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To be appalled by Grenfell all over again.

166 replies

derxa · 21/05/2018 20:04

The enquiry has made cry and cry. The families' statements. So terrible.

OP posts:
HelenaDove · 20/06/2018 01:18

The LRB has published a couple of letters highly critical of O Hagens piece including someone featured in the piece who feels she was lied to and his condescending reply.

www.lrb.co.uk/v40/n12/letters

HelenaDove · 22/06/2018 01:17

www.insidehousing.co.uk/news/grenfell-council-was-warned-about-gaps-in-windows-by-resident-of-flat-where-fire-began-56882

In the witness statement given by Behailu Kebede, in whose flat the fire started, he revealed that he had complained about his windows not long before the fire.

As part of the 2012/16 refurbishment of Grenfell Tower, new windows were installed in every flat.

According to the report submitted to the inquiry by Professor Luke Bisby, an expert witness, gaps in these windows allowed the fire to spread from the kitchen where it started onto the cladding and then up the side of the building.

In Mr Kebede’s statement, he said: “The double glazed windows caused problems too, as they had not been correctly fitted. There were gaps in between the windows and frames. Air was entering my flat through these gaps.

“I made a direct complaint to the builders regarding this. The council sent in contractors, who, I believe, put sealant in the gaps. But this did not fully solve my problem.”

Professor Bisby’s report also identified the presence of silicone sealant in the window boards.

According to his report, this sealant is being investigated using laboratory testing at the University of Edinburgh and will be reported on in the second phase of the inquiry, which is expected to begin next year.

Mr Kebede also discussed the new heating system that was installed in the tower as part of the same refurbishment.

The pipes, another expert witness Dr Barbara Lane revealed this week, had incomplete fire safety protection at the time of the fire.

In addition, as Inside Housing revealed on the day of the fire, the installation of these pipes involved the temporary removal of safeguards in the floors intended to prevent the spread of fire from floor to floor.

Mr Kebede said in his statement: “Instead of removing the old boilers in the kitchens and placing them with the new boilers at the same place near locations, it was decided that the new boilers should be placed near the front doors of the flats. The reason for this, we were told, was that this was the cheaper option.”

The inquiry continues

AlonsosLeftPinky · 22/06/2018 02:09

I work with very dangerous substances and manage projects involving offloading them, moving them, storing them and using them. As part of that, I work closely with the local fire and rescue team to develop both onsite and offsite emergency plans which are robustly tested at least every few years.

If I make a change to a material used, I have to demonstrate that it is fit for purpose, which for me can involve flashpoint testing. I can't really fathom how that would not be required of Grenfell and other high rise blocks of flats.

It is my responsibility as chief engineer and it is me who would be held accountable in the event of a disaster such as this. If I could demonstrate that I acted on the advice of other competent people they would also be held accountable.

AlonsosLeftPinky · 22/06/2018 02:14

My dad was a senior firefighter for many years. He told me the stay put advice is standard for high rises, they're built to avoid spread from flat to flat. When people try to evacuate, it means them opening their front doors usually within a very short period of time which induces gusts of oxygen to the fire. For that reason they don't typically have smoke alarms other than the localised ones for each specific flat.

Added to that, as people are trying to evacuate in what is likely zero visibility, the fire fighters are trying to enter the building with equipment to establish bases and implement response from below the fire.

He also told me that as the building would be deemed a commercial one, a fire risk assessment would have been required when the cladding was added.

HelenaDove · 25/06/2018 00:19

www.london-fire.gov.uk/incidents/2018/june/flat-fire-ladbroke-grove/

flat fire same area One person has died.

HelenaDove · 18/07/2018 18:39

HelenaDove Wed 18-Jul-18 18:31:38

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/jul/18/grenfell-police-carry-out-three-interviews-under-caution?CMP=Share_AndroidApp_Tweet
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HelenaDove Wed 18-Jul-18 18:33:29

"Detectives investigating the Grenfell Tower fire have conducted three interviews under caution over potential offences relating to the disaster – including manslaughter.

“The police investigation into the Grenfell Tower fire has moved to a new phase with a planned programme of interviews under caution,” Scotland Yard said in a statement on Wednesday, adding that more interviews would take place in the coming weeks.

The interviews, carried out since late June, came as detectives investigated possible charges of gross negligence manslaughter, corporate manslaughter and breaches of the Health and Safety Act relating to the fire last summer that killed 72 people.

A spokeswoman for the Metropolitan police said the force would not confirm whether three separate suspects had been interviewed, or whether the same suspect had been interviewed more than once.

No one has been arrested for offences relating to the fire itself, though individuals who allegedly falsely claimed to have lived in the tower to receive compensation have been arrested on suspicion of fraud.

Yvette Williams from the campaign group Justice4Grenfell said she welcomed the development in the investigation.

But she added: “It’s unfortunate that it’s taken months after it happened, because if it had been somebody responsible like a member of the public, they would have been called in in June last year.
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“But we do look forward to the police doing a thorough investigation and that they are already thinking ahead in terms of gross manslaughter charges can only be a positive thing.”

Officers have spent the last year scouring the tower for forensic evidence and plan to hand back control of the building to Kensington and Chelsea council in early August.

Commander Stuart Cundy said: “The handover of Grenfell Tower by the police will only occur once we are entirely confident that all police work has been completed at the tower and handing the tower over to the responsible body will have no bearing on the ongoing criminal investigation.

