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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

How could they do this?

220 replies

brizzledrizzle · 02/08/2018 07:23

You're on the verge of losing everything - but you don’t understand why http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/stories-42789610

This should not be allowed to happen, this is supposed to be a civilised country. How could they do this to somebody Sad

OP posts:
CuriousaboutSamphire · 03/08/2018 08:48

Well, I was entitled to JSA, as I was not working.

Because I was on JSA I was entitled to apply for NEA.

To get NEA you have to do some things before you start to receive the stepped NEA payments, to do which you have to be on JSA. There is a built in overlap, when you see the NEA advisor and he assesses your business idea. You can't go to them without being on JSA and you can't get off JSA without his assessment.This can take up to 6 weeks.

But the Job Coaches don't understand and therefore don't look for the button they should be pressing. It's an issue with the training or the system. One I know many people encounter when trying legitimately to move from JSA to NEA.

I did nothing underhand or even a tiny bit dodgy. I simply tried to use the system as it is advertised.

YeTalkShiteHen · 03/08/2018 08:51

I did nothing underhand or even a tiny bit dodgy. I simply tried to use the system as it is advertised.

I know what you’re trying to say, BIL did it too and it was pretty hard going to get anyone to understand. The jobcentre is supposed to actively support setting up your own business because it’s getting a job!

flyingpigsinclover · 03/08/2018 08:53

None of this surprises me. I have an application in for student finance at the moment and they have badly messed it up and have admitted that they made a mistake and have apologised but have said that they can't (won't) fix it and that I will not be able to get any student finance as a result of their mistake. They have ignored a letter from my MP and are refusing to help.

PerfectlySymmetricalButtocks · 03/08/2018 08:55

Birdsgottafly when my older 2 were small, we were on Family Credit (now Working Tax Credit). XH got a job that took us over the limit to get benefits. We suddenly had to pay rent, glasses, dental treatment, prescriptions for XH's inhaler, we were skint. We were living on Marmite and toast. It's not noble at all, the amount you'd have to earn would be extortionate.

user546425732 · 03/08/2018 09:16

But you were using jsa to fund you as you set up a business samphire, I think that’s what some people were uncomfortable about.

A business is still a job. It's no different to people using JSA to buy a suit for an interview, bus/train fares or petrol money for interviews surely?

YeTalkShiteHen · 03/08/2018 09:24

But you were using jsa to fund you as you set up a business samphire, I think that’s what some people were uncomfortable about

People who have absolutely no idea how the system works and therefore shouldn’t be making stupid statements about something they have no knowledge of beyond channel 5 and the DM

ChopChipCookies · 03/08/2018 09:30

@SugarIsAmazing thank you for the info... especially as I was being facetious...at best (Sorry Blush)

£1500 is indeed a big income after housing. Considerably more than I have had with 2 children. Of course I have no.idea how much it costs to keep six children but yes I can see how you did manage well on that.

Neshoma · 03/08/2018 10:03

YeTalkShiteHen You seem to be dictating what posters write. Everyone is entitled to their opinions. You seem to be stifling debate and are coming across quite rude. It may be you who is unaware of how the system works.

Please let everyone have their say.

YeTalkShiteHen · 03/08/2018 10:04

I’m not dictating Neshoma, opinions are fine, deliberate or unintentional bullshit is not. HTH.

SugarIsAmazing · 03/08/2018 10:11

@ChopChip I was actually embarrassed about the amount I received and didn't tell people in real life!

Becca19962014 · 03/08/2018 10:56

delibrate or unintentional bullshit

You sound like the back of my ESA50 form - you will be prosecuted for all errors including those made unintentionally!

I speak from my personal experiences or those which I've seen others go through which are neither.

JSA can be claimed to follow on to other things, but you are expected to be continuing to look for other work as well and if it comes up expected to take it but that depends on the advisor (as a lot of things do) some will be lax about the commitment to look for work and not put you forward for random work or interviews or courses, but some advisors won't, some people are "randomly" (I put quotation marks as I've been randomly selected for this three times I've claimed JSA and have suspicions it's not random at all) and been pushed to find work And prove I've spent full time working hours looking for work, even when I had a start date and had a couple of weeks to wait they were still trying to send me on courses and arrange interviews - aside from not helping me, more importantly it stopped someone who really needed those courses and interviews from getting the chance. I wasn't going to give up a lectureship because they'd got me a job stacking shelves in Safeway (which I was told to do instead as it started before my lectureship did) - yes it was a long time ago!

My point is it shouldn't vary. Individuals shouldn't be scapegoats.

My local bus service (we're talking a couple a day if the company can be bothered) has massive posters on it about reporting benefit fraud and there's a picture of a man in a wheelchair and then another picture of him climbing a ladder and carrying shopping. I felt really uncomfortable and afraid when I saw it, not because I commit fraud, but because I've been reported after someone saw me buying food and because of the looks I was getting meant I felt threatened. They could have been being sympathetic I don't know, but I that's how I felt because of that poster.

