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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to object to child maintenance payments if I can't afford them

96 replies

steve314 · 01/08/2018 16:46

Hello,

I'm new here and would appreciate some honest opinions about my situation.

I am a father of two boys aged 12 and 10. About 3 years ago I received an anonymous email from somebody who said they were a former work-make of my ex-partner. The email told me that she had started a new relationship. When we discussed it she said that it was true and suggested that we stay living together but have separate relationships. I didn't think that this would work and since she was unwilling to move out of the family home I concluded that I had to do so.

I moved out and rented a place big enough that our two boys could live part of each week with me and part at the family home. For the past 3 years they have lived with me weekends and some holidays and with their mother for the rest of the time. About 2 1/2 days of each week with me, on average. I pay rent (£700 per month) on my house and mortgage interest (£260 per month) on the family house. My ex partner pays £200 per month off the mortgage capital and receives child tax credit and child benefit. She started a self-employed business a few years ago but does not yet make a significant income from it. (Less than minimum wage.) As a result of this she also receives working tax credit.

A little while ago she decided to approach the Child Maintenance Service to seek monthly maintenance payments from me. First of all they told me that I should be paying about £500 per month. This was then reduced to about £360 per month. If I do not arrange to make the payments voluntarily they will be deducted from my salary.

My problem with this is that my take-home pay of just over £2000 per month means that I would not be able to pay it and also pay rent, mortgage interest, household expenses and all of the expenses of having a family that I pay now, such as food, clothes, birthdays, holidays, pocket money etc for the kids. I want to be stay involved in my children's lives like this. But if I'm force to pay this money I won't be able to afford to pay the rent so I won't have anywhere to live with my kids. Since I've not been living in the family home for 3 years my ex now strongly opposed me moving back in, so I can no longer live with them there.

I love supporting and caring for my kids both financially and emotionally but it seems to me that these forced payments work against that by forcing me to change my relationship with them from one in which I live with them and care for them part of the week to one in which I make anonymous payments of money each month.

Has anybody here, either a mother or a father, had a similar experience and come to a similar conclusion? Does anybody think I've got something wrong or am being unreasonable?

Thanks,

Steve

OP posts:
PanPanPanPing · 01/08/2018 17:52

Takfujimoto, sorry, the point I was trying to make was that as a 'together family' living in the same house, the expenses can work out far less than if the two parents are living separately, because they've split/getting divorced. But now each of them are taking on more expenses because they're living separately.

OP, listen to Xenia, she knows what she's talking about!!

TheBlueDot · 01/08/2018 17:58

Have you got an agreement on how the equity for the house will be split on sale?

You need to start on sorting out finances, including you no longer paying the mortgage interest. I think you will have to accept taking a smaller proportion of any equity if your ex-DP reduced her work hours etc to look after the children - she'll take much longer to get back to full time earning as she appears to have the children more in the working week than you do.

LannieDuck · 01/08/2018 17:58

Happygoldfish

I don't think the house needs to be sold, OP just needs to change the purpose of his payment.

OP can take the £260 he's paying to cover her mortgage, top it up appropriately, and transfer it as his child maintenance payment. His ex can then take £260 of it and pay the mortgage herself.

I'm not quite sure of his earlier statement that he can't stop the mortgage company taking money from his account. I can't imagine that's true if his ex starts paying from her account instead?

ohreallyohreallyoh · 01/08/2018 18:03

you could be already paying £260 child maintenance in your contributions to their family home? Would the government accept that

No. If he were paying her rent or mortgage on a house he had no interest in then yes. But as it stands, he will benefit from the sale of the house - which ism or quite the same as supporting your children legally.

PurpleArmy · 01/08/2018 18:28

This seems so unfair. Ex had the Affair, you had to move out. Confused

Could you have the children half the time and then you don't have to pay maintenance do you? Or pay for the house? Or am I totally clueless?

Fluffy475 · 01/08/2018 18:29

When my ex and I split he paid his maintenance against the mortgage as he was frightened I was going to screw him out of his half of it when we came to sell.

When the children are under 18, my understanding is your ex cannot be forced to sell the property if she cannot afford to live elsewhere. If she didn't keep up payments, however, and the mortgage defaulted you would be just as liable as she was.

I think you need to stop paying towards a house you're not living in and then pay the maintenance payment. That is the key one and the one that will be communicated to your kids. I would then get some legal advice on exactly where you stand in terms of the property so that you can get something in place they firstly gives security to your boys but then helps both you and your ex live sensibly

Firesuit · 01/08/2018 18:33

I've not had a joint mortgage, but I assume that both parties are equally liable for paying it, there's no reason that the money has to come from him.

