AIBU to expect my kids to not to told off for speaking English in a welsh medium school?

[Hairyfairy01]

I have 2 dc in year 3 and 6 who attend a welsh medium primary school and have been taught in the welsh medium since they started school. However both dc are brought up in an english speaking household. English medium education at primary level is not available in this area of wales. Both dc have reported to me that they get told off for speaking English in the classroom, corridors, lunchtime and playtime by both teachers and pupil members of the school 'welsh' council. Now I have no issues with encouraging the welsh language and totally support their scheme of rewarding pupils for speaking welsh in social situations. However I do have an issue of telling kids off for speaking english, not so much in lesson time, but more at lunchtime / playtime. Surely at these 'downtime' occasions kids should be able to speak whatever language they like, be it French, Chinese or whatever. I can only imagine that this is what happens in other primary schools where children's home / first language is different to the main language of the school occurs? Are they all told off for speaking French / Chinese etc? Feeling furious but not sure if iabu?

The early bilingualism opens doors outside of Wales.

Learning other languages is proven to improve literacy in one’s own language, but bar Patagonia as already mentioned, I’m not sure I agree with this as Welsh is so niche.

As a language teacher, I encourage students to use as much of the language as possible but if I were in a particular language medium school, I would also pick up on kids speaking the ‘wrong’ language. Immersion is the way forward.

Just a thought though.

I used to work on cruise ships where there are hundreds of different languages spoken. There was a very strict rules about only speaking English while at work and in public areas.
The ship was an American ship so we all had to adhere to US English (garbage, vacation etc).
The reason for this was the company performed lots of market research and concluded that passengers felt uncomfortable if 2 crew members were speaking in a different language as it implied that they were discussing things the guest should hear or were talking about the guest.

Perhaps the school is of a similar thought?

Punishment has been standing against the wall at playtime.

Happy to be told iabu. But I still think a lot of you are missing the point. I do want to encourage my dc to speak welsh at playtime. However I don't feel that should be done by 'punishing' the use of English. Instead it should be done by rewarding the use of welsh. To me that's common sense.

Again I repeat that I have never said I didn't want or see the benefits of being in a welsh medium school. I'm sure it has many benefits. But i will not support the school in telling off or punishing my dc for using whatever language they like during playtime. For me personally that's going a step to far.

Children are not disadvantaged by total immersion in a language. In fact, when they come to start doing English in addition to the immersion language, they very quickly reach the same/higher level as children who have not been through immersive education. We have Gaelic medium education in some Scottish schools, children do really well, it's an advantage educationally to learn any language from a young age, and also means they have the skills to pick up other languages more easily.

in an English school in England, your emphasis may be to support a home language in the playground
I’m sorry but that made me laugh.
I am absolutely sure that my dcs primary school would not welcome children speaking their home language on the playground, let alone encourage it.
That’s because it would stop those children for having another opportunity to learn English, to learn it well enough so they can carry on with those study at secondary etc...
Plus there is the issue of that behaviour being isolating for all children concerned (for the ones that don't speak said home langaue and don't understand what is been said and for the children who speak that language and end up not mixing with the English speaking kids).

OP Just put that into another context. If you were in a group of friends and there was two people who were speaking let’s say Spanish, wouldn’t you find it rude if they were regularly switching to Spanish wpro speak to each other when you know full week that they can speak English?
Same applies here. They are surrounded by people speaking welsh, in a welsh environment. Your dcs speak welsh. They shouod speak welsh between them out of respect for their peers (so they dint feel pushed out as you wouold feel in the case of the Spanish not speaking friends)

This sounds crazy. But then, bilingual education (all over the world) is largely delivered by people with very little expertise or proper understanding of language development and therefore rules get made up according to individual beliefs and preferences.

In a bilingual country such as Wales they really ought to have got to grips with this by now. It doesn’t say much for the quality of Welsh education that they haven’t.

It’s difficult to give an accurate response when your OP contains almost none of the information that you are actually upset by. You said:
Both dc have reported to me that they get told off for speaking English in the classroom, corridors, lunchtime and playtime by both teachers and pupil members of the school 'welsh' council.

