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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To be offended by this review?

107 replies

dolgellau · 21/05/2018 21:00

AIBU to be offended on behalf of my staff.

I run a business in Welsh speaking Wales. It serves the public who are mainly tourists. Every single worker in the business speaks Welsh and all daily happenings and running of the business is through Welsh.

We have been left a bad review with low score as “staff speaking welsh between themselves”.

The only situation I can see this arising is if a customer orders in English (or French to some staff) staff will chat with the customers needs in English. Then to relay the knowledge to someone to work on the order will say it in Welsh to the other worker; the language that comes most naturally to them. This isn’t the case of excluding the customer but to just get the process done.

Even if the staff were gossiping between another;
How would said reviewer know that they weren’t discussing work related issues? Angry

OP posts:
Emmageddon · 22/05/2018 09:11

I have lost count of the number of times I have walked into a business establishment the staff and customers were speaking English as I entered then immediately switched to Welsh

This scenario has been debunked as an urban myth, surely?

I'm English, live and work in North Wales, and most of my colleagues are Welsh speakers. I've never felt excluded when they chat in Welsh. I'm doing a 6 month Welsh language course at the moment and it's remarkably similar to Spanish and French (in my opinion!).

People that object to Welsh people speaking Welsh are a bit silly.

ICantCopeAnymore · 22/05/2018 09:22

I'm not sure, @PatchworkGirl - in work it's to be deliberately rude so that new people can't understand the conversation. I've had it out with people a few times because they wouldn't normally speak in Welsh (it's an English stream school) and is solely for the purpose of discussing the staff who can't speak Welsh.

As for walking into pubs, I've experienced people saying "Sais" and talking in Welsh on a number of occasions. Sais means English. Obviously we aren't English, so again I assume it's to be rude, as it clearly isn't accidental.

Some of the locals in my local pub will deliberately switch to Welsh when non-locals come in and discuss their appearance or what they are doing here. It's vile. It's quite a racist area if I'm honest - I've experienced people arguing about not wanting to see a dentist wearing a hijab, or a dentist with an obviously Asian surname.

People swear it doesn't go on, but it really does

Timefortea99 · 22/05/2018 09:25

I have only been to Wales once, both fleeting visits. Cardiff, lovely. Another occasion I went to Portmerion and went in a shop nearby. They were speaking English when I went in, and immediately switched to Welsh when they saw me. They didn’t know I was English, it must just have been a default for them to switch to Welsh when a stranger came in. Whatever the reason it made me feel unwelcome and uncomfortable and I left without buying anything.

Timefortea99 · 22/05/2018 09:30

Wales twice not once

PatchworkGirl · 22/05/2018 09:36

@ICantCopeAnymore

That's amazing - how awful. I get the ones at work (I mean, I don't 'get' it but I understand that they're doing it deliberately, knowing that the others can't understand). But the deliberate rudeness in pubs is crazy - what happens if they get it wrong and the person coming in does speak Welsh (this must have happened more than once - I hope it went badly for the rude locals)?

I was more wondering about the tourists who walk into somewhere and assume that the language is switched based on - what? Someting English about their appearance? It sounds like paranoia to me. It must be rare - but its obviously not unheard of!

Trampire · 22/05/2018 09:52

I'm born and bred in Anglesey. I went to a bilingual school (back in the 80's). Many of my friends had Welsh as their 'first' language. One of my boyfriends occasionally had to stop mid conversation (in English) to ask me what a Welsh word was in English as he couldn't think of it.

I now live in England. My family in Wales are made up from English and Welsh speakers. The English speakers understand welsh but English comes more naturally to them. When we get together the Welsh speakers naturally revert to Welsh, they don't think about it, they just do.

I think there's a myth that English people gave that Welsh is some kind of dead/unused/novelty language. Where I come from it's a natural daily used language.

OP, bloody ridiculous review. I would simply respond how a PP has said "Welsh is the first language of the staff" etc. Then try and ignore.

itswinetime · 22/05/2018 10:02

Yes thee review is ridiculous and hopefully everyone reading it will clearly see. A response saying that Welsh is the first language of your staff and as your based in Wales you don't see that changing in the near future!

blaaake · 22/05/2018 10:16

How ridiculous. My parents are welsh but I was born in England and could never get a grip on the language, however I would neeever be offended at people speaking it in my presence Confused

chavtasticfirebanger · 22/05/2018 10:48

Could you respond to the review in Welsh? [Grin]

redcarbluecar · 22/05/2018 11:04

Could you respond to the review in Welsh? [Grin]

Ha ha, yes.

