To have stood up to my MIL?

[Shehz21]

Have moved into MIL's place since quite time now. Reason being,MIL and FIL are both quite poorly and FIL was diagnosed with having only a year max to live. FIL was admitted to the hosp recently to be subjected to lots of tests,scans etc.
MIL and I never got along. She is the most emotionally and verbally abusive person I have ever known in my life. She has insulted me/my family on many occasions and I have always kept quiet out of respect for my DH.
I could scrub her whole house down and make everything sparkle and she would still never be satisfied. She would still make remarks and she makes snide comments about me to anyone who will listen.
Coming back to the issue, yesterday we had visitors home who came to give moral support to her and while conversing, she kept making sly digs at me and I couldn't take it and told her that i really don't appreciate such comments. Like why on earth would she still make displeasing comments about me when all she should care about right now is FIL's health?
Well after I said that,she started a melodrama of how much she does for her family, why am I sorting out things with her when she is apparently so upset about FIL. And she started insulting me again and screamt at me to STFU. This time I couldn't keep quiet like all the other times and I screamt back DON'T YOU DARE SPEAK TO ME LIKE THAT and my BIL tried to jump in to protect his DM from my outburst and I told him also where to go.
My MIL sister told my DH after the fight that If I feared my husband, I wouldn't have spoken to his mum the way i did and it would be a disgrace in society for him the way if a DIL speaks to his MiL this way. So I should tolerate whatever way my MIL wants to speak to me? Was i BU to have stood up to her? Is my MIL sister right? Am I what's considered a disgrace to the society? Am I supposed to "fear"my husband?
I love my husband and respect him but it doesn't mean I have no self respect!!
Sorry about this long post. Rant over.

Currently your DH is choosing his parents over you and his child. I see no reason why you both cannot move out to somewhere local. Your DH could continue to provide support. I would be very careful about your house money. If BIL has had 3 divorces that is an early warning. Secondly, lots of people do not live locally and your PIL should be grateful that they do have family that are close by to provide emotional and practical care.

Although I agree OP should move out, there will be an almighty shitstorm. Take it in stages OP making sure you get your half share of the proceeds of sale first. Try to get your H on side first to see that you can still support MIL even though you are not under the same roof. The pressure Asian MIL can put on their daughter in laws is immense. Many marriages fail because of this. Nip it in the bud before you are trapped.

MIL and I never got along. She is the most emotionally and verbally abusive person I have ever known in my life and yet you moved into her home - after selling your own?

Nothing you ever do will be good enough. This woman hates your guts because you have married her son. I wonder why BIL has been divorced three times!!!???

Get the fuck out of there. Do you have family you can go to? As you are married you should be entitled to a share of the equity from the house sale, but I would instruct a solicitor very quickly as if you don't, the money will disappear.

Good luck.

It sounds like you've been set up. Selling the house was probably MILs idea. Unless your DH isn't very bright me too knows that this move is meant to be permanent and is feeding you a line

I'm afraid I agree - and I'd also want to sale proceeds from the old house in a joint account. In theory it shouldn't make any difference as marriage means half is yours anyway, but what if MIL "advises" DH to give the money to her so it's harder for you to access it?

Clearly MIL feels culturally entitled to her appalling attitude and isn't going to change it. Any challenge will only bring on more wailing and "illnesses" so unless your DH is prepared to take a firmer line - which seems unlikely - the only solution really is to get out

DH's brother has been divorved 3 times and all 3 firmly say that it is only because of MIL that their marriage broke down

Sadly that doesn't surprise me at all, but I doubt it matters to MIL. Probably all three ex wives are damned as shameless women who've brought disgrace upon the family/community through their disobedience, and no doubt you'd be called the same

In the end, it really does come down to whether you choose cultural complicity or your own sanity; unfortunately, in this situation there don't seem to be many other options

A joint account is no use, it needs to be in her sole name. In a joint account the DH will be entitled to withdraw every penny.

You can have joint accounts that need both signatures though, can't you?

Actually you're right, Cheerbear, but whether the DH would agree to this is something else again. He'd tell his mother of course, and such a suggestion might even push them into removing access to the money completely

What I really had in mind was that, once it was in a joint account, OP could withdraw half of it into her own without necessarily telling him ... though from the sound of things he'd probably think of that too

I'm trying to remember what happened when I split up with my ex... I know I suddenly got a summons to produce all financial details to a court with only a day or two's notice. It gave me a hell of a shock. He only did it to piss me off, as he knew I had no money.

