Psycho MIL - take 2

[LolaL]

Hi everyone, I posted this --

www.mumsnet.com/Talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/3249894-MIL-from-hell-bring-popcorn-wtf-do-I-do-with-her?pg=14

-- a few weeks ago. Since then, things have been quite good. We've had a few issues (her slagging me off to my mum, she's super super manipulative and it sparked a massive argument between my mum and I). I had a text from her re the hairdresser for the wedding and I text her on the morning of a hospital scan to wish her good luck - but otherwise had absolutely no contact at all.

DP has been the happiest he's been. He has had an occasional phone call with her and popped into the house to ask his dad for some help with the car, but aside from that, that's it.

Weekend just gone was his stag. A really lovely weekend was organised for him (just what he needed!) and he came home yesterday pm bouncing, despite his hangover lol. Showing me photos/videos, telling me what they got up to etc. Really happy.

I met up with SIL over the weekend and she told me that she too has had no contact, bar one phonecall to discuss seeing grandkids (initiated by SIL). Throughout the whole phonecall, MIL repeatedly slagged off the whole family, mainly me. SIL sounded like she did a great job in trying to keep on topic and discuss the kids however it eventually ended with SIL saying that she would not tolerate listening to this and put the phone down. SIL told me about this conversation and I decided not to share with DP, not to upset him.

This morning, DP called MIL on his way into work, just to check in. I think the child in him wanted to share what a lovely weekend he'd had. She told him that she was so glad that he'd had a lovely weekend because she was now on anti-d's and wanted to kill herself all weekend, how lonely she was.... (FIL didn't go on stag so she wasn't alone...) and how upset she was that I didn't reach out to her over the weekend and plan something with her.

Aside from seeing SIL, I had a lovely, very busy weekend spent with my friends and hobby.

DP then called me, really upset, saying how he felt so sorry for her and that he was sad that I'd not reached out to her this weekend. I pointed out that I didn't understand why this weekend was an exception, how was I to know she was feeling lonely, she had FIL, absolutely no difference to any other weekend and even if I wanted to, I had hobby commitments so would have struggled for time.

He ended up getting angry saying how he can't cope that I hate his mum, I started crying, completely out of the blue, I was sat on the sofa catching up with work emails. Ended the call. 10 mins later he text saying he loved me and was sorry, I didn't reply, was upset.

I replied half an hour later saying I loved him but this is really getting me down, our wedding is 4 weeks away and he cannot let his mum manipulate him, or interfere in our relationship. He said she isn't and loves me like a daughter?? I said very hard to believe when she's said some v nasty stuff about me to SIL and told him what was said. Maybe I'm expecting too much, but if I had heard someone talk about DP like that, I would be straight on the phone, asking why they'd said this. Anyway, his response was "take it with a pinch of salt."

I then got v v angry that he couldn't back me and was again letting her control and interfere. I completely saw red and did call her a "psycho controlling bitch" which was probably the most PG thing I had in my head!!!

Anyway, this has continued back and forth all day, him saying he feels unsupportive me hating his mum, me thinking wtf he is letting her control and ruin our relationship. BIL has had a chat with him and agreed that he thinks she's trying to ruin the wedding.

Absolute mess. I don't know what to do. My head is saying run, my heart is staying stick with him.

This sounds pathetic and that I'm overreacting but I really do feel like this is the final nail in the coffin.

Honestly, all of this has made me more determined to marry him and make him happy, as his mother is clearly not capable of the love he deserves.
For DP's sake, I hope she does come to the wedding with her silly white lace bridal gown ( I may even buy her a veil lol!). The entire family, and the majority of our friends, are aware of the issues we've faced with her over the past few months, and after lots of research and reading into narcissism, especially narcissistic mothers, I think her ego will be too large to ruin our day, in front of a wide audience.
I do feel confident that once this witch is out of our lives, we will have a very successful marriage, as she is the only thing we've ever seemed to disagree on.
4 weeks before the wedding is no time to try and patch up a relationship and I can't even describe how excited I am to go on my honeymoon to a very remote location (with hopefully no wifi or signal!!! ) however he is confident that he is strong enough to not let me get hurt by her again. Only time will tell, I guess but I can't let go of an otherwise happy life because of one person.... hope this doesn't make me look weak....

