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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

To see the Headteacher over this?

87 replies

Wishfulmakeupping · 18/06/2018 13:28

Have posted recently about thus all apologies if familiar but in a nutshell...
My very confident and socially dd started foundation last September.
Since then she’s gradually been going downhill- lashing out at her little brother, worries a lot, lost her confidence and sass really.
Last few weeks been in our bed every night she will go to school but worries beforehand.
Spoken to dd and teacher several times. Dd is unhappy as one girl I’ll call her Anna is very bossy and dominant over dd letting her play sometimes excluding her other times- happening for months. Recently Anna has been asking other dc to say things to my dd nasty comments, or leaving her out.
Last week I was in tears to teacher as dd has been so fretful of school and been having accidents, not able to sleep etc.
Teacher spoke to Anna and the other girls and said it was in hand- the next day at sports day dd came last in every race bless her and Anna shouted out ‘x is a loser’ teacher made her apologise.
Teacher has said to me it’s in hand but that she will not be speaking to Anna’s parents about her behaviour as ‘it’s not part of their long term plan’ ?!
Mentioned to teacher that if things didn’t improve this week then Dh would like to take things further her response was (and she was clearly annoyed) ‘I’ve spoke to head about it so go to her if you want to that’s your right’
Should I be going to head at this point?

OP posts:

Thespringsthething · 18/06/2018 14:17

It's actually really important for Anna's development that she learns that this behaviour isn't acceptable and how to be kinder. She's little and can learn at this stage- unfortunately if she gets laughs from other children/bonds with them more, then the teacher does nothing, the behaviour is reinforced. It is in both children's best interest to get this bullying stopped and I agree setting it all out in a clear email with the issues and your expectations (having read their anti-bullying policy) and then making an appointment to see the head is the way forward.

sallythesheep73 · 18/06/2018 14:20

I like this:

'You will probably find Anna's mum/ dad are either a) super rough and the school are scared of them b) connected to the school somehow - TA, classroom helper, on the PTA, and therefore 'untouchable'.'

there is one of these in DD's class and its obvious she dominates all the other kids and no one else gets a word in edgeways - her Mum is head of govs and her Dad works at the school. Ha ha ha!

Its so sad.

soapboxqueen · 18/06/2018 14:23

There's a couple of things that stand out for me. The fact that Anne was so blatent in her name calling eg loudly in front of the teacher. Indication of a 'plan' being in place (which shouldn't have been mentioned to you) . The teacher basically telling you to go to the head.

I think there is a plan in place for this child's behaviour but that it is not working or is not being supported by SLT. So the teacher is frustrated that they cannot really achieve anything. Knowing this, the teacher may have suggested a class move as one of the few ways she can make things better for your child. In such a situation heads can be very dismissive if staff struggling with the poor behaviour of one child.

Yes I was speak to the Head. Be very clear about what is happening, the impact on your dd and what you want to have happen. Be on the look out for the head trying to push responsibility back into the class teacher as ultimately the responsibility is theirs not the class teacher.

RoseWhiteTips · 18/06/2018 14:27

Yes, it needs to be moved up level now. The teacher is not dealing effectively with the situation.

RoseWhiteTips · 18/06/2018 14:28

*moved up a level

totalcontrol · 18/06/2018 14:29

'You will probably find Anna's mum/ dad are either a) super rough and the school are scared of them

Really? I thought the opposite.That they are the 'great and the good' , or school governors

Original poster

Wishfulmakeupping · 18/06/2018 14:33

I’m the pta Mum not Anna’s parents, they aren’t ‘rough’ they seem nice very quiet, not from this country possibly Polish? I’m assuming either divorced or going through a separation.
Going to review the anti bullying policy tonight and request meeting tomorrow- should the request be written? Thinking I need a paper trail starting at this point?

OP posts:

Myotherusernameisbest · 18/06/2018 14:34

Yes, please go to the head. This really needs to be nipped in the bud and it does not sound like its being dealt with by that teacher. The fact she is visibly annoyed with you speaks volumes.

My ds was older (year 4) when his bullying started. Started like this with name calling, being excluded, turning other kids on him and it took me too long to realise the actual impact it was having and it turned my happy, bubbly out going little boy into a quiet, timid and often angry one. I still feel awful I hadn't realised the seriousness and scope of it sooner as 2 years on we are still dealing with the fallout from it. The bullying eventually turned into violence against him.

I really really really wish I'd have listened to him better and acted sooner and been straight up that school instead of thinking he must be over reacting /must be more to it/ thinking the teachers would have this all in hand. The teachers were doing F all about it.

WindyWednesday · 18/06/2018 14:35

Yes, escalate to HT. ask for a time frame for improvements, after which you will contact governors.

MerryMarigold · 18/06/2018 14:36

Definitely move dd to other class. It will help, especially with gap of summer hols. This happened to my ds i reception and year 1 and has deeply affected him. He finally moved in y2 because his y1 teacher could see what reception teacher could not see. Ds1 was a wreck in Reception. Y1 teacher dealt with it much better but he still wasn't free till he moved class. Take it typo Head definitely. However you may seem you have to defend your dd. I so regret not fighting harder for him, kept thinking it would get better, or maybe it was issues at home, or just him.

I'd also look into you're dd's general development. My ds was a bit delayed, nothing drastic but made him more vulnerable both to bad teachers and unkind kids (difficulty concentrating, behind academically, difficulty with motor skills), which he was all very aware of as his 'friends' were all super clever. So with the start of school he was dealing with:

being bullied by kids
being told off a lot by teacher
feeling bad that he was not where his friends were in terms of writing/ reading etc (they also pointed it out)

He's a very sensitive boy, even now at 12, and that year really hurt him.