I think the OP needs to consult a solicitor - a good one - immediately, to find out how she can prevent that money from being dispersed. Anything she does now has to be done very quietly so she isn't left with nothing.

True you can have a 'both to sign' account, but in practice it relies upon the bank checking the signing instructions every time a chq/pyt is made, which these days not all chqs are manually checked (limits etc).
It would less risk in this situation, which is the key thing here - a background of an abusive scenario and demanding MIL, for the OP to have 'her share' of the house proceeds in her name only IMO.

I was thinking from a banking perspective but as Juells & puzzled have said, reaching that arrangement of a sole account may be very tricky, and you don't want them to withdraw the lot now whilst it's still in DH's name. What an awful situation OP.

I would also be concerned about the level of contact you allow your DC to have with your in-laws, as they really do sound toxic. And I would also take the threat to get custody of the baby seriously, so you should get legal advice on contact ASAP as well.

I'm so sorry you're going through this, OP?

you don't want them to withdraw the lot now whilst it's still in DH's name

Yes, that's exactly what would worry me, which is why a solicitor's advice is surely needed urgently. Trouble is, OP said she's "already told him that if he doesn't make a decision today, I shall walk out" so goodness knows what's happening in the meantime

I hate to say it, but even the legal position could get difficult if DH/MIL decide to ignore the law in favour of their cultural choices. It wouldn't be the first time this has happened, and that could leave OP without the funds to access legal advice

Just lost a bloody long post. I apologize if I haven't made some things clear.
My parents live abroad and I am in the UK.
On D day, I did announce I am going to my parent's and booking my ticket but MIL's sister mentioned it would be a case of abduction if I travel with baby without my husband.
Dnt know if it would help but PIL live in Richmond.

Lizzie Should i take that threat seriously? Can they actually take my DD away from me?!
I have a better paid job that DH and can support myself and DD without him though I do believe I am entitled to half the money from the house sale.
I do not even want my DD to have any contact at all with that evil person.

Happypoobum I know it seems like a stupid decision but DH has always been very supportive of my career, pulled his weight at home and even when I was going through a very difficult ans high risk pregnancy, he was an absolute star. I believed and trusted him when he said it would only be temporary. He was also very upset about FIL's illness and seemed like the only way he would ever be happy again would be to move in to bring support to his parents.

All 3 of BIL's wives left him due to the way MIL treated them but BIL is an absolutely spineless good-for-nothing and never had/has the guts to stand up to his mum. DH on the other hand tries his best to keep his mum in check but she is always doing some kind of fainting,crying melodrama and that makes DH weak.

I am going to ask DH about my share of the money and see what happens...?

I apologise about the late replies. Baby is being very difficult and I feel it might be because I am projecting my stress onto her

ZenNudist I think that chat is long overdue you are right. He needs to do it,whether they listen or not. Atleast he should do it for my sake.

YummySushi I am so sorry you had to go through all this. My situation is VERY VERY similar to yours. I am so close to a mental breakdown and it would be so wrong when I have this tiny baby to take care of... but I am glad I stood up to her. Atleast I let some steam off instead of bottling up my emotions again.

but MIL's sister mentioned it would be a case of abduction if I travel with baby without my husband.

Bitch. You can see the way the wind's blowing. You definitely can't take the baby out of the country without your DH's agreement, but there's nothing to stop you if he agrees. The same thing applies the other way round, naturally.

It's hopeful that your DH is more responsible than your BiL. Why not do a half-way thing, of renting a flat for yourself? While staying on good terms with your DH. Consult a solicitor as soon as possible so you know all your rights.

Any custody issues have to be resolved in the country the child normally lives in.

You’ll need legal advice if it is coming to that.

In the mean time look at rentals. And get that share of the house money, you can use the excuse it’s tax efficient to put your share in an isa etc.

You can't take your baby out of the country if your OH doesn't agree, but you can CERTAINLY take her out of your inlaws house and move elsewhere.

I was really glad to read that you're working and earning what sounds like a good wage, so you would definitely be able to survive if you decide to leave.
If I were you, I would leave (just the house not the country) and take DD with me. Whether or not your DH agrees to go with you is up to him.

As regards the money for the house that was sold, not trying to be nosy, but did you & DH buy that house together or did he own it originally? If you bought it between you, then you're definitely entitled to your share.

It would be a good idea for you to see a solicitor, especially about the money from the house sale, but as regards the whole situation in general, ie: what would happen as regards custody towards DD if you did leave DH etc?

