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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think this is a bit off....But not sure why.

461 replies

Shortstuff08 · 30/07/2018 15:33

So, I had to go get the morning after pill today. I went to a high street retailer that has a pharmacy. They had a sign saying they provided it.

The woman behind the counter asked me if I was wanting the free one or to pay for it. I said that I assumed I would have to pay. She went away and came back and said they didn't provide the free one. I said that was fine and she told me that the Pharmacist would come our to see me in minute. A man approached me and asked if I was waiting. He then told me that he 'couldn't' provide MAP. I asked if they didn't have any and he said 'no, we do, but I can't give it'

Fair enough, I went to another high street store. Spoke to the Pharmacist there, she asked me a few questions about medication I am on and the gave me it. I said I was relieved she could as the other store couldn't give me it and thought I would spend all day looking for somewhere. She asked me where I had been and then said that some pharmacists, don't give it out due to religious purposes.

I don't think that's ok. If it's your job, how can you refuse on religious grounds? Or are some Pharmacists not able to administer it? Or am I being an arse in thinking that you should just do your job?

OP posts:
ItchyBites · 30/07/2018 17:56

Our family GP refused to refer my dad for a vasectomy due to his religious views (he was Catholic), and that was 30+ years ago, so I don't think that refusing to do your job on religious grounds is anything particularly new. However, I thought that there were laws/regulations to prevent this from happening, duty to dispense or something like that. It is entirely possible that the other pharmacist spoke out of turn, and rather than religious reasons, there may well have been other perfectly valid reasons why the pharmacist was unable to dispense the MAP.

Jimdandy · 30/07/2018 17:57

Its not ok in my book. If you can’t perform your job due to your religious beliefs then find another career. The same way ladies of a certain faith wouldn’t become strippers, yes thisnexample is more extreme but the principle is the same.

THEsonofaBITCH · 30/07/2018 17:59

So if I were a Christian Scientist and got hired in a pharmacy could I just not do anything as all medical intervention for any reason is against my beliefs? Holy vacation Batman! Grin
Its nuts and its impossible to draw a line on beliefs. If you believe that strongly, get another job elsewhere. (I'm not saying that's what happened but responding to other posters who say its okay not to do your job if it conflicts with your beliefs - totally nuts!).

FishingIsNotASport · 30/07/2018 17:59

This is discrimination pure and simple. How come Christian B&B owners are not allowed to refuse unmarried couples or gay couples to stay at their premises, but this pharmacist can refuse you a service he provides? If you provide a service to the public, you cannot discriminate against those who seek out your service on the grounds of race, gender, religion, age, culture, sexual orientation.

SimonBridges · 30/07/2018 17:59

so I don't think that refusing to do your job on religious grounds is anything particularly new

It isn’t anything new. I’m amazed it happens still.

IDontEatFriedTurtle · 30/07/2018 18:01

I also struggle with the idea that so many apparently 'liberal' people think it's right to force others to act against their beliefs

Your religion ends with what you do to yourself.

Otherwise where does it stop?

Say you own a nursery and employ a male nursery assistant who says his belief is that women shouldn't be allowed to work, so he refuses to enable them by caring for their children. Fine?

A muslim gets a job in a non halal butchers. Can he refuse to sell the meat and keep his job?

Can the orthodox Jewish man refuse to sell clothes with mixed fibres to customers?

Froglette16 · 30/07/2018 18:01

This is awful. If people decide to work in a country where choice is legal, they shouldn’t be allowed to refuse your choice based on their own beliefs. Or am I BU?

ShapelyBingoWing · 30/07/2018 18:02

What I am wondering about is why, if they refuse to issue the pills, they stock them? Or does it depend on which pharmacist you meet on a particular day?

That's exactly what it will depend on. The dispensing person must be named on the PGD, a type of prescription that names the person giving the medication, who can't then delegate that task, rather than the person receiving it. It's the same way vaccines are prescribed. Bad scheduling, understaffing and staff sickness then all have an impact on whether or not that service can be provided, rather than presence of the drug itself.