“The concerns of the bereaved, survivors and residents as well as the wider community will be central to how the handover takes place. We recognise this will be a significant milestone and one that is bound to stir a range of emotions for all those affected by this tragedy."

HelenaDove · 19/07/2018 00:21

www.salfordstar.com/article.asp?id=4617

HelenaDove · 27/08/2018 19:26

HelenaDove Mon 27-Aug-18 18:37:41

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/aug/24/high-rise-tenants-being-ignored-like-we-were-say-grenfell-survivors-salford
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HelenaDove Mon 27-Aug-18 19:16:00

"Survivors of the Grenfell Tower fire have widened their campaign against the marginalisation of council tenants, raising concerns that others are being treated in the same way as they were before the disaster.

Nicholas Burton, whose wife, Pily, died as a result of the fire on 14 June 2017, and Edward Daffarn, who escaped from the 16th floor, are helping residents at nine council-owned tower blocks in Salford, Greater Manchester, that were refurbished using similar combustible cladding at the same time as Grenfell.
Britain flouting human rights over Grenfell-style cladding
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They have heard claims from tenants that their concerns about safety were not being handled properly. After he visited the Pendleton estate and spoke to residents, Burton said: “It’s just like turning back the clock.”

Pendleton Together, the social landlord that looks after the blocks for Salford city council, has so far removed the lower three storeys of cladding on most of the blocks.

Residents understand that the project to replace the cladding and install sprinklers could take up to two years. They have warned they are losing sleep and are scared about the possibility of fire. Last month, Pendleton Together told inhabitants of Spruce Court, a 22-storey tower, that they must keep their windows closed until further notice because of problems
What we went through with the tenants management organisation and the council, they are going through similar difficulties,” said Burton. “They are not being listened to. After the tragedy of Grenfell, you would think people in authority would take a little bit more care in listening to their residents.”

Pendleton Together said it completely rejected any comparison to the situation at Grenfell Tower. A spokesman for the landlord said: “Pendleton Together remains open to discussing any concerns with residents and encourage reporting of them, via a dedicated email address set up for this purpose or through our normal customer reporting systems.”
Flat owners have to pay £3m recladding cost of two Manchester blocks
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It said concerns had been raised only by a minority of tenants and that some of them were unfounded.

But anxiety among residents is running high. Leaseholders in two privately owned blocks in Manchester lost a property tribunal case which means they, rather than the freeholder Pemberstone, will have to pay the estimated £3m cost of replacing flammable cladding – about £10,000 per flat. The residents of Vallea Court and Cypress Place in the city’s Green Quarter have voiced fears that a fire at the base of their building could start a major blaze.

The blocks are among 474 residential buildings more than 18 metres tall across England and Wales thought to be wrapped in combustible cladding. Only 17 are known to have been completely fixed and there is continued uncertainty about when the rest will be made safe.

In the wake of the Grenfell fire, Theresa May voiced concern about tenants’ views being ignored. In a speech in March, the prime minister said “concerns not being acted on, voices not being listened to, needs being ignored” are “all too familiar to tenants in all kinds of homes across the country”.
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Elizabeth Okpo, a resident of Spruce Court, said the fact that combustible cladding was still in place was not the only problem. Fire alarms installed in flats which are supposed to alert the building’s security team did not always function properly and fire sounders on the landings were not loud enough for people in their flats to hear, so residents have slept through them.
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“There are children in the block on the 11th and 18th floors and we have people who are disabled on the 21st floor,” Okpo said. “These type of people are going to struggle to get down.

Residents had started to draw up a list of vulnerable neighbours so they could try to help people evacuate in the event of a fire, she said.

Pendleton Together said the alarms were set to the volume limit allowed under law in communal areas and there were 24-hour patrols by fire marshals with klaxons.

Okpo also claimed Pendleton Together had made it harder for residents to form an association by failing to provide access to the community room in their tower for meetings. The landlord said it offered Okpo an alternative room 650 metres from the tower.

“How we were treated and dismissed seems to be the same [as Grenfell],” Okpo said.

At Daffarn’s suggestion, Okpo has started a blog, Spruce Court Action. Daffarn was co-author of the Grenfell Action Blog that chronicled concerns about Kensington and Chelsea council, the Kensington and Chelsea Tenant Management Organisation and the 2014-16 refurbishment of Grenfell Tower.

Eight months before the fire, Daffarn and Francis O’Connor wrote that “only a catastrophic event will expose the ineptitude and incompetence of our landlord.

Burton was a member of the leaseholders association at Grenfell that raised multiple concerns about the the 2014-2016 refurbishment.

Other residents of the Salford towers have started a blog – Thorn and Pendleton Blog News – tracking their concerns.

“My heart is overwhelmed by the thought that Grenfell two is in the post,” said Burton. “There are hundreds of towers all over the country and people are not sleeping properly.”

• This article was amended on 24 August 2018 because an earlier version referred to Lendlease as the freeholder of Vallea Court and Cypress Place in Manchester’s Green Quarter. Lendlease sold the freehold to Pemberstone in 2015, and the tribunal was between Pemberstone and the leaseholders."
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HelenaDove Mon 27-Aug-18 19:18:12

I posted some links to articles about what was going on with the tenants in Salford during their refurb in the early Grenfell threads while the fire was still going.

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