Is she stealing?

[Gracie2906]

LO plays football for local team, lovely little team who did train with older boys until around a year ago when a set of parents from my LO age group took the team on.

The Dad trains the children (I use the world loosely, however he does his best and I appreciate that!) and mother takes the money & organises social events with the help of all us Mums when asked; although our suggestions go ignored.

I'm not convinced this set of parents haven't been 'dipping into' the kitty over the last year, but I have no proof other than a quick calculation of my figures don't match hers - but I can't prove it! So will have to let that slide for the mo!

Anyhow, it's the boys presentation this weekend and this mother has organised a DJ at the cost of £90 which will be paid from the kitty; my issue is our boys have no official kit (they just play in blue!), no training gear (DH asked could be buy some bibs this week for training and was told no, we don't have the funds), no training tracksuits, and some weeks during the winter not even the basic costs of hiring a venue were being covered so consequently it was paid out of the kitty. I said to Mum in question I think we should revisit the DJ idea, ultimately it's a presentation not a party and that's £90 that is the parents money so to speak which could be used towards the children not entertaining the adults - issue is she disagrees with me, she stated both her and husband want the DJ there to help keep the adults there later so more of a night out than presentation. She booked a Bouncy Castle for the children using £30 from kitty for the deposit and £70 of her own money to front the costs with the intention of claiming it back, then decided to cancel it when she realised it needed to be manned at all times consequently losing the £30 deposit paid from the boys kitty but ensuring she had her £70 back. I questioned this and asked her what we are gonna do about the missing £30 now as it's unfair the boys lose it, her response was "nothing we can do, we will live and learn "

I've asked on several occasions for a club bank account to be set up as it would be easier for many parents to pay DD but each time my request has been declined - is she hiding something? I'm concerned!

I don't mind helping at all, but don't want others to think I'm involved in this situ!

Any advice about the DJ would be greatly appreciated - how Can I say I think you're wasting the boys money? Or do you feel she's not? xx

So if they are not even at U6 age yet they are only 4 year olds now? It's mostly meant to be fun and getting involved for that age group surely (and I imagine the DC would prefer a party over training tracksuits ...)

How much do other parents volunteer with the club (I presume since you mention helping a lot in the last 2 weeks, you don't help regularly)? It sounds to me as if they are overwhelmed? Of course setting a bank account up is a good idea, but I can see it might feel like"just one more thing" if they are already doing lots of club related things.

You'd be better to suggest that you set up a proper committee to spread the load (and then volunteer to be treasurer yourself).

Or find another club.

My son has played a team sport since he was 7.
Weekly subs were paid
This covered
Kit - usually a top, own shorts and team socks although they often got a sponsor to provide them.
What about training equipment, balls, pumps, goal nets, cones, etc? These all cost money. Does the team have these?
Training and match pitch fees need paying.
Affiliation / registration with sports body - this covers insurance etc.
Registration and training for coach with sporting body may be needed.
DBS for coaches and volunteers
First aid training for nominated first aiders and first aid kit and supplies.
Christmas party - held in clubhouse and every player brings a plate of food so no costs, funds would cover a present such as boot bag or training top.
End of season presentation same as Christmas only with trophies for players.
Tours or special events usually paid by parents or funded by separate fund raising like bag packing.

You don’t say how much your paying in subs but I would be concerned that you have no kit, is the team registered? Is the team linked to a club or a known team? The FA probably has guidance for running age grade teams on its website - you should take a look. Is the coach registered or qualified, if the team or coach isn’t registered they may not be insured. Do they have DBS and or first aid qualifications? This is a safeguarding matter before you even think about the money.
Where do they train and play matches - if it’s Council owned pitches it will be easy to find out how much these cost. You should be able to do the sums.

When my boys played all kits, training tops, etc. came from local firms sponsoring the team. If they play in a league the financial side definitely needs tightening up.

Anyone who is in the role of treasurer and who is open and honest would automatically produce accounts when asked. Even if they are on the back of a fag packet. It's the automatic thing to do when handling other people's money.

My husband runs our local team. 4 and 5 year olds play on the local field, aren't part of a league and the coaches aren't FA trained (just dad volunteers). Parents pay a token £2 each, pay as you go. It's paid in cash and the coaches keep the money and through the year use it to buy bibs, balls, cones etc. We don't have training tops or a floodlit pitch etc. So it sounds similar to your set up. However, how much do they charge for a training session?? We wouldn't have the funds for discos etc. Presumably they are buying some equipment too, like balls. It gets more serious at U7 level when the coaches have to undertake FA training, we enter a league and play on hired pitches. Still no disco though! If you are part of an official football club there should be an overall committee which you could consider joining. Your team should abide by the committee rules, there will be a Treasurer etc.

If it’s a strong friendship,group, then maybe mention mention in passing to another mum that you are considering other clubs, and you’ll probably find others will come across with you. In our local area, some clubs ahave started putting ‘players wannted’ Notices up, so over the next month or so is the time to start looking, or contacting teams,

My son plays in a local league. My ex husband is actually treasurer and keeps detailed accounts.

The lads all pay £80 upfront each year and £5 a week subs.

My exPIL have sponsored their away kit. They are insured and pay for a coach every week. It's very well organised.

The manager is a local dad and gives up so much time. They actually have their presentation tonight and all the kids will get medals and trophies.

All of the money is accounted for. You need to get this all on a more transparent footing.