@Blackberry - yes, to mine or his knowledge, it's not a thing. My mum came to my hen party. My DSF and DP are very close and whatsapp funny/rude/immature jokes/pics/videos to each other almost daily, I do believe they messaged on the weekend of my hen but definitely not just because I was away!!!!!!
Again, this is her trying to find a way in between DP and I and planting poisonous seeds in her head.
He is very much aware of how she is acting however he is labelling her as "bitter" instead of a "narcissist". Not exactly where we want to be but at least he's getting there.

it doesnt matter what anyone else thinks, lolaL. If you're certain that he will have your back - with the odd blip now and then - then that's what matters.

I suspect that with a mother like this, there will be issues sometimes because he was brought up by her and that's very formative. I think you do need to read the book Toxic Parents, I really do, because it can give you some idea of what he's been through and how it might affect him.

All the best =)

OP, I read the original al thread but now can't seem to get back to it and may have got some details muddled with other MIL threads! Aren't you thinking of moving back nearer your DP? If so, that still sounds like a very good plan!

My mum can be very unreasonable and cause stress and I sound off about it to DH, but if he criticises her, my natural reaction is to defend her. It's daft and makes no sense but we've got to an understanding where we both think twice. It doesn't excuse your DP but I think I know where he's coming from.

I'd also agree with your assessment she's unlikely to make a scene on the day, it wouldn't be keeping up appearances to do so, but you'll need to continue to be cautious in the run up.

And also, even without added MIL drama, the run up to weddings can be hideously stressful (it's a separate convo about whether they need to be, but that's the reality for many brides to be). I can't think how much I cried and fretted and we fell out over things. This is normal pre wedding and not an indicator of life to come.

Good luck and keep talking to each other!

I hate to ask but she doesn't know where you're honeymooning, does she? Just thinking of a few threads where MIL has turned up.

OP as you have decided to go ahead with the wedding, I hope you have a lovely day and a wonderful honeymoon

I know you have said that you both agree to waiting until your MIL problem is sorted before trying for a baby, and I agree that is a really sensible plan. Something else you need to think about is that your DP will not have witnessed "normal" parenting as he was growing up. Obviously his mother is batshit, but also his father is an enabler of her, which is also a very unhealthy dynamic. Talk to your DP and encourage him to surround himself with really positive parenting role models and to observe how they behave towards their kids. He will need a crash course in parenting and have a whole lot of catching up to do. I have 2 very good friends with fantastic kids who have made me believe that I can be a different mother to how my mother was to me, and how my grandmother was to her They have also told me that they will tell me straight if I'm not. My biggest fear at becoming a mum was that I wouldn't be able to break the cycle and it nearly affected my decision to start a family.

I do feel confident that once this witch is out of our lives, we will have a very successful marriage, as she is the only thing we've ever seemed to disagree on.

Is that the plan? Because really, that's the only thing that's going to be a realistic option if you're not going to end up splitting. Are you prepared to tell him, HAVE you told him -

'Bottom line is I expect your mother to be out of our lives after the wedding. There'll be no pregnancy for at least a couple of years while I see whether things are actually going to work. She's no longer an option if we are to be happy, if you aren't on the same page as me with this then we may as well call it all off.'

however he is confident that he is strong enough to not let me get hurt by her again. so what he said last time, then the moment she bleats it's all forgotten.

Yep, time will most certainly tell.

You've got to do what you've got to do, so I will just say - marry him by all means. But for FUCK'S sake don't get pregnant for at least a year, and make that a year where you point to your BIL and SIL and say - we do it that way, if you're not on board go have a happy life with your mother.'

Do that, and then stop what you're doing now, which is giving chance after chance after chance.

You and your DP sound like a wonderful couple, who usually have great communication - which bodes well for married life!

Just bear in mind, as Eryri says, that, to him, his mum is 'normal. This is all the 'mothering' he has ever known, so it's natural for him to defend her, because it's how mothers are!

The more you (and your BIL and SIL) can make him see that she really isn't normal, that nobody (or at least, very few) people have relationships like this with their parents and that she is overstepping so many lines that she's driving you and him apart - the better.

Thankfully she's terrified of flying as well as not being in the financial position to afford to travel somewhere like that, so I am very confident that our honeymoon is safe!

