us do not see fairness in tipping for some NMW workers over and above others (who would not be able to receive a tip).

Everybody should do what they want to do with this, without making nasty comments about what other people do. I don't care what anybody else does about tipping and I won't be influenced just because some internet randoms try to dictate 'the done thing'. Nobody's an arbiter of this, as much as they believe they are. Leave others to determine their own method and get on with you own.

Really badlad we will agree to disagree cause most of what I’ve seen on this thread are other people on NMW or benefits that are saying they don’t tip as they simply don’t have it .

Really badlad we will agree to disagree cause most of what I’ve seen on this thread are other people on NMW or benefits that are saying they don’t tip as they simply don’t have it .

Agreeing to disagree is fine with me, although I will point to the post just before you wrote that, which makes no reference to being unable to afford it.

And I will point out my other posts on this thread where have I have repeatedly said that as a NMW worker I can’t afford to tip others.

None of this is relevant though is it - what other people doing other jobs get paid? David beckham gets more than the PM. Advertising brand managers get more than palliative care nurses. You tip when you have a meal out. You can choose not to but the majority will cringe on your behalf. You won't change my mind on this.

Have never and would never go on a cruise so can't comment. Middle class professional Australians that I socialised with always tipped in restaurants - as did everybody else I have ever known. Mn is eye opening at times.

Everybody should do what they want to do with this, without making nasty comments about what other people do.

This ^

I guess I'm lucky that I said "many non-tippers" then, and not "every non-tipper, without a single exception".

@sweet.
Agreed, not tipping if you're earning a good wage and have had awesome services is a bit rude but your choice and I don't judge you.

Not tipping because you can't afford it, perfectly fine in my books as I do it.
If me and my kids go out, we normally have cheap 2 for 10 deals, and kids meals etc, and our bill comes up to around £25 at a cheap restaurant. 20% tip is a fiver and is is 10% of my weekly shop etc.