To think this isn't cluster feeding, it's all bloody day feeding, and it's miserable

[StepAwayFromGoogle]

DD2 is 3 weeks old. She is predominantly breast fed and she feeds ALL DAY LONG. This morning she fed from 7 am to midday when I eventually caved and gave her a couple of ounces of formula so we could leave the sodding house. She fed on and off this afternoon (slept for maybe 2 hours in total). She started the constant nursing again at about 5pm and it will now go on until about 10pm when she will either fall asleep or I will cave and give a couple more ounces of formula. She sleeps then till about 2am, feeds for an hour, and then sleeps to between 5am and 7am when we start the constant feeding again.

DD1 is 3. I get no time with her at all at the moment and I feel like it's ruining our relationship - all she wants is Daddy.

All the MWs and HVs have said that this is cluster feeding and perfectly normal. Initially they said it would improve after 2 weeks but it hasn't. And I don't know anyone IRL who had this issue with their DC so can reassure me.

I'm sick to death of having a baby permanently clamped to me. My nipples are so sore after 5 hours of breastfeeding. I don't have time to play with my other daughter and I hate it - I miss her so much. I can cope at the moment because my OH or DM are here with me all the time but at some point I will have both girls on my own. AIBU to think this constant breast feeding is not sustainable with another child and ask you what you'd do in my situation?

Look up breast compressions on YouTube, also any by Dr Jack Newman on that or sleepy babies to try to get the process to be more efficient.

It is normal. Nothing wrong with giving a bit of formula if you need a break. I introduced a dummy. Dd never got nipple confusion and happily switched between boob and bottle. I expressed and dh gave her ebm from about 10 days.

This may not be the solution and it's not for everyone but as it's not been mentioned, what about expressing? See if she sleeps after drinking from a bottle of expressed milk?
I'd also agree that a dummy may help. Even a good latch can deteriorate after hours of feeding/if she falls asleep and if she is using you as a comforter then that is going to hurt even if she does feed well.

But ultimately do whatever makes your life manageable and you all happy. Breastfeeding is great and all, but if the cons outweigh the pros then it's not worth it.
Hope things get better

Go see a breastfeeding specialist if you hope to continue exclusively breastfeeding.

‘Specialist’ in relation to breastfeeding = ‘lactation consultant’.

You need someone really skilled to observe a feed and look in your baby’s mouth. Lots and lots of tongue ties are overlooked when feeding is considered ‘functional’, rather than ‘optimal’.

Or supplement with formula if you want to mixed feed.

Always astonished at how people fall over themselves to recommend formula in a situation like this. If you ever needed some explanation of why we have one of the lowest exclusive breastfeeding rate in Europe - here it is. You have a breastfeeding problem? Just use formula! The first, last and apparently completely great, 100% consequence free resolution to each and every breastfeeding challenge anyone might encounter...

Have you tried a dummy? Maybe she is just using you as a comforter. Midwives just go by new guidelines but I'm afraid it might be normal but not convinient at all and is clearly getting you down, what's best for you is best for baby sometimes.

I could have wrote this last week. 3rd baby. Feeding constantly I was so so sore it got to the point where I dreaded feeding him one night I latched him on 36 times on 90 mins.

I had a day of expressing and giving formula/my milk on demand just so I could have a break and it was the best thing I did

My son also has a shallow latch and a lovely Nct lady showed me how to do 'nipple shaping' since then I have had a different baby. Latch is better, taking so much more in one feed, feeding quicker (30-40 mins ish now) and sleeping better

You do what you need to. It does pass but if it's too much then do what ever you need too. Whether that's a night of bottles, carrying on, expressing or formula. You will get passed this one way or another. And you have done so well lasting 3 weeks.

A happy baby is a fed baby 🍼 🤱

This is precisely the reason I chose not to breastfeed DD2 for very long. It's absolutely relentless and once you're stuck in a breastfeeding rut with a bottle refuser, life can be very tricky.

Well done for getting this far - I'd have stopped the bf long before now.

We all know that breastmilk is best, but sometimes it just gets to the point of being ridiculous. Sounds like she's using you for comfort/suckling as well as for feeding.

Whatever you choose to do, you are doing an amazing job.

