To think that if you don't want people to use the N word, don't put it in the lyrics of your songs

[PatriarchyPersonified]

Just that really. Kendrick Lamar invited a fan out of the audience at a recent gig to rap along to the lyrics of one of his songs.

The fan (a white lady) repeatedly used the N word, because it's in the lyrics. He stopped her and told her she couldn't say it. She was also booed and abused by the crowd.

🤔

If you don't want people to say a certain word, then don't put it in the lyrics of your songs.

It's either not acceptable, or it's ok. You can't have it both ways.

I personally don't think the N word is an acceptable word to be used full stop, and that doesn't change based on the race of the person using it.

www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-44209141

@Home2018

What I was meaning to highlight is you have the right to say whatever you like, until it becomes illegal (for example libel).

The girl brought up on stage had as much right to use the word as the singer. Unless she was using it illegally (inciting hatred for instance)

You can be offended, you can disapprove, but it's not up to you to decide who has the right to say something.

Ok, so I just read an article and it sounds like this woman is very definitely in the wrong.

But Kendrick stopped her after she repeatedly used the N-word - which is heard multiple times in his song.

"As the crowd reacted angrily, Kendrick told her: "You gotta bleep one single word."

She appeared not to realise why she had been stopped, and asked: "Am I not cool enough for you, bro?"

The crowd in Gulf Shores, Alabama started booing on hearing the woman sing the racial slur.

She apologised, saying: "Oh I'm sorry, did I do it?"

Kendrick then asked the audience if she should be given another try - and despite many shouting "No!", Kendrick allowed her a second run at the song."

So he suggested to her to stop after the crowd reacted, she replied confrontationally. She apologised as if she didn't know she sung it ... and then Kendrick gave her a second chance despite the hostility of the crowd?
The BBC also appears to think she's a woman, rather than a teenage girl.
Absolutely abysmal behaviour.

Sorry, it didn't go in italics. From "but" its the BBC article.

And from the videos I saw the crowd was mostly white.

YANBU they're song lyrics, it doesn't mean she uses the word in any other capacity. Haven't RTFT but it's come out as being a publicity stunt anyway.

So my original question stands - at what skin tone does it become acceptable? At what point would she have been "black enough"?

As far as reports indicate she wasn't mixed race so why is this question relevant?!

Ha ha ha, look at this shit right here. You get to sing N because some random rapper gave you the right, but I don't get to call you a racist because it's libellous.

The audacity of this is breathtaking.

So my original question stands - at what skin tone does it become acceptable? At what point would she have been "black enough"?

Well if you've been called it as an insult, I'd say you make your own decisions. I'm assuming this woman hasn't been. Racists appear to know when someone is a PoC for them to insult.

@GalwayWayfarer

The audacity of it is also non existent if you look at the context of why I alluded to libel

@thor86 I get that you think it's libellous because you don't consider yourself a racist if that's what you mean.

So my original question stands - at what skin tone does it become acceptable? At what point would she have been "black enough"?

As a biracial woman, I don't say it. I'm obviously not white but my lighter skin gives me a privilege now and would have back in the day. It may have been used against me in days of slavery and my life certainly wouldn't have been a picnic, but in the contemporary reclaim I'm unlikely to be referred to as the n word. The daughter of or half of one perhaps, but not one itself. It's never been used against me, so how can I reclaim it?

Other responses would vary based on where and how they grew up, skin tone etc. In my experience as a biracial person, this word won't be used to address me and as such isn't mine to use.

@GalwayWayfarer Well yes I'm not a racist, but the point I was making is that @Home2018 is within their rights to use the term racist until they cross the line into libel. Which arguably they wouldn't because thor86 doesn't identify me in public in the slightest but it was a point made for the sake of argument.

And the woman in question at this concert was as much within her right to use the word as the singer was, because she wasn't using it in an illegal way (to incite violence for example)

@Home2018 is perfectly entitled to say they disagree with her doing so, but not to say she has no right to.

And the woman in question at this concert was as much within her right to use the word as the singer was, because she wasn't using it in an illegal way (to incite violence for example)

I'm not going to re-type all the reasons why I think this is so deeply flawed as they're in previous posts in the thread already. But I couldn't disagree more.

Fair enough. I'll continue feeling free to use words I deem appropriate in certain context, in the knowledge I'm not racist for doing so.

Enjoy your evening

in the knowledge I'm not racist for doing so

Are you hoping that if you keep saying that it will make it true?

in the knowledge I'm not racist for doing so

In the knowledge that lots of people think it's racist, lots of people find it really uncomfortable and offensive and that they will think you're a bit of an arsehole? Then go right ahead.

@GalwayWayfarer

Not at all. I don't need to make it true, it already is.

In the knowledge that lots of people think it's racist, lots of people find it really uncomfortable and offensive and that they will think you're a bit of an arsehole?

Indeed.

@MrsTerryPratchett

As I say, I know I'm not a racist, or an arseholes for that matter. I do believe that no one has the right to restrict another person's vocabulary purely because they find it offensive.

So what part of repeating a song lyric, in context, would make thor86 a racist?

The word itself, or the fact she is (presumably) white?

Because if it's the colour of her skin, then you are applying a double standard to her based solely on her race.

You are saying she can't do something that others can, for no other reason than the colour of her skin.

And you are ok with that. In the name of 'not being racist'.

Right. 🤔

Of course they don't. Most people restrict their own when they are aware of the very serious implications for others and considering the really easy act of not saying, singing or rapping the n-word. I've managed a lifetime of not saying it. I don't feel I've lost out.

Fwiw, I don't think the word is acceptable at all. Because it is objectively a racial slur.

It doesn't matter the race of the person using it.

There is a double standard. A double standard based on hundreds of years of oppression. A double standard created and maintained BY WHITE PEOPLE.

I can't be arsed any more and am off down the pub with my thread sisters. Mine's a double. Roses, Home, Galway and Val I will see you down there.

Vauhall sorry!