AIBU? Normal 7 year old behaviour...

[Mummyontherocks]

My 7 yr old dd reacts very strongly to things, she has high anxiety and she still has tantrums. They can be extreme. For example she has just had a meltdown for 1.5 hours (crying, screaming and kicking) because I explained Daddy said no to her eating in our bed because she makes crumbs. She was devastated that I didn't believe that she doesn't make crumbs (she does make crumbs). My dad thinks that she is bang out of order (fair enough) but can't see that she is 7, and hasn't learnt how to deal with her big emotions yet. I'm worried that there's maybe more to it and the tantrums, plus her anxiety may not be normal for her age. My dad thinks I should just stop her tantruming (no idea how) and that I'm letting her older sister down who is always upset by her tantrums. AIBU to 'let' her get away with this behaviour?

I'd say ask the school what's happening there....

Yes gamer and pp we have a united front. I didn't say that to dd - worded it in the post poorly and from her perspective rather than my own. She had had a separate conversation with dh about eating in our bed, and he had said no so she had come to me upset about it so I was explaining why he had said no, if that makes sense. Not at all giving her the impression that I would have said yes, because I would never undermine him like that. In fact both of our responses, when asked anything by either dd, if we're in different places, is have you already asked the other one and what did they say?

Hello, just to say my DS had no tantrums at all, until he turned 7!! He was such an easy baby/toddler. He has started to copy other behaviours at school, and I think test out his own boundaries as well as some kind of hormonal/emotional surge! It was a shock to me as I didn't have a clue what to do! But, it has been reassurance, explanations and lots of love - to explain about how we would like him to behave etc. I struggled with him to start with, but he is gradually heading out of this phase as he is approaching 8. I now have answering back and of course he knows everything, but he is a little more rational these days. He gets better every day. Good luck. xx

Try reading ‘The Explosive Child’, my 6 year old can be similar and reading this has helped us.

Well, off the top of my head, tantrums can be a sign that they get what they want when they have one; that something else has them upset; being hungry or overtired.

My dd was dreadful for tantrums but had her last one before she was five.

Interesting getting the posts about SN, I have considered that myself. It's so difficult because for so many years it hasn't been beyond the realms of 'normal' and although it still isn't, every year it gets more and more unusual compared to others.
To those asking about school and with other people, she does get upset but doesn't tantrum as such, she seems to save the tantrums for home. She will cry though in front of her peers/ friends, over things that seem trivial (obviously they aren't to her).

I don't think it's a usual response. My 7yo DS wouldn't necessarily accept 'no' straight away, but he would try emotional blackmail 'but I love you so much I just want to be close to you while I eat my snack' or negotiation 'I'll get a plate, then there won't be crumbs' etc rather than tantrum.

I'm a special needs teacher for children with EHCPs for high functioning autism and the associated high levels of anxiety. TBH it would also be very unusual for them to have such long meltdowns. 90mins in continuous meltdown would be a rare occurrence and we would take it very seriously.

Tantrums like that sound unusual for a 7 yr old.

In terms of stopping them, have you tried thinking about what her general emotional state is like before the tantrums?

DS1 (6) has ASD and can react very emotionally and have meltdowns over things that objectively seem minor.
We’ve noticed that he finds it much harder to regulate his emotional responses if he’s already stressed in some way e.g. if he’s got too hungry, too tired, too overstimulated by sensory stuff around him, or if he’s been using a lot of energy to cope with demanding situations. If we can keep these more or less in balance then we see far fewer meltdowns from DS1.

I’m not suggesting your DD has ASD or any SN, but if you find these outbursts tend to happen more often when she’s tired, hungry or whatever, then adressing those might help her regulate her emotions better when faced with minor things like being told no food in bed?

That's interesting ironman and others posting about similar experiences which are not SN, she does tend to copy behaviour and she does have one friend who is quite explosive (only lasts a short time with her though). Whenever I think she is copying that behaviour I always say that that behaviour is not acceptable and just because someone else does something it doesn't mean that we should.

They might be unusual but one of mine used to have them going on 1-2 hours up til about 8/9. Quite infrequent and usually bottling things up, then a massive explosion which was hard to control (for us as well as her). I found a sanction that finally worked (removal of iPad) and this cut down on bad behaviour during them- but I told her it was fine to go to her room and be cross for an hour or two. She did grow out of them and hasn't had one like that for 5 years or more.

It can be a sign something is wrong, and if it was happening a lot I'd seek help but in our case it was just not knowing how to process or let emotions out a bit at a time and it did resolve although I thought it never would!

This may or may not resonate

www.parentmap.com/article/laura-kastner-tantrum-anxiety-tips

I think in the whole you'd be wise to seek an opinion of a paediatric occupational therapist.

That made me feel a bit emotional lowdoor. Okay I'll explore the SN side, She's already seeing a paedatrician for a physical need so I will talk to her about this too.
She has got a cold 4Green so I wonder if that could be affecting her at the moment. I will keep an eye out for contributing factors.

Thank you everyone!

