to feel so outside all the cliques before my child even starts school

[newsparklythings]

Just that really. I've attended a school introduction and all the parents seemed to immediately split into groups that seem very like cliques. I tried talking to a few other mums and felt quite rejected. I have MH issues - anxiety, depression, quite severe a lot of the time - and find groups of new people especially difficult. But was hoping to make an effort for my daughter's sake and so I don't always feel like a loner in the playground. AIBU to feel this way?

YANBU I felt with that my DS 5 years ago, already in thier little groups only spoke to about 3 mums. DD isn’t so bad, they are not as clique as other classes. Still only talk to a few despite my daughter having many friends I only speak to one of the parents. I’m just not the social type and don’t like to interrupt people, so unless they talk to me first I don’t bother. Just stand there with my headphones on 😊

oh op I'm feeling it right now my little boy starting in September but we have started nursery sessions to get him to know some people and settle before then. Do obviously every one knows each other but I've had one chat with a lovley mum so far. I've smiled at every one but I'm going to try and say hello to everyone. It's hard as my little boy is upset at drop of so I'm concentrating on him. I think today I'm just going to say hello to everyone I see and they are doing a sponsored walk thing in the session so might get to see which child is with which parent. I'm going to go on a little trip they are going on aswell so hopefully that will help. I think just try and say hello to everyone and if you feel you can lol for some one alone a d talk to them ask how their little one is settling in.

We've had a bit of a rough year of it with DD2 when she started - with how the school allocated classes (and I think they fucked up a bit on this one but I understand why it was done the way it was) we ended up in a class where about 98% of the kids, particularly the girls, had gone to the school nursery - and our school is one where the parents DO get very very close knit.

It's taken me most of the year to break through the parents on the reception playground to be honest - and DD2 has had a bit of a crap time with the girls in her class being cliquey too (all the 3 girls who didn't go to the school nursery have to be honest - every one of their parents has been in raising it as a concern at one point in the year) - they re-do the classes for September and I can't wait for DD2 to get away from a few of the personalities who are still being quite unkind towards her.

People cling to who they know though - but ours have been ridiculous at times - they have all these year-group FB or whatsapp groups and have only added the parents they already knew to cut the others out... I think it's hilariously petty. I've got a few I can stand and chat to now though (although one was caught out slagging me off behind my back the other day - the politics of which parents get to go on school trips is a whole other minefield as well). Induction day and they cling even more to the parents they know from nursery and whatever as well.

I suggest getting involved with school events, maybe going in to help in class if your school does this and then you will get to know people. It took me a while too, but now I feel more confident (and often prefer to stand by myself in the playground anyway 🤣)
It will be fine, try not to worry.

I'll back up what jetSTAR just said too...we joined the school late - my youngest skipped all the Reception induction stuff and my eldest joined further up the school. I've done all the PTA stuff and I help in school which did help break the walls down with my eldest child... the Reception bunch this year for our particular class are just very very insular (and none of them do anything related to school apart from complain about it - you'd never see any of them at a PTA meeting... all at the events though... so that didn't really work on that particular front!)

Because I'm in school lots and I'm the organised one who puts all the dates from newsletters into my calendar though - they all DO now talk to me to find out what on earth is going on!

It happened to me. Now I don't actually care and feel quite proud that I don't need other people to make me feel better about myself. I only go there to pick up my kids and drop off after all. If there is someone there that I know and they chat to me then that's fine. I am also happy to stand on my own. I'm not interested in socialising with the other mums. Once you feel that way, you really wont care about feeling left out and its liberating.

It doesn't really matter. I just pick up my children, maybe have a 5 min chat depending who I'm stood neat, then leave. I don't give it a second thought.

They aren't cliques, but maybe parents that have children already in school so know each other.

Don't stress about this now. Be friendly and open when your dc starts school and I'm sure you'll make friends.

