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Original poster

At ex pat neighbour and NHS use

170 replies

woolythoughts · 10/07/2018 14:17

Neighbour emigrated to Thailand about 30 years ago. We kept in touch with him over the years. Whilst his mother was still alive, they came back twice a year and made sure that they did opticians and various other routine things whilst here.

He now rents his mothers old house out to tenants.

He’s now been diagnosed with cancer and is currently making travel arrangements to return to the UK, evict his tenants and get cancer treatment on the NHS as decent treatment is too expensive for him to pay for where he is.

He’s paid nothing into the country for the last 30 years so how can it be right he’s able to do this?

And before anyone asks, yes I am 100% sure of my facts.

OP posts:
haribosmarties · 10/07/2018 15:05

yeah I think if any of us had cancer and not a great deal of wealth and could do that... then we would... I mean what are you going to do? Just die so you arent 'stealing benefits' .... and imo he is entitled to NHS treatment as he is a British person and owns property which I imagine he pays tax on in the UK (not that I would want anyone of any nationality to be refused cancer treatment I just mean in terms of the law)

My family live abroad and my mum has a terminal illness... all her treatment is funded by the NHS even though they no longer own any property here even... that is Europe however

BoldKitties · 10/07/2018 15:09

You’d think from all the fuss that cancer treatment was some enjoyable leisure activity. Exactly, Battleax. Lucky fucker, swanning around enjoying all that lovely, leisurely cancer treatment. For fuck sake. Hmm

NameChangedForThisQ · 10/07/2018 15:10

I think you should butt out and focus on your own life for gods sake, instead of begrudging someone cancer treatment Hmm

Ta1kinPeace · 10/07/2018 15:11

Because he's getting something without contributing anything to it!
Better stop treating children on the NHS then as the lazy little things have never paid tax yet Hmm

mumsastudent · 10/07/2018 15:14

the question they ask at our hospital is have you been out of the UK this year

HoleyCoMoley · 10/07/2018 15:14

OP, how do you know so much about him and his illness, future plans, earnings, tax. He's been away for 30 years but you know soooooo much about him.

LeighaJ · 10/07/2018 15:16

@woolythoughts

If he can't afford decent care in Thailand and you don't feel it's fair for him to use the NHS, then I can only assume that what you feel is fair is for him to die of cancer.

hellokittymania · 10/07/2018 15:16

However, people often have a lot of misconceptions about what it’s like to live somewhere as an ex pat. It’s not living by the swimming pool every day. And as I mentioned, how the heck do you emigrate? Even if you’re married to someone, you can’t get citizenship. You have to pay for for tile work permits, including your own work permit if you were a foreigner in Thailand. I don’t know what the new legislation is, but this is what it used to be if you wanted to set up a business. Which many experts try and do, and many fail because of the problems, the costs, etc. involved. Sorry for the mistakes, I’m using dictation.

Off the topic, I know, but you cannot get benefits as an expat Unless you have a very big company hiring you who can support your children in school at an international school, your housing, etc. But plenty of expats like myself, have to worry about everything ourselves. You aren’t even allowed to buy a house if you’re a foreigner in some places. Thailand used to be one of these places. And even now, I think it’s a condominium and it’s a 99 year lease. But you don’t have the same rights as you do as a local.

HariboIsMyCrack · 10/07/2018 15:17

This reply has been withdrawn

Message from MNHQ: This post has been withdrawn

21jumpstreet · 10/07/2018 15:19

Wow. The compassion you show for someone who is ill is outstanding 🙄

hellokittymania · 10/07/2018 15:20

Student, they never asked me that. Thankfully, I just remember them asking my address, and that was it. But they didn’t even ask for proof. Just my passport.

I am an officer on my borrow disability board by the way, and I do a heck of a lot in this country, even though apart from my passport, I’m not very British. I’m also setting up an oral health organization here. Yet I have been out of this country for about the same amount of time as this man. Unless you have walked in his shoes, you really can’t understand his situation.

mumsastudent · 10/07/2018 15:24

I think the big scandal is about the windrush generation - there were incidences where people who were invited here to work & entitled to live here as commonwealth citizens & some who had worked in the NHS paid taxes etc suddenly many years later they were declared as having no right of abode & were either charged or were not given medical treatment I seem to remember a man who was part way through chemo & until the paper (Guardian???) got hold of the story - his treatment was stopped.

BlingLoving · 10/07/2018 15:26

I think being a UK citizen entitles him to certain things, including the NHS (although I totally understand the legal point mentioned above about having to be living or planning to live here to be eligible). But as an expat living in other countries, ie not a citizen, there will be all kinds of things for which he is not eligible and as such it's not unreasonable for the country that he is actually a citizen of to consider him their responsibility. In this case, that means he can come back here, live for a while, and access NHS treatment.

