To be offended by this review?

[dolgellau]

AIBU to be offended on behalf of my staff.

I run a business in Welsh speaking Wales. It serves the public who are mainly tourists. Every single worker in the business speaks Welsh and all daily happenings and running of the business is through Welsh.

We have been left a bad review with low score as “staff speaking welsh between themselves”.

The only situation I can see this arising is if a customer orders in English (or French to some staff) staff will chat with the customers needs in English. Then to relay the knowledge to someone to work on the order will say it in Welsh to the other worker; the language that comes most naturally to them. This isn’t the case of excluding the customer but to just get the process done.

Even if the staff were gossiping between another;
How would said reviewer know that they weren’t discussing work related issues?

I think uou need to not be so defensive and accept this customer felt uncomfortable with the staff talking amongst themselves in Welsh. It may have come across as gossiping or something hostile.

I'm also curious as to why if serving mainly tourists your customer face is welsh. Do you speak Welsh in your private or day to day life also or is it often English? If you all speak Welsh in your day to day life's fair Enough,

Even when you don't speak the language it's very clear when someone is passing an order on and clear when staff are simply chatting amongst themselves. It's not hard to distinguish the difference.

I wouldn't be offended, I'd simply acknowledge the customers discomfort. In this the complaint is your staff were chatting amongst themselves, so I'd assume it came across as not work related. As said, even if you don't speak the language you can usually easily tell the difference.

Sensory, Wenglish, thats brilliant :)

Most of the population of Wales probably doesn't speak Welsh but there are areas where Welsh is the normal everyday language.

I have lived in the UK for almost 14 years now and never understood why as soon as anyone speaks any other language than English people automatically get offended and assume they talk about them. When I worked in hospitality we got this sort of complaints all the time. 99.9% of the time the staff would be talking about work. In that industry some staff need a bit of help with their English and especially when they have a problem and/or difficult order it’s easier for them to explain it in their native language. Same as for the Welsh speaking staff. No one slags anyone off.
Never seen this behaviour in any other country. Even my fiancé used to get paranoid that when I spoke to my parents on the phone I was talking about him . Never understood that. Where I work now we have a lot of Spanish colleagues and I really could not care less what language they speak between themselves but some English colleagues comment that it’s rude. Surely it’s not if they’re not talking to you but having lunch together with only Spanish speaking colleagues.
I seem to have slightly missed the point in this long post so no, YANBU. I’d be a bit hurt too.

I would find it odd if they didn’t speak their first language when working together! I’m learning Welsh and would take the opportunity to try and understand - not just being nosy, It’s so useful to listen to people speaking at usual speed not the slow fake jolly ness they use in those language clips! In short I’d totally ignore that review - peid y phoeni!

Review: Staff speaking welsh between themselves.

Response from business: Business is located in Wales.

The end.

This is perfect.

I understand both sides. It can come across as rude. Depends in what context. I know a welsh friend of mine sent her english husband in before her to do some shopping. She followed with their child later to see him waiting patiently in the queue and the cashier and another member of staff saying some horrible things about him which he had no idea about.

Don't take it personally. A very old church near me once got a review saying it was too churchy. I have no idea how church can be too churchy but people leave some weird reviews.

I used to live near Tenby and nobody I knew apart from my boss’s husband spoke Welsh. I’m sure some people did but it wasn’t common.

Moved to north wales and it seemed like everyone spoke Welsh. I have to say maybe it was the area I lived in there but it never seemed very friendly. Shop workers, etc would speak English to me and yes while my head tells me of course Welsh people (of which I am one) should be able to speak Welsh to each other I really can see how it can be off putting for non welsh speakers and in a service industry maybe you should think about that?

You can’t compare it to Spain etc because Spanish people may not speak English whereas I’m pretty sure 99.9% of Welsh people speak fluent English.

I would only feel irritated by it if, as has happened to me, I went in a shop and the staff immediately changed from English to Welsh but it wouldn't bother me enough to leave a bad review unless the service that I went in there for was awful.

As you say, you didn't mean to exclude the customer but the customer did feel excluded as they have shown in their review. Completely reasonable to speak in Welsh but you may have to work harder to gain their trust up front ( smiling, eye contact, mirroring back what they request) to avoid negative assumptions about what you are saying.

If you really want to go the extra mile for your customers you could talk your customers through it ("as this is a real Welsh company, we do talk Welsh among ourselves but what I am going ask is..").

Tourists like an authentic experience but as you work in a service sector, to succeed you need to find a way to focus on their feelings while staying true to yourself and your values.

I'm also curious as to why if serving mainly tourists your customer face is welsh. Do you speak Welsh in your private or day to day life also or is it often English? If you all speak Welsh in your day to day life's fair Enough

If they speak mostly English at home, why on earth would they only speak Welsh at work? Unless you think they take some perverse delight in annoying English tourists?

Assuming, OP is from Dolgellau as her username would suggest, she and her colleagues will be first language Welsh speakers. I see no reason why they shouldn't speak their own language in their own country.

Take no notice, other customers won't be put off by s review saying the staff in wales speak Welsh.