15 years on and I'm still an outsider! I've been involved in a clique which fell apart when someone had an affair and I've been on the outskirts of a clique, knowing everyone but never being asked to go out or arranging stuff and everyone being too busy. Last year I thought fuck them. I have a couple of local close friends and a group on non-local friends who I see a couple of times a year. No dramas!

I worked FT when my oldest was in yR and he went to a private nursery, so the friendships had been well established for years before I ambled along. I wouldn't say that they are cliques because they do say hello and there is space in the group for some chat. It helps that some work PT, so the cast varies each day.

There's clusters of friends with siblings of different ages, so some I know through a youth group stay in their own cluster.

Neither do I slot with my youngest's groups as again, they bonded over nursery (I kept DS in his nursery) and I'm the only parent with a yR/ KS1 split that has me split between two exits.

If I'm staying at a party, there is always chance to chat. The difference between friendship groups and cliques is that a clique will be exclusive to others and maintain minimal contact as much as possible (remembers being glared at at baby groups for having the audacity to say "hello" to people I saw each week)

I have befriended one with older DCs through our pokemon habits though, and we go off for a bit of a play after drop off

I think sometimes things look cliquey when really people who already know each other tend to gravitate towards each other, because they're just as nervous. The definition of a clique is a group that doesn't let others in, are you sure that's the case or would you be welcomed if you approached them and joined in?

If I'm chatting in a group and I see someone nearby I always smile and try to include them in the conversation too.

There is a positive side. There's a couple of mums at my kids' kindergarten who glom on to any newcomer and try to hit them up for emergency childcare. At least you avoided them! Honestly, there will be other mums there who are also slow to warm up, and in a couple of months' time you'll be on nodding hello terms with a few people and that's really enough. After age 4 or so, you don't need to be mates with the mums for your kids to get invited to playdates and for your kid to invite others - nice thing about kids, they take you as they find you so you don't really need to worry about making an impression for your DD's sake.

I know where you're coming from though. I have similar MH issues with a side order of tending to interpret shyness/neutrality in others as hostility, plus we live in a place where it's not my native language, so I'm always a bit unsure about the nuances, and I sometimes come away from the school gate wondering if everyone hates me (while knowing intellectually that they probably don't) but despite all that my kids seem to be quite popular.

There really isn’t a clique. There really isn’t a gang.

It’s mostly just people talking to each other. When they do that they stand in groups. They select someone to speak with based on many factors, children that are playing together, perceptions of similarities, proximity, anything that can be a conversation starter. When they feel lost or unsure they speak to the people that they have previously spoken to because they are a port in a storm and they have a point of reference.

If people don’t perceive similarities instantly they often struggle for a conversation opener. Most people will find common ground if they can get pas this bit, but many don’t for several reasons.

So you have the people who managed a few sentences once clubbing together in a social storm, you have the people who didn’t struggling for a conversational gambit that sounds vaguely normal - you must see that everyone, everyone is feeling the same way and doing the same thing. They are not forming cliques and looking down on everyone else. They are just getting by. They are just making conversation. They are just displaying very valid and normal human behaviour.

The longer it goes on, the stronger the relationships become, for the people who are not in the conversations the perceived slights or stress that they are being ‘ignored’ increases and the silent unexpressed animosity begins. From absolutely nothing.

Everyone is in the same boat. Everyone. Talk to as many people as you feel able to as often as you feel able. Smiles and pleasantries and a set of conversation openers that require no recognition or similarity.

Eg I’m (name) and that’s my child there (name) which one is yours?

People are not walking into social situations thinking I’m going to look down on half the people there and make a group that will make them feel bad and be the queen of it and we will be the clique to end all cliques.

They are just talking.

I try and avoid too much chat because when my child comes out of school I want to give her my undivided attention. I've seen some mums so absorbed in their conversation, they barely acknowledge their child coming out of school who they haven't seen all day.

I just don't recognise a lot of this at all. People doing school runs are just people - some nice ones, some not so nice ones. But all this 'I don't get involved because they're all really cliquey and bitchy and I'm in and out so I don't have to talk to anyone' doesn't really tie in with my experience of school pick ups.