Good luck.

£2 a week to train and £3 a Saturday morning to play is what each child is charged x

It doesnt sound right but I think she will try and keep you at arms length.

I think they sound maladministrative rather than dishonest, but the whole thing does sound like a mess. The lack of insurance is a worry - have you all signed waivers? Is anyone CRB checked?

If your DS is keen on or talented at football, I would be looking for a better set up for him. But, considering his very young age, if he's just having fun on a regular play date with his friends, kicking a ball around a field, I would let him continue. However I would not be fundraising or associating myself with the people running it, in case their messiness ended up reflecting on me.

£5 per week sounds a lot for a non registered team.
You have said you have no kit, what about balls, bibs, cones, goal nets, first aid kits etc?
How do you compare to opposing teams when they play matches - if they have no match kit they must look really rag-tag?

Sorry just re read your original post. So no bibs etc and some weeks not paying pitch or training fees?

That sounds dodgy

Whatever about insurance while the kids are playing the football, what about insurance when they are on this bouncy castle? The club/team need to get public liability insurance for that as they are having an event at the club house, right? I know our residents association were getting a bouncy castle for a local event for just the neighbours and the company hiring the bouncy castle asked for our insurance details. We had to rapidly get some insurance before they would hire the castle to us.

As a parent I'd be very sceptical about how the money is being spent and I'd imagine that if the team/club is joining the FA from September, they would want to get the backroom office structure together beforehand.

It's probably lack of organisation and ditziness rather than deliberate fraud, but it sounds like it's time for all the parents to point out to this couple that things need to be put on a more official footing, because there is a risk to everyone involved, including them. You need a committee, accounts etc, and probably membership of appropriate bodies.

My DF started a football club for children a few years ago and it was a nightmare with all the faff you have to do.. DBS, Leadership courses, Insurance etc.

It sounds to me like the couple have tried to start something nice for kids without realising how much work it really is and how much red tape there is. It's ridiculous.

I think you need to get other mums on board, is there a way you can get the transparency without going straight for the 'I think she's diddling us' phrase?

Maybe get one of the other mums to suggest an AGM style meeting (so it doesn't look like you're shit stirring) agenda to be:

Treasurer presenting accounts
Bibs for matches
Insurance
Safeguarding and DBS and GDPR
Fundraising and social events.

Also does she keep a note of whose paid what and have you all filled in a 'we exist as part of the club and phone my mum on this number if my leg falls off' form?

Also how much are they paying for use of the ground? The money might make sense once pitch fees are taken into account?

We had this sort of thing years ago with a badminton club where the previous treasurer was trying to run things on a ridiculous shoe string, very passionate but frankly clueless. DH took over, the first thing we had to do was put the fees up, explain why, then there was ample each year to cover courts, shuttles and a Christmas drink whilst still leaving a quarters court fees in the kitty.

I agree it’s normally standard you get a company to sponsor the team in lieu of football kits and the subs and extra go towards insurances purposes.

How much do the boys pay in subs each week? Entering the league costs money, they have to pay a small amount to refs, wherever they train will also need to be paid for. Most Sunday league kids teams get a sponsor for kits etc, is this something you could help organise? Maybe there are costs you're not accounting for. Kids sports teams are not huge money spinners. I say this with DF and FIL having run youth football and rugby teams, it takes to an awful lot of time, they often paid for things themselves as some of the families couldn't afford subs and they didn't want to see any boys miss out and some parents just moan, and don't even bother taking their children to matches, meaning DM and DF used to take both cars and pick kids up so they could play. Try to help before you accuse without evidence.

Parents can still be involved. I coach my DDs team but I am qualified, insured and part of the club set-up. I rarely handle cash. There is too much risk involved not to be insured, trained and monitored.

You don't say how many people are paying what.
You need to set up a committee and elect a treasurer etc. Good luck.
Otherwise a splinter team with a different trainer.

The thing is you and her want different things.

She wants to be very casual about the whole thing and you want it to be a tad more serious.

Things are going to get a bit tense if you confront her.

Can you not set your own group up or talk to the dad with your ideas of transparency and improved organisation

As your dh runs a business himself I think he knows this is all wrong.

You cannot charge parents money for a 'club' that doesn't have basic safeguarding as standard.

You need insurance as standard.

You need a group email/whatsapp and in it tot up as you have done the basic figures you know about.

Ask for a breakdown of costs and expenditures.

Be prepared for the 'club' to fold due to this couple not wanting to be accountable for where the ££ has gone as it is obvious to anyone on here reading this that they believe they are on to a winner with effectively 'paying themselves' for the time and effort they are putting into the club.

Best be upfront and say you are happy to continue paying as long as the club is formalised.

I expect the couple think they can get away with their income generating 'club' on the side by NOT formalising it with the bibs, kit etc.

So add everyone in and begin asking questions asap.

You also asked for advise on the DJ, what do the other parents think? the way you worded it, it sounds like she wants a party for the adults but the focus should be on the kids. Do the boys want it or will they all stand awkwardly on the sidelines while the parents make use of it?

I think you need to get a consensus of everyone otherwise its you against her and that is doomed to bad feeling.

I think as it's a friendship group I think the lines are becoming blurred between football and fun activities for the children.

We have never had bouncy castles or djs etc. But do have a kit and qualified coach but they are older and fa regulated.

If they are just playing friendlys they probably don't need a kit tbh as it is meant to be fun at that age.