Continuing the discussion around instagram influencers and ethics

[bawbles]

Continued from old thread

@furfugsache

I’m not trying to re write it but I’ve followed Laura with interest since that whole spat yes her feed is carefully curated to show her siblings as these trendy kids (I do wonder if their mother cares that she parades them about?) but there is a very odd way in which she a few others follow her comments and lay into other bloggers now. Maybe they got bored of MOD? They did it to MP too?

It’s not media training that’s needed it’s common sense and emotional intelligence.

The new and improved feed is better but feels stage managed. The beach swimsuit shot was lovely and natural but left a nasty taste in the mouth when Boden reposted it and it became obvious it was just an ad.

The trouble is I'd forgotten about all that and was following her quite happily, but that just shows how shallow it all is because now I've remembered why it all got so awful and that I was appalled by a lot of her comments.
With regard to the ridiculous statements that selling your kids is the sabe as bringing them up vegan or religious, I can't even believe someone would type that.
And vegans get a lot of flack.
It's not the same. A child can make their own mind up, change their diet, change their religion, they can't relive their childhood and remove their internet footprint 🙄

So it’s odd when Laura features her siblings on her feed but ok when Mod/FOD show the twins as it’s their choice. It’s odd when Laura’s friends comment on each other’s posts but ok when other big bloggers comment on their mates’ posts? Got it.

She came back with a new look and feel to her feed she obviously took on board what people wanted her to talk about ex midwifery yet it stil feels staged? She can’t win

As for that Boden pic it wasn’t an ad she posted it and tagged where it came from as many bloggers do I suspect to reduce the amount of ‘where’s your costume/bag/dress from? Boden re posted it, does that mean it’s an ad? I think MOD is very clear with ads now and always uses the paid partnership thing ?

With regard to the ridiculous statements that selling your kids is the sabe as bringing them up vegan or religious, I can't even believe someone would type that. And vegans get a lot of flack.
It's not the same. A child can make their own mind up, change their diet, change their religion, they can't relive their childhood and remove their internet footprint

How? How is it not the same? You (general you) bang on about babies and children not having a say in putting them online. What about those who only show back shots etc? Still putting their life on IG, but not showing faces. Parental choice when they're a baby/toddler/child as you're the parent. Just like being vegan or religious and foisting your choice upon them.
The same.
When they're older, you don't post if they don't want to be "out there."

Top bit should be bolded, failed there whoops

It's not the same. You cannot compare diet choices and religion with choosing to monetise your children and photograph and share with millions their milestones and private moments and family moments. Those are out there shared forever, all the little bits, the comforters, the tantrums, the first pop on the potty. They cannot erase that and there will be millions who feel they know them regardless. That is in no way like a choice to bring a child up on a vegan diet.
Chloe from Life with Beans does both. Monetises her kids and business via Instagram and blogs and is vegan... but she's actually very good in showing a balanced vegan diet, so can't fault that but the use of kids? Pretty outrageous. And again enabled them to give up work and have both parents at home.

I do prefer the accounts where you just see the back of the child. You wouldn't have loads of random strangers recognising the children wherever they went if you used this approach.

Well I’m pretty sure Boden would have had to have asked for permission to repost the picture complete with “click on link to purchase” on their page. I’d wager that the blogger loophole AKA #gifted #ASAcanttouchthis was used. So yes, my conclusion is that it was an Ad. Whether it met the ASA definition or not I don’t give a monkeys tbh, in my opinion it was promoting Boden. If she didn’t get paid then more fool her.

Well I don't think Boden would request permission. They recently shared a photo of a celeb with her child that is never featured in the press. It was hours before it was removed.
I imagine she's just keen to have a working relationship with them...

I'm still here, thinking the same as @CadyHeron, same old shit.

These threads are very quiet when the discussion sticks to ethics & ASA compliance. As soon as the bitching starts there's hundreds of comments.

I've said it before, why not just have a thread named for what it is, bitching and slagging off certain Instagrammers?

How is it slagging people off to say you disagree with their persistence in using the children to make money?

The splitting of semantic hairs as an attempt to deflect from the real issues and control the narrative feels familiar. And it’s always the same names.

But it's not the same. The only thing the same is you 3. New posters come and go, but many seem to have the same viewpoint, particularly to the hawkers who use their kids. There's no new posters that come on getting upset on their behalf that accounts are discussed for using their kids and dubious disclosure. There's plenty of different voices who come on the threads with similar feelings about accounts blatantly using their children and trying to dupe their followers.
Very few who come to discuss a differing viewpoint, always the same and always derogatory. If you feel the arguments and points are always the same, does that not make them as valid as any other viewpoint?