I think it's definitely true that different people want different levels of involvement and interaction at school - I work from home, and hadn't been in the area that long when my kids started school, so I was keen to make some friends. Which I have done.

I really don't think everyone will have already formed cliques at your introductory visit. I mean this gently, but it does sound like you might be misreading the situation and that may be a manifestation of your depression and anxiety. I was out with some friends from school yesterday and we were talking about how people had felt back when our kids started, and lots of people felt as though everyone else knew each other and/or was really confident and chatty. I'm sorry it got off to a difficult start for you yesterday, but I'm sure there will be some nice parents in your child's class who want the same level of chat/friendship as you do.

Please don't let this bother you. I never fitted in at my sons' school as I was a working mother, possibly the only one in DS1's year. As a grown up I had my own friends, some from school, some from uni, some from work and social activities. I didn't really need or in fact want to be friends with any of the other mothers when the only thing in common was that our children were in the same class.

Later on there were more working mothers and I got to know the mothers of my sons best friends, with them there was more to talk about.

You could be the one to organize an evening meet up for parents?

Someone did this at DS last school, just gave teacher 30 notes to go in bags that said place, date and time, all welcome.

My initial impressions of some people were completely wrong - e.g. the mum I thought I'd have nothing in common with (I live in jeans and trainers, she's quite glamorous and worked in a beauty salon) turned out to be the loveliest person.

Its not really cliques. I went with my son yesterday to his new school, most parents there knew each other already either from the local preschool (where nearly half the kids go) or from older kids. In our area this is a massive sibling year group, a really high number of the kids have older brothers or sisters at the school. Consequently most parents know each other and some of the staff already. People genuinely wont be trying to be nasty. Im also horribly shy and get anxious so get awkward at these things even though I recognised lots of people there. I will try harder next week though.

My sons school does a phased start so at the beginning you are in the playground with only half the parents at pick up - its really those first few days where its helpful to meet people and chat. At the moment unless its one form entry you could put in loads of effort to talk to someone and then not have a kid in the same class anyway.

I'm worrying how this all works for mothers who work? In this day and age there must be millions of us who won't be hanging around the playground at 3:30pm.

Does this mean DS will be a social pariah/nonentity who never goes to parties or gets invited anywhere?

The best thing you can do for yourself is RELAX. Your child will make friends regardless of your relationship with other parents. If anything, getting too close to other people can make things complicated if your child's friendships go Pete Tong, which they invariably do. Not only that but there are also the different parenting styles to consider. My last child is in year4 and I find the remain polite but keep slightly distant helps a lot. Many people who appear friendly are after free childcare too

I never bothered with any of the 'mums at the gate' stuff. I stood there waiting at pick up and if anyone was nearby would be chatty, otherwise just kept out of it. Couldnt see the point, kids make their own friends without our interference.

Tawdry, this may vary from school to school, but at ours in Reception most parties were whole-class-parties with invites distributed with a TAs help at school and coming home in the child's book bag.

Parties were a great opportunity for working parents to meet other parents (in reception, most party hosts will accept if you just drop/pick up, but most parents will actually stay for the duration).

By year one your child will know who they want to invite, be it to their party or just for a play; you can always give them a note with your number on to pass on to the other child, and once you have each other's numbers, your child really does not need to be a social pariah even if you do not do school runs.

I don’t get this. Presumably you have friends already? From school, uni, work, whatever? Then you don’t necessarily have to make a load more at the school. My youngest leaves primary this year and I can honestly say there is not one mum who I will bother to stay in touch with after 8 years of primary pick ups and drop offs. I have friends already - couldn’t give a fuck about the playground and who is there and the ‘cliques’ that in fact are just FRIENDS HAVING A CHAT.

All this unnecessary anxiety - I don’t understand!

(Business management hat) Remember the group lifecycle:
Form - Storm - Norm - Perform - Mourn - Reform

Introduce yourself to individuals (teachers may be the best place to start here), then they will introduce you to their cliques groups.