I had the same with my DD. I’d get a max of 10 minutes before she wanted fed again on some days. She had a tongue tie (a very obvious one that was spotted just after my EMCS). So yes, it can happen with breastfeeding but I wouldn’t say it’s necessarily normal. Her TT was divided at about 3 weeks and there was a slow improvement after that. The first 6 weeks of breastfeeding were horrendously difficult for me, but it really did get better and for me that terrible start was absolutely worth it for the ease of feeding afterwards. I’d really recommend getting her checked by a proper lactation consultant for tongue tie and help with latching. If breastfeeding is what you really want then with support you can absolutely get through the hard part (you’ve done 3 weeks already, that was half way through for me!) There’s absolutely nothing wrong with stopping or mix feeding though if that’s what is best for you. Congratulations on your new baby

Thank you all for the responses and the support.

Unfortunately, my OH can't really take the baby to give me a break because he's looking after DD1 while I sit on the sofa like a milking cow. She will have 'breaks' but they are only for a few minutes before she's awake and looking for a feed again. She's got very good feeding cues so there's no confusion. And quickly escalates to screaming if she doesn't get fed pronto.

She will also not be put down. There are two places she'll sleep - on me or in the car seat. Even at night she sleeps on my chest. It's soul destroying to think she's finally asleep only to transfer her to a bassinet/bouncer/other person where she wakes up and wants to start the whole bloody feeding routine over again.

I tried to BF DD1 and was struggling so tried her with a bottle - and she then refused the boob completely. I had horrendous PND at the time but it made me feel like such a failure and I suppose I don't want to feel like that again. I'm lucky that DD2 will happily switch breast to bottle. I'm open to combination feeding but I'm not really sure how/when to properly introduce a bottle and all the available advice (Google) says not to do it at all or I won't produce enough milk?

We've tried a dummy and she'll take it but not for long and definitely not if she's looking for another feed. Will persevere.

I went to the NCT BF drop-in but didn't find it very helpful. I'll try LLL and see if there are any breastfeeding cafes nearby. The irony being that I'll probably have to give her a bottle to stop the BF for long enough to get there!

I'm already doing breast compressions but will investigate the nipple shaping thing...

I feel you OP, I was told ‘it gets better’ I’m 4 months in and still waiting and it’s driving me insane! My advise is keep giving her a bottle regularly so she doesn’t refuse one in the future like my baby because then you really are stuck!

I also think abreastfeeding group would be helpful. Get someone to recheck for tongue tie and ask them to lift up her upper lip to check her frenulum (the price of skin connect the upper lip to the gum) this can somtimes be tight and cause problems with the latch. Is she staying on one breast long enough to get the hind milk? Her poo should be soft and yellow and lots of pee. Make sure you keep up your own fluids and eat well(it’s easy to forget this when you’ve got all this feeding taking up the time) but it will affect your milk supply. If nothing helps then supplement with formula. But you know what, your baby, your family and you need to be happy. Do what’s best for all of you and if that means formula feeding then do it without any guilt. Somtimes health professionals are almost forced to keep their breastfeeding numbers up and so what’s best for you gets lost in their need to tick a box. Good luck, it’s bloody awful being so tired, miserable and upset when your doing your very very best.

It's hard like you wouldnt believe. My son fed or soothed himself literally non stop from 5pm to 10am the next day he would not come off me.

He would scream blue murder. Then in the day it was every hour. The midwives I spoke to when I said he doesn't come off, I think because they hear it all the time you just get the usual yeah that's normal but my son would literally never ever come off.

They would say he will come off when he's full. I tried a dummy it was a dream made in heaven. I had 15 minutes sleep and cried with relief lol then the midwives bollocked me In my sleep deprived anxety ridden state I gave in and gave him formula and a dummy. It was bliss. Wish I never gave in and just stuck with the dummy and breast for a while to see what happened but they really did make me feel like a failure.

I have never known sleep deprivation like it. I suppose the imaginary woman in my living room should have set alarm bells off lol

My paragraphs dissapeared 😅🤔

My third did this. I could have coped ( possibly, almost, just about, arguably) had I not also had another baby and toddler who needed me too, and who were not benefiting from me being tethered to the sofa for literally hours every day. I switched to formula, and we were all a whole lot happier. Doesn't mean you should, but it worked for our family.