Someone said on the last page that sometimes claims when genuine are straightforward so people shouldn't be put off claiming (paraphrasing) the problem is the sometimes shouldn't be there. It should be rarely people have problems so shouldn't be put off.

Graphista · 03/08/2018 11:12

Oh wow! So very obvious the posters who've never used the benefits system or certainly not recently.

15 years ago I would not have imagined I'd be in the situation I am now. All it takes is an accident, sudden illness or bereavement and you can be in deep shit!

Claimants are being told even have it in writing their housing benefit is being paid straight to their landlord only to discover when they receive an eviction notice it hasn't been and dwp start back pedalling.

"Just phone in if you can't make appointment" there's very few people manning the phones it can take several days to get through to someone even if calling repeatedly.

Even when claimants are providing medical evidence of why they couldn't attend they're being sanctioned. Many of these sanctions are being overturned on appeal BUT the appeals take MONTHS so by that point they can easily be homeless.

Claimants are sanctioned wrongly or for the most petty nonsense but if dwp cocks up you'll wait till hell freezes over for an acknowledgement let alone an apology!

Assessors are outright lying about claimants abilities - been proven several times.

"Benefits aren't that hard to claim" when did you last claim? Have you a mh condition or learning disability? You're clearly literate which gives you a boost compared to many.

"The papers, blogs, forums, social media, are all FULL of examples such as the miscarriage one where people have been sanctioned for ridiculous reasons." Yep! On a FB page I'm on this past week 2 members sanctioned - one was in a&e being treated for a broken arm, one was unconscious following a heart attack when their appointment times were.

There's numerous posts by people needing to inform dwp they can't attend for legitimate reasons but they cannot get through on phone or online (online system regularly crashes too) asking if anyone knows alternative numbers which they don't because they keep the phone numbers for the various offices very well hidden.

The majority of claims denied for sickness/disability are overturned on appeal.

I've got 2 degrees, many years working with computers and even I won't even attempt to fill in the forms myself I always after the first time (of being denied my claim which was then overturned on appeal) go to experts with experience in how the current system is working for help to fill in the forms and whatever else is necessary. These services are not advertised and they're certainly not signposted to people by dwp ever!

AND these services whether provided by the council and paid for or through charities are being cut to the bone so they're struggling to provide enough support to all who needs them.

I've a friend works in local dwp, UC is a completely new set of software, legislation and umpteen forms - they've had 2 hours training she herself admits she hasn't a clue how it works and is constantly having to contact the in-house information providers and she's having as much difficulty getting replies as claimants are.

"These things are explained over and over again to people" except they're not!

I had a letter recently that was so full of double negatives and appalling grammar and words I'm not even sure are real I with a degree in english couldn't understand it!! When I called the Person I spoke to was tearing their hair out because that was all they'd dealt with for DAYS was people calling in to have that letter explained to them!

Recently dwp have had to admit/confirm 1/5 deaths of claimants are suicides likely linked to issues with claiming. And as Becca says that DOESN'T include those who had a history of mental illness prior to claiming.

Yes yes yes to the gut wrenching dread felt when the postman calls.

"It's an ideological campaign against the poor, the ill, the dysfunctional." Yes!

And all this before you even consider the bonkers premise that this is to get people back into work WHEN THERE AREN'T ENOUGH JOBS AND THEY'RE DOING NOTHING TO CREATE ANY!

crunchymint · 03/08/2018 14:21

Most people on JSA no longer have advisors. They see a different person every time whose role is to look at evidence provided that enough jobs have been applied for.

crunchymint · 03/08/2018 14:22

Sugar I get £73.10 a week.

YeTalkShiteHen · 03/08/2018 14:26

You sound like the back of my ESA50 form - you will be prosecuted for all errors including those made unintentionally

I was defending you Becca!

Becca19962014 · 03/08/2018 14:48

I know. I'm sorry. I really badly worded that! It was supposed to be sarcastic!! And the rest was referring to other things and, should have been a separate post.

YeTalkShiteHen · 03/08/2018 14:55

I badly worded my reply, so I think we’re quits Wink sorry for the misunderstanding Smile

Becca19962014 · 03/08/2018 15:03

yetalk it's fine Smile

graphista I have massive issues with post now, literal terror of the postman bringing another form or anything to do with the dwp, despite being told to send everything to my social worker they don't. Luckily my postman is lovely and his wife is disabled so he understands.

I do think it's important people tell their whole story online and not just bits because they can be twisted so easily.

coolncalm · 03/08/2018 23:23

It's upsetting to think of people living in fear of the postman. What an evil system, to have thousands of decent hard working people having to go through all the fear and panic that UC causes.Only the tories could be so cruel and callous. What kind of country are they trying to create? It's an ill thought out, immoral, obscenity and i hope it backfires spectacularly.

LeftRightCentre · 03/08/2018 23:33

YANBU

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