Continuing the discussion around instagram influencers and ethics

[bawbles]

Continued from old thread

Arumdo -I tried to listen to it but it was just not the kind of thing I'm set to deal with and listen too 🤢 But yes she's promoted the gushworthy Dolly Alderton and her book several times. I prefer the midwifery stuff and the recent posts she's done but this whole insta-influencer personality stuff is just not for me.

@boredandtired tap the IGTV film and an X comes up at the top.

The podcast interview was very neutral. If you’d not followed the whole thing from the beginning and seen the comments and discussions, you would think very differently about what happened. I thought Clemmie came across very well, she’d clearly given a lot of thought about how to come across. However, she presents herself as passive to the whole episode.

Surprised that Abby mnetter likes weeslice. She massively jumped on the hating mn bandwagon a few months ago and ripped I to ALL mnetter. She is really vile when criticised and is big on crying/blank facing in stories with kids screaming in the background. She used some awful choice language about mnetters too. I used to like her feed until then and until she did get ridiculous meet up and then complained about the attendees eating all the food.

Interestingly sjv popped up on my explore page explore discussing ethics and I was impressed. I'm following again as she does seem to be following mp in addressing the issues.

Surely anyone on Insta with any brain cells must know that arguing against transparency and child exploitation is not gonna end well......

Susie JV has storied (is that a word??) about influencers/ads. Her turnaround from calling all mners rabid psychos or whatever it was to where she is now is bloody admirable. I always thought she was funny but now I can follow her again guilt free

I've just watched SJV's story about Influencers and that's a huge difference to what she said previously - really pleased she's formed a balanced view and hopefully realised that the MN conversations are only happening here because of the deleting/blocking/hostility to them on Insta.

@bakingnovice it was me who mentioned wee slice, i think she is really good fun on there and I enjoy that she's not conforming to the beautiful feed/styled dc/insta house norms. I think there's room for everyone on there and it's interesting to see people's quirks/niches

I'm glad to hear SJV is talking sense - I've always liked her and was so unimpressed by the "vipers nest" comments a few months ago.

I've just listened to that podcast - what a lot of rubbish under the guise of trying to be insightful and progressive. Firstly, the suggestion that MoD got all the flak while FOD has been allowed to do whatever he likes in terms of parenting and paid partnerships without criticism is just not true. We all remember the potty pic which he has since removed.

I really thought MoD came across well, and I like her a lot but I thought her response about the double standard in social media/parenting between men and women was interesting. She talked about how women are expected to "know better" - they make all the decisions about what to eat, etc. when they're pregnant, they make decisions about how to feed the baby, etc. and men take a bit of a back seat and are given the benefit of the doubt in terms of parenting. Which I agree with but the reason MN has such an issue with FoD is because of this awful hapless, overwhelmed dad routine he does where he gets into trouble with Clemmie for forgetting things on the shopping list, balancing kids on wardrobes, posting pictures of the twins on the potty, etc.

I feel as though MoD is in a position to change perceptions and attitudes of the mother/father/daughter dynamic but FoD is perpetuating it.

I freaking love susie.

@BeautyBox - I agree. I have now listened to the podcast, well the bit with MoD anyway. The webcast was introduced in the screenshot so it was fairly obvious that the agenda had been set and certainly not how many people saw events unfold. There was no debate, conversation or discussion about the things that really matter - the role that social media plays in causing depression, anxiety and inferiority in some people and about the monetisation of children and their rights. It was a defensive, self-congratualtory, cosy chat basically validating the right to continue unchanged. What really made me laugh out loud was the disingenuous claim not to care about the figures and never to check them - really quite at odds with the "say what!" Insta story circling her followers! Clearly I will be told to stop following if I don't like it and, quite clearly, I will reply by saying that silencing criticism, comment and debate is dangerous, controlling behaviour.

...... and yes, she is a willing and knowing partner in FoD's oh so contrived exploitation of his children. She can't have it both ways - being a champion of parenting rights and the commercialisation of her own children.

If an influencer shares a specific discount code for us to use and implies that something has been gifted but don't tag it #gifted, the code suggests that there has been some discussion and agreement behind the scenes (to set it all up) so therefore it's...... #ad??

Saw that Mrs M screenshotted on stories a negative comment on her YouTube account about advertising along with her response, claiming she's "always transparent". She's good at tagging certain things, granted, but the Neilson thing is evidence that they don't do full disclosure. There's some kind of arrangement there and they've still never said what. Shady.

I saw that too @SpongeBobGrannyPants . Laughable!

I totally understand some of your points; but If you don't like these people/don't agree with their lifestyle choices why do you watch/look? Before anyone jumps down my throat I am just genuinely interested.

And it's very much got the tone of "say something negative about me and I'll delete your comments and/or name and shame you so you can be attacked by all my fan girls"@theladylovescupcakes THAT is why normal people don't tend to say anything remotely negative, questioning or critical on Instagram. It's just asking for an attack from all their bloody fans.