But it seems that you are actually asking “is my children’s school unreasonable to punish unwanted behaviour by making my kids stand against the wall at break time when they break school rules” or even “is my children’s school unreasonable in allowing otherpuil’s to punish my Dc” since you also say that other pupils have the power to do this, which is unusual.

This is an entirely different question and I suspect you’ve received a lot of random comments on this thread simply because of this. The language use is a red herring if the issue is that you are upset that your D.C. are punished for rule-breaking

We’re all missing the point simply because we’re going off the info you provided initially

In my DD’s school (a very traditional monolingual school in the majority language), DC who speak another language at home are absolutely welcome to speak that language to their friends in the playground. The school knows that, to reject a child’s mother tongue is to reject the child which is a terrible way to encourage learning and development.

Hairy so what wouod you expect them to do?
To reward them to speak welsh (when everyone else is doing so anyway) would mean insisting on the fact they are different to everyone else.
I personally wouldn’t want that to happen.
As it is, my two dcs, born in England, who have always lived in England and have an English father are both seen as ‘french’ by their peers. They never spoke French at school betwen them. But they still have been singled out as such.
I’m not sure I would want them to be even more singled out in that.

Fyi Muslims speak Arabic.

Only in the same sense that RC's pre 1962 spoke Latin. The Koran is in Arabic but unless you are living in an Arab speaking country you are probably not going to speak Arabic.

New arrivals can get very isolated. It’s great if there are other children who speak their language.

We are increasingly teaching children who cannot speak home language because it is perceived to be of lower value, or just embarrassing to use. Children generally want to be the same as their friends. We always encourage children to value their home language. Children born here rarely use home language at school - only in the context of helping new arrivals I find.

Being put against the wall for expressing yourself in any language feels humiliating. But I do get that using Welsh has to be encouraged wholeheartedly.

It is common knowledge in Wales that Welsh schools expect children to carry out their whole day speaking Welsh. You have the choice to choose and English medium primary school.

This is ridiculous- it is a reverse welsh not.

@Tinyhandprintseverywhere

Majority do but not all.

I have an Indian friend who is Muslim and he speaks Hindi.

English medium education at primary level is not available in this area of wales.
Really? REALLY?

It’s a fine line, I think it’s ok to encourage and remind kids to speak Welsh but not ok to punish them for speaking English.
Separate point, i went to school in Wales in an English speaking school and remember the Welsh kids being favoured. It’s hardly surprising since it’s a bit of an insular society unless you’re in Cardiff.

Sashh false analogy since most Muslims are from Arabic speaking countries whereas nobody has spoken Latin for centuries. Arabic can refer to a dialect not necessarily formal Arabic.

How people would react if a welsh-speaking family moved to England and their kids were told off for speaking welsh at their new school?

It's a rule of the school.

They can speak Welsh. Their friends speak Welsh.

There's no need for them to speak English.

Dd is in Welsh medium high school, the teachers speak only in Welsh, no matter what the kids answer in, they are expected to use only Welsh in the classroom and remind them to use Welsh at school but don't punish them for using English in social situations.
Better than when my D step F was in school in Anglesey back in the 50's, they were caned for speaking in Welsh and expected to only use English, this was a school full of kids with Welsh first language, many of who started school with no English.

muslims speak hindu
Crap! I did not know about this new language. I am mulsim and speak and have done since i could talk, English! Didn't know i had been doing it wrong all these years!

Dh os not english and muslim....so wtf has he been speaking in all these years!

To be honest, it does sound like your dc are frequent transgressors - or at least not infrequent, since you've mentioned multiple places and times they have been pulled up for speaking English. Surely they understand that while they are in school they should only speak Welsh, and can speak whatever they want once they have left the school premises? Is it really that difficult, if they are fluent as you say?

Maybe school have tried simply reminding them "speak Welsh" and using positive reinforcement, but that hasn't been effective and they feel need to step up to actually doling out a punishment...