To want to tell this parent to tell his child off for one

[fatfatwaterrat]

Name changed for this as it's quite outing as I've spoken about it to a few people in rl, and I post personal things mn.

I have a friend who I met a couple of years ago. We have daughters the same age and developed a friendship through them.

I've always struggled with their parenting style as I feel they avoid provoking her by telling her off or actually disciplining her.

This has developed into her becoming quite physical with her baby brother, my daughter, her mother.

When we are together at my house, she is well behaved. I'm not strict, but I am firm and fair and don't just let children be mean to other children or ignore me and refuse to do something. She had learned this and is a delight with me.

A few times my friend had invited my dd round for a play date and I have dropped her off and then found out her dh was watching the children.

Now I won't lie, I hate him. I can't stand him. Partially because of all the midnight 2 hour phone calls of her crying down the phone about how he has treated her. The fact he never ever does anything around the house of with the children (unless someone is watching), is racist towards her and treats her like she's a simpleton. I hate the fact he is pushing stereotypes on his baby son and preschooler daughter and that this is rubbing off on my child. He comments when she wears a dress and says she looks like a 'proper girl', he takes dolls off his son and says 'I'm worried about this boy.'

I truly can't stand him. But my friend is completely alone in this country, and feels that being with him in a niceish house, is better than not being with him because of the shame of being a single parent on a council estate.

Despite wanting to tell him what I think of him every single time I see his face, I am always friendly and civil for the sake of my friend.

But now I'm struggling to hold my tongue. His daughter has become vicious. She hurts people and then laughs about it. She had pushed my dd down the stairs, scratched her with a butter knife, hit her more times than I can count, pulled her lips until her gums bled, bit her and made her bleed and more.

I always always speak to my dd about if she wants to see her anymore as she seems to be sad and hurt. But she maintains they are best friends and sometimes nice. It hurts me to see my dd who isn't a meek person at all, she just doesn't hurt people and won't hit back, be hurt so often by someone who is supposed to be her friend.

But what is more difficult is that her parents do nothing! They just say 'oh dear' and do nothing. Dd told the father his dd pushed her down the stairs and she was crying and wanting comfort and he told her off for telling tales. Every time she hurts her, she comes and tells me and if he is there he calls her a snitch or a tell tale. And I'm so fucking angry. They are 4. They aren't old enough to be sent upstairs to play by themselves. Especially when one of them had a penchant for hurting the other one.

Today we were at an event and everyone had prizes, his dd snatched my dds prize off her and refused to give it back and said she would put it in the bin. I was running a stall and shouted over to her to give it back as it wasn't hers. My dd was crying and trying to get it back and saying please give it back. Her father was standing there and just said 'oh dear. Stop having a tantrum' to my daughter because she was upset. I left my stall and got the toy off her and have it back to my dd and said we will put it away as it's causing problems and she was fine with that. Friends dd had a screaming fit and he got shitty with me and spent ages letting her hit and scratch her mother who was breastfeeding the baby, because she was angry and all he did was say ' oh dear, she didn't want to share'.

Then he dragged her over to us and said 'I'm sure you'll be fair and let her have the toy as she really likes it' I laughed and said no it's not hers and she can't have other people's things just because she wants them. Cue meltdown which was my fault as I refused to give into her demands.

I'm getting sick of it. I can't trust him around my dd. He makes my skin crawl. I hate how he treats the children. I am angry at my friend for allowing he children to witness him smashing the house in anger and treat her like shit. I'm angry that she is allowing her daughter to be an absolute brat who is so far from the sweet little girl I met 18 months ago.

I either, cut this friendship off, only accept meetings and play dates at my house, tell him to parent his fucking child and stop letting her make demands and hurt other people.

I'm so angry. I wish my dd didn't want to be friends with her anymore and then I wouldn't feel so torn between continuing or stopping.

sorry but you have to stop this -you dd will get over this friendship she might not get over being pushed down the stairs several times

sorry didnt refresh good for you op first time is the hardest

Well done OP - you may find that excuses don't cut it and that eventually you might have to tell her your real reasons (whilst leaving the door open to her) but with any luck the friendship will die a natural death after September. I am glad you are already feeling the benefits though.

Don’t make excuses. Tell her you don’t like the way her husband speaks to your DD and as your DD is getting older you can no longer allow this to continue. Tell her your DD is continually getting hurt by her DD and that you find the lack of discipline something you can no longer be around.

Well done OP, I know it seems hard, but you have to make the break for your daughter's sake. She can't grow up thinking abuse is part and parcel of "friendship".

I have been a parent for 14 years, - run a toddler group, and volunteered at a Nursery. I reckon I have seen my fair share of bad behavior, and ineffectual parenting. However, it is rare to see a child that will consistently and deliberately hurt another (particularly if it's not a sibling).

This coupled with the Dad's attitude is really worrying. Yes, small kids do hurt others, or squabble over toys, but most parents will at least make some excuse, or a half-hearted apology. Something along the line of "Sorry, little Damian doesn't understand/is over excited/doesn't know his strength" etc. To just stand and watch her violence, accuse your child of snitching, and finally insist she gives up her toy takes bad parenting to a whole new level. This man isn't normal.