@Eryri2018 - are you my SIL?! You sound just like her! She has spoken to me about enablers and ensuring that he is surrounded by good parenting role models before we try. Luckily my friends with children are all fantastic parents, as well as BIL and SIL so I'm confident he will be ok. As stupid as it sounds and I understand that by writing this it makes me seem completely and utterly batshit, but he is a great "parent" to our dogs and other pets and is an incredibly kind, generous and empathetic person who always puts the needs of others before his. I have no doubt he'll be a fab parent as and when the time comes!

I'm going to download the Toxic Parents book on my kindle tonight :) x

@FizzyGreenWater

agree entirely. I agree with pp's - there may be blips for him as it is hard, we've gone from seeing her 3/4/5's per week to absolutely not at all in just a few weeks. Even when I was away for work last week, DP made no effort to see her, so I am confident that he is well and truly making a start to cut the cord.

I'm glad you've had a positive conversation with him Lola

He's wrapped up in FOG and its going to be hard for him. The recurrence of blaming you, and him being happier when she backed off does suggest she was the major trigger in his anxiety, though work may not have helped.

I'd still advise that you get him to see that her suicide threats should be the trigger to get her professional help, not to lay it at your door. Could you suggest he raise concerns to her GP?

Do I recall from your previous thread that you might consider moving away back nearer to your parents? If I have recalled correctly, I think thats a very good idea. How far is it? Is it feasible with work etc?

my dh has come to a better and better understanding of his parents. I found them pretty grim but then my parents are messier but more authentic and kind, above all they want the best for me and believe I am the person who knows what that is. Dh's play favourites, want the things they value and punish alternative views or actions by silence or rewritten histories or no contact. sometimes when I verbalised their problems in our early days he couldn't se it (because the problem was him=low self esteem). these days it makes him eye roll and pity their lack of emotional intelligence. He doesn't depend on them for anything ever. He doesn't like them but accepts anything positive where it is...they are ok with our kids. Your DH may well find that this is a long journey to healthy self esteem and family relationships.

How much info has she got regarding your honeymoon? Enough she could fake being you and cancel it?
We had booked away at a family friend's business (B&B somewhere nice), mil trashed the plans.
Just be certain she can't do similar.

But did he ring his father when his mum kicked off, which is the best way to find out the true story.
His mother kicked off and he spent an entire day, according to your post, being nasty to you, rather than ring his father to clarify the situation. Once he had unloaded all his emotional baggage onto you, he then apologised? And then YOU apologised in return!
It would seem that he has learnt his manipulative lessons well from his mother. I wish you well, but Iwouldbe seriously rethinking a wedding,your husband has found the answer, off load,be as nasty as he wants and then apologise!

and is an incredibly kind, generous and empathetic person who always puts the needs of others before his

just as a note, he may have been trained into this by her. It's worth quietly observing if he is able to balance his own needs with others, over time.

Maybe it's an idea to put her on speakerphone if she rings, to make her more accountable and hopefully she'll start to think twice about what she says if she thinks someone else is listening?

SeaEagle
I was also wondering about him being trained by his mother to put everyone before himself. He does need to find a balance, where he puts himself first some of the time. Even as parents, we have a need to do that too as our children grow to ensure we don’t loose our identity.

Posted too soon. I’m glad you made progress. Do let us know how your wedding goes. I hope you have a lovely time in spite of having a crazed mil.

Good luck op. You sound far nicer than your DP deserves.

Speakerphone is a great idea ^
Get OH on board with this so all calls to/from her are on speaker so he can hear the words and tone for himself.

Move away from this narcistic fucker!

The trouble is op, he says all the right things after a row with you and then as soon as she calls/cries then it's right back to being your fault.

How many more years is this roundabout going to be your life?

A pp said that if you cancel the wedding then mil wins, I think that if you cancel the wedding then YOU win.

I do feel confident that once this witch is out of our lives, we will have a very successful marriage, as she is the only thing we've ever seemed to disagree on.

How is she going to be out of your lives? Has he agreed NC?

Another one for speakerphone if you're both around - "so we can both talk to you" whichever it is she's calling. Is it worth discussing with DP having his DB and DSIL around for advice to you both on how to deal with her firmly since you say they seem to be successful?