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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Our list of allies grows thin! Our list of enemies grows long! Trump thread continued.

985 replies

TheClaws · 03/07/2018 02:11

The above is a quote from The Lord of the Rings, The Fellowship of the Ring, said by Lord Elrond. At this stage, with POTUS practically pissing off every ally the US has while cosying up with several dictators, it seems quite apt.

Previous thread:
www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3283037-trump-puts-kids-in-cages-because-he-wants-his-wall-how-low-can-he-go-the-authoritarian-shitshow-continues

OP posts:
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32
lionheart · 04/07/2018 09:00

Don't know what is going on in Amesbury--hope it is not a repeat of Salisbury and that the safety measures are simply precautionary.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-wiltshire-44707052?ns_source=twitter&ns_mchannel=social&ocid=socialflow_twitter&ns_campaign=bbcnews

Gumpendorf · 04/07/2018 09:24

Happy 4th July, to all the US posters.

🎇🇺🇸
The WH Party seems one to avoid. The WaPo article clearly hit a nerve with SCROTUS who seems to be feeling .... unloved atm. 😀

Thanks for the new thread Claws

Lovely to see you back cozie

Your post at 14.58 yesterday was very thought provoking, Across. Any thoughts about who is waiting in the wings?

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 09:29

A targeted deliberate lie to Cult45:

Jim Sciutto Retweeted
Mark R. Jacobson
@markondefense
Future students of mine 👇is an example of disinformation: Iranian unreliable source —> @FoxNews —> unthinking ears —> tweet ... in short, it is a calculated untruth, a deliberate lie.

@realDonaldTrump
Just out that the Obama Administration granted citizenship, during the terrible Iran Deal negotiation, to 2,500 Iranians - including to government officials. How big (and bad) is that?

mobile.twitter.com/markondefense/status/1014275472887336960

Gumpendorf · 04/07/2018 09:34

The latest Quinnipiac poll is interesting

American voters disapprove 55 - 40 percent of the job President Trump is doing, compared to a 52 - 43 percent disapproval rating in a June 20 Quinnipiac University National Poll and reversing a trend which showed Trump's net approval inching up.

The president gets negative grades on most character traits:
58 - 38 percent say he is not honest;
55 - 43 percent say he does not have good leadership skills;
55 - 43 percent say he does not care about average Americans;
62 - 34 percent say he is not level-headed;
63 - 32 percent say he is a strong person;
57 - 39 say he is intelligent;
60 - 37 percent say he does not share their values;
62 - 36 percent say he does not provide the U.S. with moral leadership.
Voters approve 53 - 39 percent of Trump's meeting with Russian President Vladimir Putin and approve 51 - 40 percent of the way the president is handling the nation's policy toward North Korea.

American voters disapprove 58 - 39 percent of the way President Donald Trump is handling immigration.

President Trump is racist, 49 percent of voters say, while 47 percent say he is not racist. But 50 percent of voters say the main motive for Trump's immigration policies is "a sincere interest in controlling our borders," while 44 percent say the main motive is "racist beliefs."

Democrats in Congress are more interested in "exploiting the nation's immigration issue for political gain," 60 percent of voters say, while 34 percent say they are more interested in "resolving the nation's immigration issue."

"The words are G-rated, but a punch to the gut of President Donald Trump's immigration policy," said Tim Malloy, assistant director of the Quinnipiac University Poll.

"When it comes to the separation of immigrant kids from their parents, American voters are clearly appalled."

Separating children from their parents was a violation of human rights, American voters say 60 - 36 percent. The Trump Administration has a responsibility to unite these children with their parents, voters say 83 - 12 percent. Undocumented immigrants are not more likely than American citizens to commit crimes, American voters say 69 - 25 percent.

poll.qu.edu/national/release-detail?ReleaseID=2554

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 09:36

Summary downloadable here:
'The Senate Intelligence Committee released a seven-page summary that corroborates much of what the CIA, NSA, and FBI concluded back in January 2017, and praises their report as “a sound intelligence product” — despite President Donald Trump’s continued insistence that Russia didn’t interfere to help him and his criticism of the intelligence assessment as biased against him.'
www.vox.com/2018/7/3/17532536/trump-russia-senate-election-putin

PerkingFaintly · 04/07/2018 09:39

Happy 4th July to US posters!

Yes, I agree with Across's post too. It's why keeping an eye on the "aftermath" is so important.

Because it won't really be the "aftermath": it'll be the main show after the dramatic warm-up act (45) has broken things and lowered standards.

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 09:49

Robert Reich - What can we do? :

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 10:10

Republicans represent less than 30% of eligible voters, and are a shrinking base. SCOTUS could be dangerously out of step with both Congress and a majority of Americans for many years, or worse, if Across's fears are realised - enablers of authoritatian rule:

'The coming "court will be in step with the conservatives in the country and out of synch with the liberals, and because we are so divided that court is not going to be a neutral arbiter," says Harvard Law School professor Noah Feldman, author of "Scorpions," a book on FDR's battles with the Supreme Court. "It is going to be a partisan actor on behalf of the conservatives."
Behind their "coalition of transformation" centered on groups that are growing in society millennials, minorities and college-educated whites Democrats have won the popular vote in six of the past seven presidential elections, a feat unmatched in modern American political history. Yet they have captured the Electoral College and the White House in only four of those races, and, largely as a result, now face the prospect that Republicans will control the Supreme Court for years, no matter how often a majority of Americans support Democrats in presidential contests.
It's difficult to predict exactly how the tension might erupt over a divergence between a court rooted in one political and cultural era, and a majority electoral coalition that reflects another. But one clear lesson of history is that, sooner or later it will erupt.'

edition.cnn.com/2018/07/03/politics/supreme-court-country-longevity-cultural-changes/index.html

Quantumblue · 04/07/2018 10:21

Enjoying the letters from #secondcivilwarletters on Twitter.