I would take your daughter to other groups and activities over the summer, (have a look at your local MN page, and your Council's). You need to make yourself less available to this women, and put your daughters safety as your paramount concern. Ultimately, your friend has options - she understands the language, she clearly isn't stupid. She can access information about leaving her husband, and her legal rights. Whether or not she does so is up to her. She has free will, and choices. You aren't responsible for her.

Absolutely, enough is enough in this situation. It's too damaging for your daughter for things to continue as they are. I feel sorry for the other mum and her kids as they have and will be brain washed into thinking these things are normal, but the truth is there is nothing you can do to change these attitudes - the one thing you can do is protect your own child.

It may help you in withdrawing ‘support’ from your friend if you step back and realise that all the help and support and friendship that you are giving at the moment is actually going towards propping up the abusive lifestyle she is living. So, you are facilitating the very lifestyle you are rejecting and that is having such a negative effect on your daughter. You are enabling that awful man to continue abusing his family.

Horrible to think of it that way isn’t it! And absolutely not blaming you in any way. I’m just sharing an insight about why abusive relationships become so isolating. And I think in your case, it is good to see that all the good intentions and caring ness and support in the world from you isn’t actually going to a good cause. It’s enabling that unhealthy relationship to exist.

So maybe if you do ever end up talking to her about why you’re not around anymore, or not as close anymore, you could tell her that it’s becaise you don’t want to do that anymore. But that you’d support her if she decided to change her life (& dump the sbusive fucker!). But until then, you can’t in all conscience facilitate a family set up which is harmful for those in it, and those around it.

This situation is a good illustration of the impact of staying in an abusive relationship - paramount reason to leave is its bad for your own children but poisons and infects other relationships too.

Agree with the wise poster above. Disengage you can't help here.

We live very very close to each other and often bump into each other. I bumped into her today while she was driving home from playgroup, her daughter was in the back without a seatbelt on 😔. It is only round the corner but that isn't the point at all, I did mention it and she said 'she wouldn't let me' so I did it anyway while she screamed at me because she didn't want a seatbelt on.

I looked at this woman and thought, 'you are 12 years older than me, why do I feel protective of you and why do you view me as a big sister.' When in reality, I am very young myself, and I'm stupidly taking on other peoples troubles because my anxiety means I think the worst will happen if I don't help someone.

I'm so angry at her for putting her children at risk, and I'm so angry and her for not being a good friend. She is more like a parasite. As awful as it sounds, it started out lovely, but now it's her sucking the energy, time, and happiness out of me.

Oh OP
Read your last post out loud to yourself. You've got to disengage. Her life is slowly breaking, and she is taking you with her

And this is why it's time to step back. I understand your feelings of responsibility towards the safety of her child, but in the end it is up to HER. If you (or others) keep stepping in to take over, she'll never have to face up to her responsibilities.

I feel bad that my friend will struggle more without me

You do realise that whilst you've been trying to rescue her - she didn't want rescuing?
She wants to stay where she is - just wants someone else to help make it bearable for her.

I know plenty of women who were brought up like her - some chose to stay with their abusers and others walked away.
They still had to deal with the backlash from the attitudes of their families, community etc, but they valued their kids more.

You are completely right. I want to shake her and scream that he is absolutely scum of the earth and that just because he doesn't drink and beat the kids (her words) it is abuse!

But there's fuck all I can do unless she turns up at my doorstep and says I've left him. And even then, what can I do but help her start her life afresh? While her daughter hurts mine and I have to explain to my 4 year old that it's not true when she says girls should do ballet not football and she shouldn't sit cross legged because people will look at her knickers.

Doesn't seem like a great idea either really. I wish I could help, but I'm seeing now that I can't.

You can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

This family is too toxic for your dd and you. You sound a lovely caring person Op, but there is nothing you can do apart from phoning ss and keeping out of this families way.

Call Social Services, for one thing.

If playdates happen, ensure they happen at your house.

Please phone the police about her DD travelling with no seatbelt. Does she have a car seat? This is incredibly dangerous and probably isn’t the first time she’s done this. The police (in some areas-not sure about all) do home visits when they get reports of children travelling without being secured.
Send her some links with dummy crashes with children not being restrained properly in a car, it’s really horrific when you see it.

I think you really need to phone SS, this girl needs someone to look out for her and you’re right, sadly there is nothing you can do to help. I think you would be negligent not to report it though knowing what you know about her home life.

You need to tell your friend why you can no longer see her - this is the most helpful thing you can do for her, better than ‘phasing her out’ or avoiding her.

You sound lovely and caring btw, your DD is lucky to have you.

I'm sorry OP, but in this situation your DD doesn't know what's best for her. She wants to see her friend but you need to be the grown-up here and notice that she's not safe in your friends house. Yes DD will be sad, but that's OK. You need to protect her as her mother and stop her going round there.

And call Social Services. Your friend chooses to stay in an abusive relationship, that's her choice. But don't let those children suffer when you could do something about it.