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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

AIBU to be shocked by seeing a whole new side to DHs opinions of women?

86 replies

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:07

Apologies if this is a bit rambling, but I had an argument with DH last night, and it has left me reeling a bit.
We had just come back from a weekend away, at a very nice country resort. Had a very nice time and came back pretty tired. So we were relaxing on the sofa last night, and DH brings up a recent story in the news about a female football pundit getting a “round of applause” from a male pundit (google it if you haven’t read it...I am rubbish at adding links 😆) and the obvious social media furore it caused. He said he thought everyone was overreacting and needed to “calm down now”, I disagreed and also felt the clapping and comments were patronising from the male pundit. I also pointed out that, ok maybe everyone was getting very heated on social media, but what dh needed to grasp was that this is an example of something women face EVERY DAY, so seeing it on a public forum, and a massive global news network, might spark some fairly strong feelings!
At this point he said I was now patronising HIM, and he could understand perfectly well the significance of it, but that people were still over reacting. Basically now this conversation had descended into a full on bunfight and I reminded him of all the shit women put up with (including my own experiences) on a daily basis. To level the playing field dh then said “well, it works both bloody ways you know!”. So, to address the balance of sexist experiences, to give me some insight into the male struggle he gave this example....
Wait for it....
Now, don’t get too upset ladies with a delicate disposition...
Once...when he was out running, a drunk woman...yes, a WOMAN, came out of a pub as he ran past and told him he had a “nice arse”.

Seriously. This is how he justified the “ it works both ways” argument. I then recounted a few examples of my own experiences of misogyny and sexism (the usual, we all know) and rather than feeling shocked or upset, he said “well, I have lost business because women have used their tits to get what they want”. Hmm.

I then said that, firstly maybe these women you speak of have learnt that the only way to get noticed in his industry is to exploit their looks, or maybe, just maybe they might actually be better than him and won the business on their own merit...that maybe the fact that they are attractive (or have tits) is just totally, fucking irrelevant!!! I now just tell him to simply Fuck off, which offends him. I say that he has told me to fuck off before, he’s just upset that this time I said it first.
This is followed up by dh saying things like “you have no idea what you’re talking about”, “you don’t understand “ and all that crap. I am left downstairs in tears, thinking “what don’t I understand? Being a woman? Dealing with sexism? Being judged by my gender? Missing out on stuff because I’m female?”
Dh husband has just taken my anger away and used it for himself!!! He’s nicked feminism off me!!!! I’m fuming!!!!!

So I get up this morning, still angry. I totally admit I was stomping around and wouldn’t speak to him. He says (sarcastically) “ nice to see your feeling so contrite this morning”.
WTAF !!!

Am I BU to tell him to go fuck himself? I feel like strutting around the house wearing a red dress and white hood, just so he feels the balance has been redressed. Why is he doing this? Why is it he can’t simply accept that it doesn’t simply “work both ways”? I am so sick of my anger being diluted and being made to feel that, just because I have a successful career and access to toilets, san pro, health care etc, that I don’t have the right to feel that life is not balanced, that I shouldn’t feel the same anger that there are women out there who don’t have the opportunities that I have? AIBU to think my dh cannot call himself a feminist?

OP posts:
auntiebasil · 18/06/2018 10:11

How old is he? He sounds like a child.

NewYearNewMe18 · 18/06/2018 10:12

You both sound very childlike.

Elkcuhc56 · 18/06/2018 10:17

You both sound like children

HyenaHappy · 18/06/2018 10:18

Goodness, what dramatics from both of you.

I do agree with you that he sounds incredibly naive and immature around matters of everyday sexism.

Shoxfordian · 18/06/2018 10:18

Nope he can't call himself a feminist
Did you know he had all these sexist views before you married him?

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:18

AuntieBasil...he is a grown adult, I promise 😆

NewYear..I’m a grown up too. Sometimes grown ups argue.

OP posts:
steff13 · 18/06/2018 10:19

Does your husband claim to be a feminist?

He sounds ridiculous. Also, I personally consider refusing to speak to someone to be emotionally abusive.

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:20

He really needs sent usually like this. I think that’s why I am so upset by it. I couldn’t believe how tearful I was last night. I grew up in an environment of domestic abuse, and confrontation does really upset me. He is nothing like my father, but any raised voice and I just go to pieces.