Finally, I just wanted to say that I think you're a brave strong lady and will be well able to handle this situation whatever happens.

You don't need an agreement under 30 days - but it depends on the country you are going to, if that helps

I think you really need to see a family law solicitor, one with experience in the Hague Convention and international child law. I'd say you could probably take the child to your parent's for a break, with a definite date of return on the return ticket, but the moment you refuse to return or start setting up residence (get a job, a flat etc), I do believe it's considered child abduction.

At this point you do need to get your share of the house money. The problem is that he's going to see your request, not as part of being in an equal partnership, but as taking what it 'his' because you are preparing to leave him. So ask a solicitor about that, too. At the very least, ask him to put your name on the account as a gesture of 'trust' or 'partnership', whatever you think might work. Once it's done you can move 1/2 of the money to a sole account. Sneaky, but needs must when the devil drives.

Yes, it's quite reasonable to ask for the money to be put into a joint account, it's joint money. Presumably you paid towards the mortgage as well. If you ask him to set up a joint account (or do so yourself) and he doesn't want to move the money into it, that's another warning sign. You need to start making note of everything, not thinking of each individual thing as isolated incidents. You need to know where you stand.

It's a shame that your parents live abroad, as yes, you leaving and takng the baby to theirs - even if your intention is simply to go and stay with them for support - looks very different in the eyes of the law to your simply moving out with your baby.

HOWEVER - as primary carer, then yes you can absolutely do the latter and there is fuck all anyone can do about that. And that is what I suggest you do in order to show both your DH and his utter cows of female relatives that no, you have no intention of staying to be bullied.

I would do this:

1. Stop engaging with the MIL or her sister. They are no longer relevant. Try and conserve your energy for more important things and also disengage so that you feel less stressed.

1. Gather paperwork. Proof of the money from the sale of the house, bank statements, etc.

1. Look for a flat to rent. Have a good think about location. Make it as near as possible to your work, but as far away as you can reasonably be from your MIL's house. If you work round the corner then that's awkward, but I imagine you don't. Your excuse for making sure that you and your DD are out of range for MIL doorstepping or anyone just turning up and harassing will be that you need to be close to work.

1. See a solicitor. Explain that you are moving out, with your baby as you are obviously primary carer, as a result of verbal abuse and harrassment from family members. Maybe see a solicitor with expertise in this area who has represented Asian women before? - sadly your situation is not unusual. As your inlaws if not your H will try their best to gain custody of the baby, you need to straight away get a residence order that will specify that the baby lives with you. This will mean that should your inlaws try and take the baby, or your H refuse to return the baby after contact or try and take the baby away, the police will have the power to bring your baby back to you swiftly. Without a residence order, it's more complicated and the police wouldn't be able to remove the baby from her dad without a court order, which you'd have to apply for and argue that you are primary carer. So get in there, see a solicitor as soon as you are ready to move out and get that residence order.

1. Leave as planned and then have a very very frank talk with your DH. He can now see that you are fucking serious. You are gone. You have residence of YOUR baby and there is nothing the PIL can do about it; as the baby is so young, there's going to be absolutely no ongoing relationship that PIL can even use to argue for contact. Also as baby is so young, contact for your DH will be at your new place anyway and they are not welcome.

Make it crystal clear to your DH that unless he wants to end up like his brother, living with his parents alone like an overgrown toddler and a failed marriage behind him, then he needs to make a decision - you and his child or his parents. Firstly, he transfers half of the value of the house to your account right now OR you will simply go ahead with filing for divorce and the paperwork from your house sale clearly states what funds should be coming to you. If he's happy to do that and show good faith, then you can talk. Talk about a new home a decent distance away from PIL, talk about rules going forward which include clear boundaries with PIL, some bloody respect from your H and it being made very clear to MIL that if she cannot show you and your family respect, then she gets none back and there will be no contact with you and the baby.

Is there any chance your parents could come to the UK to give you morale support for when you leave

Superb advice from Fizzy and others; I really can't improve on all that

Just to say, though, that DH "trying his best" with MIL but "becoming weak" in the face of the fainting and general hysteria is no excuse at all. If he's any kind of a man he must be able to see this for the pure manipulation it is, so the rest of it is up to him unless he wants his own family to join the queue of MIL-induced divorces

And I still think the priority should be legal advice ...

We’re you legally married? And did you contribute to the mortgage while you lived in your previous house?

While you still have the ability to be emotionally present for your daughter and have your sanity, you should leave. Your husband is choosing to put MILs needs above yours.