BlueSapp · 18/06/2018 14:37

You definitely need to go to the Head, this school is not putting your childs welfare first whatever the reason, I would ask them straight out why? and take it from there, It maybe a case where you will need to escalate this to the board of governors or the local authority if they refuse to sort her out, Its not minor your child has been effected emotionally and behaviorally by this other ones behavior its not on.

StaplesCorner · 18/06/2018 14:48

yeah, my kids were on the receiving end of "Anna" and we were told if we didn't like it we could see the Head. Then he said if we didn't like it, we could always leave. You can see where this is going OP. We were polite and conciliatory - that was our mistake. Go in, say its not ok, YOU need to sort it out.

And don't start questioning your DD's development or personality etc., Anna's are everywhere.

montenuit · 18/06/2018 14:58

Definitely go to the head.
Personally i would move her - she doesn't need this "Anna" in her life - kids change and make friends many times at this age, it's not like moving at age 9 or 13.

MerryMarigold · 18/06/2018 14:59

It's good to look at the bigger picture and question that there may be issues making the bullying worse. Not that you don't deal with Anna, but that you deal with everything. It's a big mistake to bury your head in the sand about any of it.

Screaminginsideme · 18/06/2018 15:34

Read up on relationship aggression.
It is often dismissed as girls being girls.
It is bullying and it’s can be stopped.
Often the parents aten’t Aware their girl is the mean girl.

Rockandrollwithit · 18/06/2018 15:41

In some schools the SLT do not support individual teachers to deal with behaviour like this effectively. As a teacher, I have been in a similar situation and have encouraged parents to take it to the Head directly. This resulted in the child getting the support they needed, which was above and beyond what a class teacher alone could provide.

Sounds to me like the teacher is also frustrated but her hands are tied.

Charmatt · 18/06/2018 15:48

Anna is behaving in a manner which is repeatedly upsetting your daughter emotionally. Anna's treatment of your daughter is sustained (and has not improved by teacher intervention). This the definition of bullying that schools will recognise, in line with guidance. I would want to meet with the headteacher and send them an email in advance to provide detail on the sustained, repeated behaviour that is hurting your child. At the meeting, ask them why their action has not yet improved the situation and what they are intending to do to resolve it.

www.gov.uk/bullying-at-school/bullying-a-definition

SpringerLink · 18/06/2018 15:50

Invite Anna over to play. Try letting her and your DD be friends. I'm not crazy suggesting this, I have been through this with one of my children. The "Anna" in our case just didn't really know how to make friends and the negative attention she gave my DC was a misguided attempt to interact. They did become friends of sorts, and got on a lot better at school after a few play dates at home.

By all means, speak to the HT. But remember that any issues that Anna and her family have will be confidential. Ask for more support for your DD in school, but also be there to support her interacting with Anna too. If noting else, she needs to learn that what Anna says is irrelevant and Anna's opinion of her is not important.

NewName54321 · 18/06/2018 17:02

Speak to the headteacher. Do not approach Anna's parents. There probably is a back- story which explains the behaviour, but that is not your issue. Stick to what you and the school can do to keep your DD safe and happy.

I'd take up the offer to move DD to the other class - this will distance her from Anna and the other girls she is influencing. If she can move straight away then so much better as September is a long way off if you are little and unhappy.

However, I wouldn't ask for DS to change classes - every class group has different dynamics and he won't necessarily have problems, just because DD has.

StormTreader · 18/06/2018 17:06

" The "Anna" in our case just didn't really know how to make friends and the negative attention she gave my DC was a misguided attempt to interact. "
"Anna shouted out ‘x is a loser’"

Thats a REALLY misguided way to try and be friends.....

Screaminginsideme · 18/06/2018 17:08

There isn’t always a back story. Not every bully has issues at home!

It is also irrelevant.
Bullying should be stopped - full stop.

EndOfEternity · 18/06/2018 17:29

Inviting ‘Anna’ over to okay has pros and cons. It may work if it’s low level issues that can easily be managed but this sounds more engrained. It is possibly introducing the bullying behaviour to the previously safe home environment. Plus it could give Anna home-based ammunition to use at school.

I persisted and had our forceful and outspoken ‘bully’ to our home. It helped me understand where it was coming from as she exhibited the same derogatory behaviour her mother does (who does a lot with school). School has responded by trying to boost the ‘bully’s’ self confidence with positions of power at the expense of further wrecking our DDs self confidence.

All I can suggest is persistence with school and support from MN

Pengggwn · 18/06/2018 17:34

If the girl is genuinely bullying the OP's DD, having her over to play will not work. It will just make DD feel insecure.

montenuit · 18/06/2018 18:26

definitely do NOT invite Anna over. Your dd will feel undermined and that you're not on her side inviting this girl into her safe space, home.

I agree a playdate can help if kids are struggling to get along, but this is not the case. Anna and her behaviour is well beyond this.

Screaminginsideme · 18/06/2018 18:46

We’ve all been there with nasty girl behaviour.
When we had a final straw moment with DD I went straight to the teacher who thankfully has the same opinion of nasty girls that I do.
My H also pulled a great passive aggressive move by messaging said childs father- ‘DD has been rather upset tonight, we’re not sure what’s causing this, can you see if your DD knows anything.’

Father of bully was mortified when his precious princess admitted to being a nasty, vindictive bully and she was made to apologise by him. then the teacher called them in and gave them some home truths about her behaviour. She has been much better since and knows to leave my DD and her mates alone. The girls have had enough of her and her small group of crones so she is kept at a distance. She has tried to control them all the way through school. Dad is lovely but mum won’t even look at me.

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