In a global world, your citizenship is still important. For some people, they may choose to give that up in order to specifically benefit from other citizenships in the country to which they have moved. But if you don't, you accept the good with the bad. For example, my father was not allowed to vote in the country he moved to because he did not want to give up his British citizenship. That was a downside he accepted of retaining his right to move back to the UK.

JustGettingStarted · 10/07/2018 15:27

He's presumably not moving back just to save money - but because it's the only way he can get treatment.

How on Earth can anyone seriously blame someone for doing whatever possible to survive?

Who would actually stay put and die just because they think "Oh, it wouldn't be fair?"

Nonsense.

Haffiana · 10/07/2018 15:28

I think you should scream and scream until you are sick.

And then fuck off some more.

hellokittymania · 10/07/2018 15:28

Student, I had no idea. I will have to look that up. Anyway, my family left when I was only five, and I came back a few years ago. I just now have “officially“ pass the three-year mark of being here, but I still received a letter from PIP asking me to prove my residency before I could make a claim. Because I still work abroad, and my organization is based abroad, I think I may have problems with them. I’m setting up an organization at this moment here, but that won’t be ready until probably August now. But I can use the NHS, thankfully. I think just disabled students allowance and PIP require three years of residency before you can claim.

kitchenrollinrollinrollin · 10/07/2018 15:28

I seem to remember a man who was part way through chemo & until the paper (Guardian???) got hold of the story - his treatment was stopped.

You have that back to front. He wasn't allowed to proceed with treatment until (eventually) his story was publicised by the Guardian and the political climate changed. Thankfully.

chrissie28 · 10/07/2018 15:33

I just think we Brits are really stupid which is why we are in this dire financial situation - the financiers have been saying it for years but the politicians don't care - they just want votes to line their own pockets

Igorina · 10/07/2018 15:34

I presume you know all of this deeply personal information because this man considers you a friend and has confided in you?

hellokittymania · 10/07/2018 15:37

Loving, exactly. I don’t think, people can understand just want living, actually living abroad means. I’m not talking about going somewhere for three months, as I hear some of these younger people doing and calling it living. But when you spend years somewhere, it’s very different and it’s not easy. I am moved back here partly because Vietnam kept changing their visa regulations and making them harder to get. I was in charge of my own visas for the many years I was in Vietnam and towards the end, I would have to leave every three months to get a new visa and the cost kept going up. And then immigration in our area started checking everyone and would interview you for four hours. You can’t access things like local education, there are absolutely no benefits if you are up for an hour with a disability, a lot of misconceptions and questions were asked at me regarding this, you can’t buy a house, so many things. People don’t realize it. As I mentioned above, even if you were married to somebody, you still have to go to immigration every three months And pay, and if you want to work you need a work permit, which is very difficult to get in a place like Vietnam. it’s hard and as I mentioned, I know a lady who was married to a Vietnamese man for 17 years, has Vietnamese born children, and could not get a passport, they laughed in her face.

DontDribbleOnTheCarpet · 10/07/2018 15:39

I can imagine the fear of living in a country where I had no access to treatment for cancer. I'm fairly sure that very few people in this situation would say "Nah, it's a fair cop, I've skipped all those years of contributions so I'll just shuffle off and die quietly".
I have a friend who was diagnosed with cancer after living in Ecuador (doing charity work) for over 30 years. I'm glad that he came home for treatment and I think I'd probably do the same.

Dottierichardson · 10/07/2018 15:40

OP if the root of your concern is the state of the NHS funds you would be better served lobbying your MP and others for better NHS funding. There is a great deal of money being spent on projects such as HS2 and additional runways etc that could be spent on healthcare. In addition you could lobby for a more lenient attitude towards immigration, as without overseas' workers the NHS will find (and already is finding) it hard to function. Making this situation about an individual with cancer is just the kind of thing that politicians who do not wish to support Universal Healthcare love to do, it shifts the spotlight from what the actual problems are.

mumsastudent · 10/07/2018 15:41

that's what I meant - he wasn't allowed treatment Until the guardian put out the story -the point was he was one among many - (unedited writing!) I seem to remember another article about a lady stranded in the west Indies who because she had essential treatment was being pursued by the NHS because her right of abode was disallowed after decades of living and working in this country. point I am trying to make is that their treatment by the system was appalling

Goodfood1 · 10/07/2018 15:41

Was he not paying tax on his home rental?

Charolais · 10/07/2018 15:44

I’ve lived abroad for over 45 yrs and understand I am not entitled to use the NHS although years ago when I was visiting my parents with my 1 yr old he became ill and so my mum called her doctor and explained we lived abroad and all that, the doctor said to bring him in and he was treated for free. I was so grateful for that. I would have paid gladly but there just was no way to pay at the time.

God bless the NHS.