I’m not trying to re write it but I’ve followed Laura with interest since that whole spat yes her feed is carefully curated to show her siblings as these trendy kids (I do wonder if their mother cares that she parades them about?) but there is a very odd way in which she a few others follow her comments and lay into other bloggers now.

Yes I know what you mean about LH actually. I unfollowed her again as I thought it was all a bit 'holier than thou'. And like MOD and similar are the baddies and Laura and her buddies are the enlightened ones here to show everyone the true way. I totally get where they are coming from and agree with them largely, but the way they go about it is a bit like they are soooooo much better than everyone else.

I think she got a lot of followers after that MOD thing, so probably needs to reconsider the use of children who aren't even hers on her Insta.

@HRHCatherinePrincessofWales

Imo calling people thick, twerps, narcissistic etc is slagging off.

Picking apart peoples insta accounts by criticising what they do on holiday, being judgemental about a swimsuit pic, debating why a family bought a shared ownership property when they appear wealthy (and stating the address, WTF) etc etc is just unpleasant.

Re the "hawking" of kids, I don't see it like that at all. Most of the people mentioned on here featured their kids on their blogs and insta long before they were using them to promote products. The photo's back then would still most likely often have been posed and possibly edited. I do this with my insta pics on my personal account. I don't see the problem with featuring their kids, it's their choice and if the older kids don't want to I'm sure they'll say so.

Picking apart peoples insta accounts by criticising what they do on holiday, being judgemental about a swimsuit pic, debating why a family bought a shared ownership property when they appear wealthy (and stating the address, WTF) etc etc is just unpleasant

This is just another way of saying that only nice comments are valid and anything negative is just ‘hating’.

These people put their entire lives up online and for the sole purpose of attracting as much attention as possible. And you don’t think anyone should be able to voice a negative opinion about that?

I disagree that calling someone narcissistic is slagging them off. Yes, it’s pejorative, but that doesn’t make it untrue. Instagram is predicated on people’s narcissism. Where you fall on its spectrum depends on the lengths you’re prepared to go to to get eyeballs on your pics. Monetising your children is pretty high up on the narcissism scale for me.

These threads are very quiet when the discussion sticks to ethics & ASA compliance. As soon as the bitching starts there's hundreds of comments

Agree Sofia. But also to add, as soon as the bitching about the ODs starts, you and Cady pipe up. Where are you when the discussion is just about ethics or the ASA? You've very little useful to add yourself so you do have a cheek.

I said the swimsuit pic was natural and lovely. I then went on to convey my feelings about how it was tainted for me when it became obvious it was in fact posted to promote Boden to the followers. That is not "just unpleasant", it is called expressing an opinion. Get a grip Sofia.

There's a big difference between accounts that started off with kids featured simply because they are your kids and then attracting deals and money by using your kids. It's widely known that brands will approach families and IGers and there will be a specification for featuring the kids and their involvement, therefore the kids are working and being used by their parents. The 'differing' viewpoint above is simply someone who would happily do this this not really an argument as to why it's acceptable or ok. And for me, yes due to something relatively unique on my account I've been approached 3 times now with deals and the lure of insta fame and promotion in return for my kids privacy and I turned down those offers. After careful consideration, we value their privacy.
It's also interesting the 'take' on debate. I think that people were surprised the house was shared ownership, with the Meldrums for a number of reasons. Not because they 'appear wealthy' although the wage for the property was up to £59000 and I would consider this to be a healthy income for many, if you were near the top.

@frompovertytoprosecco
Re Laura Hesketh, I followed her after the MOD debacle. I can't even remember what her issue with MOD was? I know she had at go at MOD re the Kim Kardashian diet lolly pic (which was ridiculous given so many other insta users and the media had picked up on it). Then from MOD's response to her it became clear Laura has an issue with MOD and had obviously posted negative comments or had a go at her before. MOD quite rightly told her to unfollow (and DM'd her).

My issue with Laura is her insta heavily features her siblings, she tags the brands they wear, they're not #gifted or ad so I assume she is hoping the company tagged picks up on it and sends her some free stuff, or wants to pay her to promote it. So how is she any different or better than any of the other "instamums" you all dislike so much for "hawking" their kids?!

The idea that women can't voice critical opinions because its 'nasty' and 'unkind' is so sexist.

I did comment that the wave of bikini swimsuit empowering photos of normal women did not work on me. I think those photos were personal family photos and I've no idea why you'd share them with millions of people. That's not being bitchy.
One comment I've read crossed a line. It's difficult to use the word thick without sounding a bit rude, but aside from that, twerp and narcissism are quite appropriate words for the discussion.

I don't see the problem with featuring their kids, it's their choice and if the older kids don't want to I'm sure they'll say so.

And for the ones who aren't old enough to voice that opinion: tough shit.