WinnieFosterTether · 30/07/2018 18:04

Nobody is forcing a baby on you Simon. There are numerous pharmacies across every city. There are well woman clinics. There are GPs. There are family planning clinics. You're being obtuse.

sugarPlumFairly · 30/07/2018 18:05

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funinthesun18 · 30/07/2018 18:10

sugarPlumFairly

Of course it’s not ok. Confused

But how would have felt if you went to have your termination and someone refused to do it because they don’t believe in it?
It would beg the question, WHY are they in that job then in the first place? You would have had every right to have gone in there expecting the nurse or doctor to do exactly what you had booked. There are thousands of other jobs to do if it isn’t for them.
The man in the pharmacy is no different. The MAP is a medication and as a pharmacist it is part of his job to dispense medication. If he can’t cope with it then he knows where the door and the nearest job centre is.

SimonBridges · 30/07/2018 18:10

What if I was a worried 16 year old who could only get to the supermarket pharmacy? I might not have the money to get the bus into town? The knock back from ththe pharmacist might have knocked my confidence? It might have taken me a day to release that the MAP is an option and by the time I get the chance to get the bus into town it might be too late?

Yes as a grown up woman I can go to one of the number of other places that I could get it? As a frightened 16 year old I might not have those options. But it’s ok because someone didn’t have to compromise their beliefs.

SimonBridges · 30/07/2018 18:11

Nobody is forcing a baby on you Simon. There are numerous pharmacies across every city. There are well woman clinics. There are GPs. There are family planning clinics. You're being obtuse.

Also, not everyone lives in a city.

MarzipanFace · 30/07/2018 18:17

It's absolutely appalling.

ZaphodBeeblerox · 30/07/2018 18:17

But what if my made-up-mad-hatter belief system insists that xyz disease is god exercising her will. Can I then refuse to dispense all manner of drugs used to treat this disease? Can jehovah’s witnesses just stand at the counter refusing to dispense all medication? Why even take the job if your religious beliefs are so paramount? I’m from a minority (in the UK) religion myself and think of myself as relatively devout, but I only insist my religious rules are followed within the bounds of my home. (So no drinking or eating meat on religious days for example).

sugarPlumFairly · 30/07/2018 18:19

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funinthesun18 · 30/07/2018 18:21

An abortion Dr (I have no idea what their title is) and a pharmacist are not close to being comparable. I suspect the MAP is a tiny aspect of a pharmacists role. Surely you see the difference. Can you really not?

All I know is that they have a job to do, same as anyone else. They can’t pick and choose bits they don’t like. If I was a cleaner I would hate to clean poo out of a toilet but I couldn’t exactly refuse could I as it would be part of my job.

pigsDOfly · 30/07/2018 18:26

Utterly ludicrous that someone's religious beliefs can allow them to refuse other people treatment like this.

No one's asking them to take it.

It's available to buy and clearly this pharmacy stocks it. The person who is supposed to be there to do a job should not be allowed to arbitrarily decide whether or not the customers should be permitted to buy a perfectly legal product.

So what's their argument: you can't have it because I say so.

JacquesHammer · 30/07/2018 18:27

There are numerous pharmacies across every city. There are well woman clinics. There are GPs. There are family planning clinics. You're being obtuse

You’re being obtuse if you think everyone lives near a city!

sugarPlumFairly · 30/07/2018 18:29

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funinthesun18 · 30/07/2018 18:32

It's called reasonable adjustments and is the ultimate get-out clause.

Unless it’s for health and safety reasons (eg adjustments for someone who is injured or pregnant etc) then I think it’s a load of bull if I’m honest. Religious beliefs aren’t something you should be allowed to make adjustments for.

sugarPlumFairly · 30/07/2018 18:36

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funinthesun18 · 30/07/2018 18:38

Unfortunately.

Redrosebelle · 30/07/2018 18:39

I don’t think this is ok.
Could a Jehovah’s Witness dr refuse to prescribe a blood transfusion to a patient who was haemorrhaging?
I’m a nurse and we treat everyone - prisoners, convicted murderers, the lot.

NaomiNagata · 30/07/2018 18:41

@funinthesun18

People have every right to refuse to do something if it is against their beliefs, but still be able to function in their chosen career and be of benefit to people.

If there were no alternative, then allowing people the right to their beliefs would be impossible, but there are alternatives. This particular pharmacist handled it very badly though; he should have given a clear reason, whilst reasurring the customer that they behave every right to the medication and then given them directions to the nearest other pharmacies. Then, if it had been a vulnerable person, they'd have been reassured and encourages to go to the next one.

The pharmacist saying no isn't the problem, it's the way he did it that caused things to be awkward and may make someone think they're doing something wrong.

Everyone can refuse things to a point in their jobs; doesn't mean they can't perform all the other tasks.