At ex pat neighbour and NHS use

[woolythoughts]

Neighbour emigrated to Thailand about 30 years ago. We kept in touch with him over the years. Whilst his mother was still alive, they came back twice a year and made sure that they did opticians and various other routine things whilst here.

He now rents his mothers old house out to tenants.

He’s now been diagnosed with cancer and is currently making travel arrangements to return to the UK, evict his tenants and get cancer treatment on the NHS as decent treatment is too expensive for him to pay for where he is.

He’s paid nothing into the country for the last 30 years so how can it be right he’s able to do this?

And before anyone asks, yes I am 100% sure of my facts.

Left the U.K. ^

Dh and I left the U.K. for a few years with his company. When I came back to the U.K., dh had been paying NI the whole time we were away but tax was paid in the host country. I was pregnant, not earning and told by the nurses that I may not be able get my pregnancy/ delivery funded through the nhs. I was gobsmacked. As was, I filled in some form and got a card thingy, which stated had I was a European resident of another country, who was now coming to reside in the U.K.

I’m really surprised he just gets this handed to him with no issues. I think it’s disgusting he’s been using the nhs when not residing in the country. As for treatment, it appears there is little we can do. And I certainly wouldn’t want to be the one telling him oi mate, no treatment for you.

Why can’t he get treatment in Thailand?

If you're genuinely aggrieved about this issue, then contact his GP and outline your concerns. The GP will investigate and charge him appropriately if required.

@kitchenrollinrollinrollin it has nothing to do with being a British Citizen - that's not a factor of being entitled to NHS treatment, it's whether or not he's a resident of the UK.

There are many, many expats who are not entitled to care, even though they are British Citizens, as they choose to live and remain in other countries (non-EU countries).

Also has nothing to do with the GP - primary care is free to everyone, regardless of residency.

GP's are also very vocal about not wanting to be 'border patrol'.

Tbh I think a hell of a lot of reignited people do exactly that.
They keep an address in the uk, are registered with te surgery and regularly go to be treated when they are here.

He would be entitled to free treatment legally once he has been back for 3 months (then he is considered a resident of the U.K. again).

How long had he been resident here before emigrating? If a long time, I think morally he has some entitlement to use NHS services because he has paid into the system, albeit quite a while ago.

There are staff called 'overseas visitors officers' in every NHS trust - they will know about this gentleman and they will investigate and they will charge him if needed. Leave it to the people who's job it is to deal with this type of issue and know the rules.

He's already stated that and is quite proud of it as, and I quote, "he find it depressing here"

I'd find living there pretty depressing too, if I had neighbours like you.

Also has nothing to do with the GP - primary care is free to everyone, regardless of residency.
Actually that’s wrong.
And the NHS has done plenty of checks to ensure they weren’t treating people who aren’t legally in the country. Which of course has led to people who could legally get NHS treatment been refused.

The problem of course is ‘how do you check residency of a british citizen’??

Are you being unreasonable to think that a man with cancer, looking down the barrel at life altering surgery, gruelling, debilitating treatment and a fair chance that he will die in agony shouldn't grab any opportunity he can to prevent himself being bankrupt on top of all that? Yes, I rather think you are.

a friends brother used to claim the old incapacity benefit,rented his London house out (not declared and used to spend 6 moths in Thailand then come back for a couple of months (stayed with parents) and then go back again

cheeky sod

true story

mind you its differrent now compared to years ago,eg they just used to leave you on the benefit and very few medicals etc

It isn't wrong.

Primary and emergency care is available to all. Care becomes chargeable at the point that a person enters secondary care - such as being admitted to a ward.

"Overseas visitors are exempt from charges for accessing primary care services, and GPs are not expected to establish entitlement for free NHS hospital treatment. But practices are encouraged to work with overseas visitor managers in NHS bodies to ensure relevant patients are informed about entitlement to NHS hospital treatment"

I can't say I blame him tbh, regardless of what you think. I can't imagine myself saying "it'd be cheeky to have my cancer treatment on the NHS, guess I'll die instead"

Ordinarily resident is a very vague term and yes, establishing residency is difficult. There are entire teams and departments at trust and national DoH level who are working to make it easier for all involved.

This is one of those cases where the OVM of the Trust will be working with the patient to understand their circumstances and essentially, determine whether to charge or not.

I think the NHS website gives the rules on British citizens living abroad and if they are entitled to NHS services or not.

woolythoughts Tue 10-Jul-18 14:27:33
"so what, everybody would do the same. Some people tried to close the borders to non-national with Brexit, but they can't close them to nationals. He will just have to re-register and officially live here, but why shouldn't he?"

Because he's getting something without contributing anything to it! If everyone did this there'd be no funds at all for the NHS.

What about all the people that come here and use all our services after having paid nothing in?

What's your opinion on housing them, feeding & clothing them (vouchers & benefits) and providing medical care, schooling etc?

I don't care about this, you shouldn't either.

Meh, he's not hoi g to get decent medical treatment under the NHS anyway, leave the cheapskate to it.

Speaking from the perspective of an expert, who has lived abroad her whole life, including having residency in the United States, it is really, really difficult to actually emigrate to places in Southeast Asia. People laugh if you marry a Vietnamese person and you want to Vietnamese passport for example. So that means, you have to go to immigration every three months, even if you have a five-year visa waiver, if you get married for example. And you still have to worry about paying for everything you need. So I can definitely see why he would move back to the UK for long-term treatment.

Thankfully, I was able to use the NHS when I moved back here, even shortly after I had moved back since I had a dental abscess and no GP and no dentist. And I was living in the guesthouse. Do you have rights in this country that you don’t have another’s, even after living there for 30 years. Being an ex pat does not mean that you have the same rights as you do here.

And I have somebody mentioned, he would have probably had to pay tax on the property he was renting.

You’d think from all the fuss that cancer treatment was some enjoyable leisure activity 🙄

Cancer treatment isn’t a giggle Op. He’s not going to be feeling all smug and triumphant about his freebie.

YABU. I hope you didn't trouble the NHS for your empathyectomy.

www.ageuk.org.uk/globalassets/age-uk/documents/factsheets/fs25_returning_from_abroad_fcs.pdf

So what do you think he should have done? Resigned himself to a slow and painful death and thought of the NHS budget as he died? What a monstrous set of expectations!