BalaBrith · 22/05/2018 11:15

Could you respond to the review in Welsh?Grin

Hahaha os gweli di'n dda, OPGrinGrin

ParoxetineQueen · 22/05/2018 12:20

Got to agree with Penguin. Some years ago we visited the Outer Hebrides, my husband was waiting his turn, the staff and customer were speaking Gaelic. When he came to be served, the shopkeeper apologised profusely for being so rude and proceeded to relate the whole conversation in English (basically local gossip!). Above and beyond what was required but I think it was a nice touch in an area of Great Britain that is bilingual. We found similar attitudes in Shetland and Orkney where the locals instantly ‘toned down’ their local dialect as soon as they realised we were visitors.

Dobbythesockelf · 22/05/2018 12:30

As an English woman living in north Wales I hear Welsh spoken daily so I think the idea that staff should be speaking English just to please English customers ridiculous.

I will say though that some people are arseholes, I am rubbish at languages so have struggled to speak the language not helped by my inability to say r's. However I do understand a fair bit by this stage. I have had people (other mum's and customers at work) talk about me in Welsh thinking I can't understand them. However this is less to do with the language and more to do with these people being arseholes. In the same way these customers were probably just arseholes. So I would say to check with your staff that they don't talk about customers thinking they won't understand cause sometimes they do.

MikeUniformMike · 22/05/2018 12:42

You can live in Wales and not speak much English. For example, you live somewhere Welsh is the everyday language, you went to a Welsh-speaking primary and secondary school, then to a Welsh-speaking university. All your family and friends are welsh, all people you interact with are Welsh-speaking.
When you speak English you have to concentrate on the words, translating as you go.

GunpowderAndLead · 22/05/2018 12:57

My children and husband are welsh and we live in wales despite me being English and not being able to speak it, I was hellbent on sending them to welsh language school.

I've had two women bitching in the dentist waiting room in Welsh about me and my 5 yr old walking over to them and explain she can also speak it. They looked mortified.

Correct me if I'm wrong but I thought the figure was around 17% of the welsh population being able to speak it fluently?

shakingmyhead1 · 22/05/2018 14:51

Review: Staff speaking welsh between themselves.

from business: Business is located in Wales.

The end.

BUT reply in Welsh!

bonnyshide · 22/05/2018 15:01

When we go on holiday in (north) Wales I have noticed that staff in shops and restaurants will often switch to welsh when around tourists, it does feel like they are gossiping about you.

It feels as if you are intruding on the locals space, although I'm sure they do welcome the tourists and the money they bring into the area, it doesn't always feel like you are welcome.

I imagine the customer had experienced this their whole holiday and had had enough of it. There is a general feeling that they don't like the English.

I would never write a review about that, I would worry about damaging someone's business, I think if you are going to holiday in Wales you need to develop thicker skin and enjoy the beautiful surroundings and not get yourself worked up about it.

MikeUniformMike · 22/05/2018 15:15

Don't go there if it bothers you. Go to France or Spain or wherever instead.

PratRocket · 22/05/2018 16:22

The reviewer is a twat. Can you imagine going to France and complaining that the waiter only spoke English to you and French to colleagues? Hmm

PratRocket · 22/05/2018 16:23

Business is located in Wales.
BUT reply in Welsh!

Genius Grin

AndhowcouldIeverrefuse · 22/05/2018 18:46

Mae'na fair amount of rutsh ar y thread'ma Grin

Basta · 22/05/2018 18:48

But if you primarily serve tourists, presumably the majority won’t be welsh speakers, so I can see that it might feel a bit unwelcoming to have everyone speaking in a language you can’t understand (even though they speak English to you).

Surely that's part and parcel of being a tourist? (Unless you holiday exclusively in places where you speak the language.)

TamzinGrey · 22/05/2018 19:19

bonnyshide I know exactly what you mean. We went to France recently and although all of the people in the shops could obviously speak perfect English, they kept speaking to each other in French! They made us feel like we were intruding, and I bet that they were talking about us and slagging us off. The French have always hated us and use their stupid language to take the piss. Bastards.

Dobbythesockelf · 22/05/2018 19:31

I'm just waiting for the article in the Daily Post about this. I don't think a week goes by that there isn't something like this happening in North Wales. Of course the article will be poorly written but it could be a good advert for your business OP.
(Daily Post is a local paper)

LynetteScavo · 22/05/2018 20:15

@TamzinGrey Uour obviously taking the piss...the thing is I've noticed in Paris this just doesn't happen... people are always very keen to speak English to show how well educated they are.

I think it can be daunting for English only speaking people if everyone in a Welsh establishment stops speaking English when they come in, and switch to Welsh. It has been known......the review could be bonkerz it could be based in previous bad experiences in Wales.