To be fighting to help my friend *Possible Trigger warning...grooming*

[VeryConcernedFriend]

Ive NC as extremely outing. Posting for traffic, need urgent advice on benefits and housing. Going to try and keep it as succinct as possible.

Friend of mine is really having a tough time at the moment. Her partner was arrested after being caught in an online sting by a paedo hunting group. None of us had a clue what he was up to and she was devastated.

Her life has literally collapsed.

Not only is she dealing with what's happened but it's possible she could now lose her home. He was the main earner, she had a pt job. She's unfortunately now lost that as she simply couldn't cope with what had happened and didn't turn up for shifts for a week, tho she did let them know. Recent employment so no rights, and understands why she was let go. Now signed off sick with depression for a month.

Had WTC, assessed on the wage she had (about 100pw) plus CTC.

She had already put a claim in for HB and CTaxB before she lost the job.

Then phoned and explained that she had lost her job due to her ill health and was told to claim UC. Claim duly put in, while still trying to hold things together for her teenage daughter and DS19.

Eviction proceedings were triggered as she was 4 weeks behind with rent, due to all of the above.. they are due to issue a summons next week, according to them. And yes they are aware of some of the circumstances.

She has this week been told that she will get no HB and no CTaxB due to her DS19 working. So will get only Child Benefit and CTC under UC. Unsure yet about any other income element, and has been told to wait til 1st week August for decision.

DS19 refuses point blank to pay towards the rent or to move out to allow her to claim HB, despite knowing that eviction is likely.

She's now stuck. He won't move out, or pay anything yet they are including his income as household income. This has left her in a complete pickle, to say the least.

She is deep in depression, so no chance of working anytime soon and afaik cannot claim PIP for 3.months.

How can I help her? I find it so wrong that she basically has an unwanted houseguests whose income is being included despite it not benefiting the household. Can they disregard it? She has tried to get him to.leave but he won't. She has no energy left to fight him and he won't listen to anyone else.

Does he have any friends that could be spoken to and could in turn speak to him? Or a relative he respects? Surely he has to see sense!

Can we move away from the trope that all men are violent abusers and poor delicate women need protecting at all costs from that? Including getting other men to intimidate a teenager, ffs.

The OP has said that the son isn't being violent to his mum. It sounds more like he's angry and because he's young, those outbursts are probably things like punching walls or smashing his stuff up. I have a 19yo and I expect in a situation like this he'd behave similarly.

It's suggested the son has a good job and plenty of money. How true is this though? May be he has debts the mother knows nothing of. Let's face it she let a paedophile move in with her and her children and apparently knew nothing about what he was up to for years so how much of a handle she has of what's going on in her son's life is debatable.

No FissionChips I was implying that the mother and her mates are the ones who came down on him like a ton of bricks first saying he should pay up or move out. And the backlash was him reacting.

He is only 19 yet apparently the OP thinks he is the one responsible for keeping a roof over his mother and sisters heads

I can imagine the scenario. Mother and her mates, some of whom are only their for the gossip issuing ultimatums to a 19 year old so his mother can claim benefits. And people are surprised at the results

Op would you be saying the same next year if the ops DD decided to go to work. Would you be kicking her out and changing the locks

She should call her local job centre & arrange an appointment, tell them everything that has happened etc... they will probably be easier to communicate with face to face than over the phone & take into consideration her individual circumstances. Very hard position for your friend to be in, feel for her. Hope she gets it sorted.

I agree a 19 year old shouldn't be financially responsible for his mother/sister, but unfortunately that's not how the government see it.

The OP has said that the son isn't being violent to his mum. It sounds more like he's angry and because he's young, those outbursts are probably things like punching walls or smashing his stuff up.

And that stops his behaviour from being frightening and intimidating?

Let's face it she let a paedophile move in with her and her children and apparently knew nothing about what he was up to for years so how much of a handle she has of what's going on in her son's life is debatable.

So the whole thing is her fault for not being psychic? Or, you know, the bastard lied, covered up what he was doing and hid it from her. It's not unbelievable that if someone deliberately sets out deceive that they can be successful.

FFS, the son should be paying some money to his mum anyway, and even if he wasn't in the circumstances why wouldn't he - it's for his benefit as well.

agree a 19 year old shouldn't be financially responsible for his mother/sister, but unfortunately that's not how the government see it

That is how his mother and her mates and a lot of people on here see it.

I could sort of understand if his mother was working but she isn't and no one has taken into consideration if she is willing to throw out her ds the DD must see her position in the family home is also untenable and she too could be following her db out of the home very soon.

Whilst it is not entirely the mothers fault, it is not anything to do with the ds. He is completely blameless in this scenario.

I think the mother should shoulder the responsibility of the consequences of bringing the ex into her and her childrens home

I'm a bit mystified by people saying a 19 year old shouldn't be financially responsible for keeping a roof over the heads of his underage sister and sick mum. I personally know two young men whose contributions keep their family homes going. They're not the sole earner but they are the main one. They pride themselves on it. Quite a lot of 19 y.os are parents themselves, for goodness sakes.

The 19 y.o in question won't have to keep it up forever. I imagine his DM will be fit to return to work in the not too distant future.

He doesn't have to prop his mother and sister up. He could just move out, and pay rent like millions of other adults do.