There's an activity farm near me where you can go for the day and feed all the animals and have tractor rides, someone left a horrendous review slagging them off because there was nothing to do that didn't revolve around the animals 🤷‍♀️ the farmer left a lovely comment suggesting that s farm was maybe not the best day out for them in future 😂

Dolgellau I would just put a reply along the lines mentioned by a PP. Sadly it would appear a lot of English people have a chip on their shoulders about the Welsh language. I have no idea why, any more than I understand why they assume people speaking another language are going to be talking about them. Personally it would never occur to me that they'd be talking about me, why would they think me that interesting? It's a lot of ridiculousness.

YANBU.
I also speak Welsh (first language - I'm sure you can guess where I'm from using my username) as do most people I know, and when we can we speak Welsh to each other. However if someone who can only speak English joins us we switch to English as it's only polite. Tbh we usually switch between the two languages in a normal conversation.

I hate the stereotype that we only ever speak Welsh around each other when someone English approaches, and we only do it so we can talk about them

If your staff addressed the customer in English then there really is no issue, they can speak whatever language they want between themselves. If this place was in France, I'd assume the staff would more than likely speak French to each other and then English to customers who spoke English. What a ridiculous review

I wouldn't take it to heart, and I don't think many people reading it will take it seriously. "Wow.. welsh people in wales are speaking welsh. How dare they"

while my head tells me of course Welsh people (of which I am one) should be able to speak Welsh to each other I really can see how it can be off putting for non welsh speakers

How?

Completely reasonable to speak in Welsh but you may have to work harder to gain their trust up front ( smiling, eye contact, mirroring back what they request) to avoid negative assumptions about what you are saying.
Would people make negative assumptions about people speaking Spanish in Tenerife? Fucking hell the English can't speak anyone elses's languages so naturally assume that because others can, you know, not being from England and all, if they do speak anything other than English not being English, anywhere outside England, they are being slagged off.

how

Because I think it’s rude to talk in a language in front of others that the others won’t understand especially when they have a choice. I currently live in England and work with quite a few people from Pakistan and they always speak English to each other. Someone commented once that they don’t talk to each other in anything apart from English and asked if they spoke the same non English language. They do but said it would be rude to us to not speak English.

I think personally when I was in north wales I definitely had occasion when I was in the shop where the girl behind the till was chatting to another customer in Welsh with a face like a slapped arse while staring at me. Maybe my opinion has been coloured by the fact she seemed like such a mardy cow.

YANBU. Perhaps some people don’t realise that Welsh is spoken as a first language in some places and thought there was something odd going on. It sounds an annoying review but, as others have said, not enough to put off potential customers. It might make some more likely to come. Welsh is a beautiful language to hear spoken.

I think the review will reflect on the reviewer, not your establishment. It's in Wales and people are speaking Welsh - what did the visitor expect?

You can’t compare it to Spain etc because Spanish people may not speak English whereas I’m pretty sure 99.9% of Welsh people speak fluent English.
You need to educate on languages and brains. Whilst it is true that most welsh speakers speak English, if you are used to conversing in one language with a person, it’s actually quite difficult and unnatural to switch to a different language with them. An example of this, I have a friend that when we first met, neither of us realised that the other was a welsh speaker, so whilst both of us are fluent, our brains are programmed to speak English together. The reverse is true of welsh, I will ‘switch’ to speaking welsh with my dad without even realising I’ve done it most of the time as it is the default for us. It’s not intentional or meant to exclude, it’s just how we speak to each other.

Welsh aside - if I were in an English shop and the staff carried on a conversation as if I wasn't there while serving me then I would think them rude - so if you are sure that it was purely to pass an order on then yanbu - however perhaps staff should say to the customer 'just let me pass the order to my colleague' do so in Welsh and then turn full attention back to the customer.

However if the customer was ignored while the staff chatted in whatever language then yabu.

How supremely stupid to complain about staff speaking their own language.

To me, the only valid reason for complaint in such circs would be if staff mistakenly thought customers didn't understand Welsh, and started slagging them off.
This happened to a Brit friend of mine, though it was in Cyprus and the language in question was Greek. She let them carry on until she was leaving the shop, whereupon she turned back and gave them a fluent mouthful - in Greek.
That'd larn 'em!

Given that there are very few occasions where everybody in a large group would speak Welsh if the ‘speak English if not everyone speaks Welsh rule’ was adopted the language would be driven out of public life completely and become extinct. Why be shy of speaking the native language of this island? Why the supreme arrogance of the English only speaker who assumes everyone should accommodate them wherever they go?

I have lost count of the number of times I have walked into a business establishment the staff and customers were speaking English as I entered then immediately switched to Welsh

I've lived in Wales all my life and travelled all over it and I've never experienced this.

I have definitely experienced this. A short while back o few from local authority met met up with some people from a Welsh Authority to see how they run a particular project and if we could do something similar. We had a pub lunch that had no other customers when we went in. We heard staff talking to each other. In English but as soon as soon as they saw us started with the Welsh. One staff was acting like he couldn't understand us. One of the Team leaders said something in Welsh and was quite angry.. We asked what was said but he just said it doednt matter. The staf were quite sheepish after this.

I have to say, I can't remember the name of the place but it was a small pub for local people and not in one of the popular towns and cities.