@ginandnappies I can only speak for myself but I have unfollowed a lot. Some still have some content that interests me but that doesn't mean they're above any critical discussion or comment. Some people get frustrated that the person/account they once loved has sold out and not remained true to their initial area of interest or values.

What really made me laugh out loud was the disingenuous claim not to care about the figures and never to check them - really quite at odds with the "say what!" Insta story circling her followers!

What do you mean by this? What happened?

@SpongeBobGrannyPants thank you! I totally see your point of view, I have some I have unfollowed due to my own reasons. X

You know how it often gets thrown around that anyone who says anything remotely critical about instamums is just jealous... and it's a bit like "ok Susan, I'm sure jealous of those free persil liquid tabs you were gifted 🙄" but I've found a new account on Instagram that is genuinely envy inducing!Debbies_house - She has an outdoor pool AND pool house! I don't know enough about her yet to know if she's shady or honest but just wanted to mention her as I know there a few people interested in interiors on here. Her house is bloody amazing #notanad

@ginandnappies

I started following lots of people and have deleted the ones that annoy me. That’s just life. Others I enjoy but disagree with some elements of their practice (usually transparency, unprofessional responses to feedback and too many or inappropriate ads)

For example I enjoy SJV feed and stories but strongly disagreed with her intial response to mumsnet discussions. I continued to follow as that was one incident and I enjoyed the rest of her content. Since then she’s changed her approach to the criticism around transparency so I’m glad I didn’t unfollow as I mostly find her pretty entertaining.

I liken it to politics - I don’t support Trump or even live in the USA but that doesn’t stop me hearing about his views/actions and having an opinion on them.

I didn’t see everything that happened with MOD but did see some followers going nuts and really hounding her (repeatedly posting on unrelated topics ‘I know what you did etc etc). Now I don’t know the background (it read like she’d sent a snippy response to a dm questioning something) but recall she apologised but one follower continued hounding her wanting to expose her etc and it was mental. Very uncomfortable to read and despite knowing that she had possibly started this situation by not disclosing information I felt sorry for her.

I think the influencers who can handle the conversation well (MP, Erica Davies etc) will do well but the ‘delete and block’ or ‘it’s none of your business approach’ won’t work for much longer.

@bawbles there's the accounts that wish to engage and have actually entered into constructive discussion and are interesting to follow but the child monetising accounts (or those that support them) seem to have a sod ISO kind of insta arrogance. Your reference to MOD and what happened, I didn't feel sorry for her overall (could've at one point) but her dm to Laura was quite telling. It must be hard to manage large accounts when things kick off but there's a definite need to be careful how you present yourself and whilst she's now trying to present as careful and measured her previous responses show that this is just an act for the account to keep her fame rolling.
The midwifery is good because this is one area she's clearly got a great professional reputation and is good at her job. It's shy I followed originally, but I don't find most of it very real. Lots of points raised on here seem to have been taken on board-including how FOD always fawns over her and that she never does the same, low and behold the bit I've seen has some gushing FOD posts/stories, it's all a bit contrived. But that's the brand and it's good money so I'll just stay unfollowed and let them get on with it.
The meldrums are just awful. They quite often screenshot comments or questions, I now find him weird and too much, she's saying she's transparent but they are anything but. I've seen more of their kids than my own.
I'm also going to unfollow upallhours who I thought were pretty good for parents, although they seem to be part of the Jamie Oliver/jimmy's kitchen clan, but every other post is about alcohol, fecking wine weds, rose gin Thursday and gin Friday, constantly rewarding themselves with alcohol for minor parenting achievements which is so dull and disappointing. Very privileged people yet again presenting the 'just like you' account but they are not really.
Much prefer the photo accounts or smaller ones that are not just trying to make lucrative businesses.

*sod ISO -typo special

@boredandtired what was the Dm to Laura? I just saw the backlash.

I’ve not seen upallhours but I unfollowed a similar account called upallnight blog and that was similar. Lots of bikini shots and constant talk of alcohol. Lots of engagement with other (bigger) influencers which felt disingenuous and the odd comment that was completely at odds to the persona being pushed. The content felt like it was just trying to imitate others to monetise so I unfollowed.

I'm not surprised to see influencers starting to discuss fake followers, after Unilever said it is going to cut ties with influencers who cheat the system through fakery. I am sure a few influencers are feeling a bit nervous about the impact of how this will trickle down from the big brands. I remember Martha Lane-Fox was recently aghast that she was on a list of high profile people with fake followers because a past employee of hers had bought them for her. I didn't realise bots just attracted themselves to big accounts in their droves for free though, although even my tiny account seems to get requests from odd people that don't look real. 10,000 though, wow, I can see why you would want to get shot of that amount. Influencers are going to need to be squeaky clean if they want to continue to succeed in this crowded market.