The mum isn't sick she is upset and if the son goes then next year the dd will have to get out as well.

She is only underage for another year

As I have said the mum needs to get a job not to just keep kicking her children out when they get a job because it interferes with her benefits.

Very easy to say he could just move out and rent. There are people on here, grown women who are struggling on nearly £40,000 per year who are saving for months so they can afford the rent and deposit on a flat and yet you expect a teenage boy to just rent a flat with no problem.

To be perfectly frank, in your friend's position I would seek the help of a couple of large, very calm men to put it to her son that he can either pay up or move out. They could tell him they don't care which he chooses but he has to choose one. Then they stand there looking large. And very calm. I've found this works quite well when a young man is behaving in a totally obnoxious way.

Ahh yes of course.
Mum brings a disgusting paedophile home who abuses sister and probably him in some way or another.
For mums shitty decisions and crap parenting 19 year old lad can pick up the slack and start providing financially.
Yes that makes sense.

Utterly ridiculous, maybe mum shouldn't have been so desperate for a man she let a filthy paedophole access to her children.
Shameful that you think a couple of men should sort him out, no they should sort the bloody mother out.

I feel sorry for the son. He's only 19 and it's a lot to take on. I agree he should pay something, even a token amount

Hi OP,
I have gone back and read twice, but I still might not have my head totally around this....
The police can't stop ExP turning up as he is committing no crime. Your friend, or her daughter, need to apply for a non molestation order through the court. Daughter should qualify for legal aid for this. For friend to qualify for legal aid she would need to acknowledge domestic abuse - if this is what her son is doing. Her GP should refer her to a domestic abuse agency and that should qualify her for Legal Aid.
With both ex P and DS your friend should continue to call the police as although they can't do much, all incidents will be logged.
DS needs to realise that he is facing eviction whatever, and be appealed to to save the situation by moving out for the short term. I appreciate that is easier said than done, but he needs to make plans anyway.
The CAB would be an excellent place to find out the best options for the family.
I hope that the situation is resolved quickly and in the best interests of them all.

He is refusing point blank to leave and getting abusive about it. I have told her she MUST get the police involved to get him out

Will you be doing the same if DD decides she wants to get a job next year and your friends benefits are stopped because DD is earning a salary.

Or will you turn a blind eye to dd working because she is female.
Will your friend magically get a job or turn a blind eye towards dd's salary.

If you were a friend you would be bolstering her up to get a job and start acting like a parent than buying into the drama

Adviceplease360 the mum didn't know, why are so many posters acting as if she did?

They don't come with paedophile tattooed across their foreheads you know.

Oliversmumsarmy I would imagine she's very stressed and that can become sick. Is it unreasonable in the circumstances to need a bit of space to get sorted, or is it better if she struggles on and ends up having a breakdown?

Not read whole post but can she apply for dhp (discretionary housing payment) obviously they are discretionary and short term but may help. Dhp can also cover rent in advance and moving costs in certain circumstances so may be worth moving and leaving ds in the house? It'll be a tough decision but if he won't contribute then it may be the only option. Unfortunately under HB and UC the non-dependents income has to be taken into account. Hope this helps

What happened op

Ally they have said that she will not get the Housing element of UC at all because of the sons income.

I'm a bit mystified by this as my understanding is that the deduction from the housing costs element of UC is a flat rate. EntitledTo concurs:

"Under Universal Credit rules there is a flat rate contribution (deduction) each month regardless of the non-dependant's income, for 2018/19 this is £72.16 a month."

So I think your friend has been misinformed. If she spoke to the council, they may have based their advice on the HB non-dependant deduction rules, where the maximum deduction is much higher (getting on for £90 pw).

Council tax reduction is administered by the local council, you have to apply separately from UC and the rules vary from council to council.

While HAs (in my experience, at least) tend to be a bit quicker to move to giving notice in rent arrears cases than councils, I'm surprised that they're issuing proceedings for such a small amount. I'm working with a client whose arrears were over £1,000, and she was still getting warning letters, and we got a discretionary housing payment for her which cleared the arrears.

If you google "floating support" and the area your friend lives in, there may be a project like the one I work for. This is exactly the sort of case we deal with. Many take referrals directly. She could also try and see one of the council's housing advisers. Councils have new legal duties to prevent homelessness, so they have to help her.

I would also recommend she tries to find a law centre or similar advice and representation agency, rather than CAB. They're more likely to have someone qualified to deal with the legal side of defending a possession case if it goes that far.

The business of adult non-dependants not making their contribution to rent is a big problem. I think most of my team have at least one case like that going on at any time. It's really hard for parents, and for staff who have to tell them to kick their kids out.

Ops friend needs to be in receipt of HB or the housing costs of UC in order to apply for DHP.

He is only 19 yet apparently the OP thinks he is the one responsible for keeping a roof over his mother and sisters heads

It's nothing to do with what OP thinks, it's what the law says that matters. If the law assesses his contribution to be £100 pw, that's what will be deducted from her benefits.

Utterly ridiculous, maybe mum shouldn't have been so desperate for a man she let a filthy paedophole access to her children.

Ffs, how was the mother supposed to know that her DP was a paedophile? They don't wear a uniform or have a distinguishing tattoo or anything, you know.

Paedophiles are clever, subtle and manipulative. That's how so many of them get away with it for so long.