I didn't see these kind of extreme meltdowns as similar to a child having a small tantrum over say a lost toy/being told off which might last 10 min and then they would be rational. It was really about complete loss of control and high distress (although my line in the sand was don't hurt me and don't destroy property/belongings). They were awful but I don't think they were a sign of pathology in our case. It's worth thinking that through, though just in case.

My almost 7 year old tantrums like that. He is being assessed for Autism.
He does have a lot of other ‘issues’ though, not just the meltdowns.
How is she socially? Does she have issues with food, clothes, noise etc?

OP very unlikely for SN as it came out of the blue. Doesn't make sense
I'd probably have a chat with teacher to see if something has happened recently that in her little mind has turned her life around

My DS (8) still has tantrums that can last for up to an hour but he is slowly improving as he gets older. I would say he is an anxious and emotional child with a very strong sense of what should be happening and a need to be in control. He is very good at controlling himself at school and then losing it at home.

Discipline achieves nothing but escalating his tantrum and anger - once he's lost his temper, he's beyond being reasoned with and getting angry with him feeds it more. He is likely to lose it if he's tired, hungry or stressed out. I try and keep calm with him but don't back down though this is easier said than done.

I haven't gone down any SEN route because he doesn't have issues socially or any sensory issues that would leave me to think anything other than he is very emotional with a big temper that he's still learning to control.

I just wanted to join in. Posters who say oh I've got x grandchildren and that's not normal are not helpful. They've not had your child. It doesn't matter that someone's child never cried more than 10 mins or stopped tantrumming at 5. It's helpful to say seek advice, but you sound like a brilliant mum. I also strongly disagree with posters saying don't hug your child. If you instinctively feel this is not just attention seeking and to get her own way and she's really distressed you hold your child and help her feel secure, your not going to make it worse. She's your child and you know her and unless a specialist tells you otherwise follow your gut. I was once told to hold my tantrumming child but as he hated being touched this was not the right thing to do for him!
I've several children on the spectrum (very varying levels) and am very used to the kind of tantrum you describe. They are exhausting and overwhelming for the child and hardwork for the parent. I would chat things through with a gp and with her teacher as well to see if they've picked up on anything.
My daughter outgrew them at 9, but until then I had to be very careful what we did as certain things would be more likely to cause these outbursts and upsets.

You mentioned she's seeing a paed for a physical thing. May I ask what it is?

The reason I ask is because my DD is like you describe, I think because she has very mild cerebral palsy - CP is usually thought of as a physical thing but it can also affect behaviour, in her case her sleep and emotional self regulation are more affected than her physical skills. Any chance something like this is going on with your DD?

My 9 year old still has tantrums like this. We're finally in the CAMHS system after years of trying. She's being assesed for ASD, ADD, and SPLDs also executive functions. I don't have a feeling at the moment if any/several of these will be diagnosed. What I can clearly see is how anxious she is.

One thing that really helped us deal with the very explosive tantrums is to physically help her get it out. It's awkward and she fights it at the time but it's drastically reduced the meltdown length.
I usually take her to the recycling and hold her hands and jump on the recycling with her, or otherwise turn the music up loud and again take her hands and make her dance. This was advice from the charity Young Minds.

Thanks everyone, especially boredandtired that's very kind of you to say. She does have some other issues as well with clothes, food and noise. I've boarded the mummyresearchtrain now and am googling like mad. Social stuff possibly - she doesn't really have a filter but then I know some adults like that ha ha, and she's only 7! I will speak to the paedatrician about it all at her next appointment and then I'll know one way or another.

Thanks minipie, that must be really tough. She's had genetic testing and we're waiting for the results.

My tantrum child grew out of it age 8. Though we also started taking it more seriously as she got older and took steps to avoid setting her off. It was definitely related to sensory stimulus (clothes) though we never got her checked out with a doctor.

My friend’s child has severe tantrums still, age 8. She also has anxiety over lots of seemingly unimportant things. I wonder if there is a link.

OP, once the tantrum was over and she had calmed down, did you ask her why she got so upset?

It might also be worth saying something like: "All that fuss wasn't really worth it was it?" and "If you are cross with us when we say no, then it is ok to be cross, but it is better to talk about it instead of getting upset and shouting."

Perhaps she needs room to negotiate now.

Is your dd year 2 doing SATS? My dd (7) is normally happy-go-lucky but has reacted emotionally to the SATS over the last month. Could it be making things worse at the moment?

My DS was either overstimulated or excessively tired with the worst ones. Mostly with friends round (which was hard work) but with discussion we are def working through this. I have an only child and it def started with a bit of jealousy thrown in. Also other boisterous kids breaking his stuff...as they grow up and out of their more destructive ways, he is growing out of his tantrums. I figured it was the bit where he is controlling nothing in his life and wants to be in charge but can't control his emotions. He is a very bright boy and is great socially. I am sure its just a phase (fingers crossed!) He is definitely quite young emotionally, but then so was I, so I figure it will be fine. Its about consistency, showing love and not tolerating the bad behaviour, reinforcing the good. You know what to do! Its in your heart! I toyed with contacting doctors at one point, but I've sat it out and its nearly over. I didn't want to make a bigger issue out of an issue if there was no need. I do feel that we tend to jump on lots of things these days as a 'problem'. Children are all different. Good luck.xxx