So, he tells ex and lender that he will no longer be making payments, due to new CMS obligation, and that she will have to make payments if it's not to fall into arrears. He then starts making payments of either mortgage or child-support amount, whichever is higher, to ex.

If she doesn't want the house repossesed, Ex pays the mortgage, which she will have more than enough money to do out of what he pays her.

Firesuit · 01/08/2018 18:37

Possibly the mortgage could switch to interest-only, so that the Ex doesn't resent funding his asset.

Powerless · 01/08/2018 18:51

@MadeForThis False. Even if 50/50, maintenance still needs to be paid, just at a reduced rate.

HOWEVER, OP & EW do not have 50/50 care. He just has them on weekends and holidays

Firesuit · 01/08/2018 18:54

Even if 50/50, maintenance still needs to be paid, just at a reduced rate.

Do you toss a coin to decide which one pays the other?

parklives · 01/08/2018 18:57

I was assuming in my earlier post that the op was contributing £260 at the moment to the household as maintenance.
He is describing it as a mortgage interest payment.
I don't think you get to dictate where your child support goes, it's not ring-fenced in this way.
I was assuming the op stopped gaining capital gains on the house when he moved out, even though they haven't got a formal split.

My question to the op is, do you think paying £360 pm for someone to house/clothe/feed/care for you children enough? I know you have the children too, but much less than 50% if I understand it correctly.

Why, if you thought you payment of £260 pm went on mortgage loan interest you didn't worry about the food/heat etc your children might need too? Were you just paying that £260 because you think you are still gaining value in house price rises?
Nice Dad Hmm

csigeek · 01/08/2018 19:02

If you need to pay £360 and you're paying £260 off the Mortgage then you either continue and pay an additional £100 or stop paying the mortgage, sell up and split the equity or whatever arrangement and pay the total of £360.
She made her bed she needs to lie in it.
Do your csa calculation yourself on their website calculator. Don't forget that this should take into account pension contributions you make and so the salary amount it uses it post pension deductions as they may not have taken that into account.

FiestaThenSiesta · 01/08/2018 19:06

Just another posted adding OF COURSE YOU CAN FORCE THE SALE OF THE MARITAL HOUSE

It’s common. Just read the many threads on here where a divorcing mum has to downscale to a small house because the husband has forced a sale of the marital home because neither of them can afford to keep it alone.

MissyMoooo · 01/08/2018 19:11

Hey! I used to work for CMS, you need to stop paying the mortgage. If you can't stop paying the mortgage you need to apply for a 'variation' to have the money you pay for her mortgage taken into account. You also need to make sure they have taken your Shared Care arrangements into account when making their calculation. I can tell you that if you DON'T pay what they have assessed voluntarily they WILL arrest your wages. Good luck!!

MissyMoooo · 01/08/2018 19:13

@Firesuit if it's 50/50 they both claim against each other

zsazsajuju · 01/08/2018 19:17

If you jointly own house and she refuses to buy you out or sell you can make an application for division and sale to the court. Or tell her you will move back in or stop paying.

Pickleypickles · 01/08/2018 19:19

PP are right if you pay £260 for her mortgage you only need to pay another £100 and you will meet the requirements of CMS.

spottybetty · 01/08/2018 19:24

If your ex refuses to agree to sell the house, there is something you can do:

In the case of one person being the owner of the property and the other withholding permission to sell, then the courts can allow the sale under certain circumstances. In essence, these are if one party is unable to sign for medical reasons, if one party has vanished and can’t be found, or if the court believes that permission in being unreasonably withheld.

from www.recentlyseparated.co.uk/selling-the-jointly-owned-home.html

This happened to a friend of mine recently. His ex left him and was being completely unreasonable. He had to sell the family house to downsize and a court agreed he didn't need her permission to sell it.

RomanyRoots · 01/08/2018 19:30

Sell the house and both move on, you can't really consider yourselves x's until you move on.
You can't do this whilst paying for everything.
get it sorted in the courts, if you haven't already.

flamingofridays · 01/08/2018 19:31

if it's 50/50 they both claim against each other
Or if they've half a brain between them nobody pays anyone

category12 · 01/08/2018 19:39

You need to sort out the house.

Missingstreetlife · 01/08/2018 19:41

So the mortgage is still in joint names? Go interest only and stop paying. Split the property when last child finishes education. Or go to court for a proper division of assets

lazyminimoo · 01/08/2018 19:43

what if you had your kids an extra day a week, then noone should need to pay maintenance to anyone

FabulouslyGlamorousFerret · 01/08/2018 19:46

What a quandary - I hope you get sorted OP

NeedsAsockamnesty · 01/08/2018 19:51

Was your CMS reduction as a result of obtaining a variation on the grounds that your paying the mortgage interest for a property she lives in?