I think to compare us to children is a little harsh

OP posts:
wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:20

*isn't

My fat fingers, sorry

OP posts:
Hogtini · 18/06/2018 10:21

Err

AIBU to be shocked by seeing a whole new side to DHs opinions of women?
wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:21

Steff, to explain, its not that I am refusing to speak to him exactly. I just can’t. I don’t know what to say to not cause another argument

OP posts:
NewYearNewMe18 · 18/06/2018 10:22

Over use of the phrase 'emotionally abusive' - don't trot it out every time someone has a different opinion.

teaandtoast · 18/06/2018 10:24

Er, shame about the spelling, @Hogtini.

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:25

Hyena- you have a point. Very dramatic I do agree, but yes his niaivety was a bit of a shock

OP posts:
Hogtini · 18/06/2018 10:26

Damn internet memes!! Blush

steff13 · 18/06/2018 10:27

Over use of the phrase 'emotionally abusive' - don't trot it out every time someone has a different opinion.

I didn't trot it out, that's how I feel. How about don't chastise other people for having an opinion different from yours.

And, giving someone the silent treatment is actually well documented as being a form of emotional abuse.

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:29

I guess I just thought we were a team, you know, that we agreed on all this stuff. I just hate it when he swears at me and I hate myself for getting so bloody upset by it. I’m still bloody crying !!!

We hardly ever argue, I mean so rarely, and we have been together 20+ years. but now I just feel so tired and pissed off.

OP posts:
wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:30

And Steff, to clarify I have not given him the silent treatment. I’m just a bit huffy. I’m not walking around with a fake smile on my face pretending I feel fine. Surely that would be worse?

OP posts:
Slanetylor · 18/06/2018 10:31

Where do we think everyday sexism come from though? It’s so ingrained in men they don’t know it’s there. Read: don’t care.

NewYearNewMe18 · 18/06/2018 10:35

And, giving someone the silent treatment is actually well documented as being a form of emotional abuse.

Yes it is ONE of the signs, but in isolation as a one off it isn't - but then not engaging is called being adult. This is no-win situation really in your eyes- the solutions are thus:

  • engage and have a screaming row = abusive
  • disengage and not be drawn = abusive, giving her 'the silent treatment'
  • agree with the other party = abusive, not fulfilling her needs to have a screaming row.

FYI - I deal with DV situations daily, I don't need lessons from someone in an armchair on what the threshold markers are but more importantly WHEN to apply them.

Mrsharrison · 18/06/2018 10:37

He needs educating on feminism. But I don't think you're the right person to do it because your passion gets him on the defensive.
Don't let this fester. Just go up to him and say let's not fall out over this.
Bring the subject up at a later time but do your homework and produce statistics on inequality.

Men usually respond well to hard facts in black and white.

RB68 · 18/06/2018 10:38

This is where the whole argument of privilege fits in - did he feel threatened by the drunken woman - could she have overpowered him was she aggressive etc, is he subject to every day ongoing abuse from many women

wiccamum · 18/06/2018 10:42

Thank you Mrsharrison, sound advice .i know we need to talk but I get upset so easily...and passionate!

And RB68, I don’t think he felt threatened. He seemed to just want to find away to show that men get sexist abuse too, a point I agree with. My response to him was that, when that incident happened he actually came home and thought it was a bit funny but when I was sexually harassed at work, well, I didn’t find it very funny.

OP posts:
FizzyGreenWater · 18/06/2018 10:42

Where do we think everyday sexism come from though? It’s so ingrained in men they don’t know it’s there. Read: don’t care.

This, but I'd also say, with a lot of 'nicer' men who are generally not testosterone-fuelled thugnuts, it's not so much 'don't care' as 'it actually takes a fair bit of intelligence to truly see it.'

I've had conversations a bit like this with 'ok' men who have argued passionately in ways fairly similar to your DH. When you discuss in detail, you eventually come up against the fact that they simply can't think it through at that level. Their ability to stand outside of their own experience and see how it works at an abstract level, and to really grasp how it works is missing. You need to be quite intelligent to see it. It's also quite difficult to explain it in the abstract rather than as 'this is what happens to me' - so if you get two people getting upset about it, the point is rarely made well.

OP's H doesn't sound mega bright.

FizzyGreenWater · 18/06/2018 10:43

Unfortunately the message here is not to have relationships with thick men.

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