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 13:00

On the Amesbury incident, O'Neil has just reported on 'Daily Politics' that Porton Down now involved. V. worrying.

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 13:21

Neil

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 13:30

Josh Dawsey
@jdawsey1
A good @juliehdavis read on Trump's posts yesterday morning, filled with inaccuracies, innuendo and insults. See below what happened when government was asked to explain one of them. link: <a class="break-all" href="https://mobile.nytimes.com/2018/07/03/us/politics/fact-check-donald-trump-fox-tweetstorm.html#click=t.co/AMJw38JTIU" rel="nofollow" target="_blank">mobile.nytimes.com/2018/07/03/us/politics/fact-check-donald-trump-fox-tweetstorm.html#click=t.co/AMJw38JTIU mobile.nytimes.com/2018/07/03/us/…
mobile.twitter.com/jdawsey1/status/1014482087989186561

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 13:46

Important for exercise of voting rights, too:

'It's unconstitutional for the state of Tennessee to continue revoking driver's licenses from people who can't pay court costs, a federal judge determined Monday.

The ruling from U.S. District Judge Aleta Trauger will have broad national and state ramifications, said Claudia Wilner, a senior attorney with the National Center for Law and Economic Justice in New York City who worked on the case.'
amp.tennessean.com/amp/754596002?__twitter_impression=true

Justin Barrett
@justybtheperson
Replying to @cephalopadawan and @Tennessean
Tennessee does indeed have voting ID laws. Drivers license or State ID to get a voter card. Tennessee also has chronically underfunded DMVs, except Williamson county. Getting a State ID is quite an epic battle.
mobile.twitter.com/justybtheperson/status/1014345003043303424

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 13:54

So, what are US Customs and Border Protection up to then? Hmm

@GOP
Democrats’ calls to abolish ICE would mean abolishing America’s borders— and opening the floodgates to crime, drugs, and terrorism.
mobile.twitter.com/GOP/status/1014202613380861953

Roussette · 04/07/2018 14:23

On that Josh Dawsey NY Times link, the headline is 'Trump Offers a Medley of Falsehoods and Misstatements' I am sick to bleedin' death hearing of MISstatements MISquotes MIS spoke etc. Why can't the press just call it LIES? It's lies. It's not falsehoods or misstatements. Ridiculous

OhYouBadBadKitten · 04/07/2018 14:48

Might be worth keeping an eye on www.mumsnet.com/Talk/in_the_news/3296465-salisbury-two-in-critical-condition this thread for any newly emerging posters....

lionheart · 04/07/2018 14:52

Yes, the fact that journalists plunder the thesaurus for every word they can use aside from lie and liar drives me to distraction too.

lionheart · 04/07/2018 15:28

Oh.

talkingpointsmemo.com/news/trump-ask-venezuela-invade

'BOGOTA, Colombia (AP) — As a meeting last August in the Oval Office to discuss sanctions on Venezuela was concluding, President Donald Trump turned to his top aides and asked an unsettling question: With a fast unraveling Venezuela threatening regional security, why can’t the U.S. just simply invade the troubled country?

The suggestion stunned those present at the meeting, including U.S. Secretary of State Rex Tillerson and national security adviser H.R. McMaster, both of whom have since left the administration. This account of the previously undisclosed conversation comes from a senior administration official familiar with what was said.'

AcrossthePond55 · 04/07/2018 15:53

Whom do I expect to 'take over', Gump? How does "Commander" Pence sound? OK, I admit I've watched the latest episode of "Handmaid" which tends to colour my perceptions. But on the other hand, that is the obvious choice based on the line of succession. Would I expect a true Gileadean state? Not really, but I can see a return to much of the way society was 60 years ago; the abolishing of equal rights for minorities, women, LGBTQ, etc. It won't be because they state we are not 'equal' to straight, white males, oh no, it will be because we 'don't need it anymore' or because 'it's not fair to others'.

For the first time in my life, one is hearing liberals wondering if they should buy firearms. It's half serious, of course, but even joking about needing to arm to defend ourselves wouldn't have been funny 18 months ago.

Republicans represent less than 30% of eligible voters, and are a shrinking base. This may be true, but it's nothing to rely on and I fear it may encourage apathy in Democratic voters. As of October 2017, Gallup polling found that 31% of Americans identified as Democrat, 24% identified as Republican, and 42% as Independent. That 42% is a huge number of voters to convince. And win those votes, we must!

Natsku · 04/07/2018 17:01

Placemarking and wishing a Happy 4th to the Americans here

ohmymimi · 04/07/2018 18:13

Maggie Haberman
@maggieNYT
Cohen seems to have changed his twitter page to remove references to Trump
apnews.com/amp/a3309c4990ac4581834d4a654f7746ef?__twitter_impression=true

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