PS OP, whatever you do, you are NOT a failure.

Reading this has just brought back the horrors of feeding ds1. She bf for 45 mins of every hour for 3 days. I topped up with formula on mw advice after every feed which was a total pita.
With dd2 I mix fed and alternated bf/bottle feed just to give myself a break and some time with dd1. It worked much better for me.
Recommend trying dummy again although dd2 didn't ever take to one.
Make your own life as easy as possible and it won't last forever.

I had the same with DS. Everyone would gasp "he's feeding again??!" while I missed yet another meal so I could sit and feed him. Then he'd puke it all up over me and start again.

It improved loads but I can't remember at what point. I did introduce a dummy which helped (despite several family members thinking it was necessary to tell me they didn't agree with dummies - really helpful thanks).

Soon this will all be a newborn fog xxx

Are you able to go to a lactation consultant?

Doesn’t sound right.

I have 3 dc. And i extended bf my first 2 so thought my 3rd would be simple. All went well at first nonmill issues then week 4 not so great. Green poo clicking etc

Anyway went to a llc and she diagnosed tongue tie, gave me some numbers and 2 days later his massive thick tongue tie snipped and all back to normal.

Def seek help if you can

Thank you, @WhatAMessTheBad, I needed to hear that.

How do I find properly trained lactation consultants? Google hasn't been very helpful...

Shallow latch and excessive cluster feeding really does sound like a tongue tie to me. Or certainly some sort of transfer issue. Not sure what else can cause it. Weight gain and nappies can still be ok even with transfer issues - she's obviously getting enough milk but she's having to work very hard to get it. And falling asleep from exhaustion before being full because as soon as you move/wake her she's feeding again.

I had no choice to combo feed as my supply was so poor, and I did this by always offering both breasts then topping up with formula afterwards. My supply was already reduced but this maintained it. Even if you try it for a couple of days... if you see an improved difference then it really will show she's struggling to transfer milk effectively. But longer term you might want to get latch checked properly. The leader of our infant feeding team was a midwife and she missed DS tongue tie. Along with other MWs. I don't think they get much training in it. Not in our area anyway. So I personally won't be listening to MWs about TT again in the future.

Sounds normal to me. Both of mine were like this until around the 8 week mark. It is a very, very long very difficult stage, but especially when you have an older kid! I think the guilt of ignoring my 4 year old for 2 months really contributed to my pnd (or maybe the overwhelming guilt I felt was a sign of Pnd?)

Anyway, it is very frustrating but it does end, I promise.

My second is currently twelve weeks old and the past week or two my eldest has been able to have almost my full attention once more. It does get better OP. Good luck xxx

Hi OP please get a second opinion on the tongue tie from a qualified tongue tie practitioner - midwives are not necessarily qualified to spot this. Baby might just be a slow feeder...but please check just to rule out TT. I knew something wasn't right with my daughter and midwives said her latch was good...I asked 2 to double check her tongue and both said 100 percent no tie. When I took her to a qualified practitioner weeks later she diagnosed a posterior tongue tie that was affecting her latch and causing her to get really tired feeding. I wish I'd ignored the midwives it would have saved us weeks of misery! !

Op try here

www.lcgb.org/find-an-ibclc/

Always astonished at how people fall over themselves to recommend formula in a situation like this. If you ever needed some explanation of why we have one of the lowest exclusive breastfeeding rate in Europe - here it is. You have a breastfeeding problem? Just use formula! The first, last and apparently completely great, 100% consequence free resolution to each and every breastfeeding challenge anyone might encounter...

This

It does sound entirely normal to me o/p. I think for me it got better around 6 weeks.

The issue with formula is other people may say “mixed feeding worked for me”, but a) did it work long term? Every woman i know who mix fed did end up fully ff after a couple of months. You need to be careful as introducing formula can reduce supply, and it’s a slow slide as you need to gradually give more formula, wich reduces supply. B) you don’t know if your baby will accept mix feeding until you’ve tried it. If they don’t, it can be very hard work reestablishing bf. I had one that once they cot the hang of ff, completely refused bf. Took about 3 days from ebf to ff after introducing a bottle of formula a day.

So my advice is always how much to you want to bf? If it means a lot to you then stick with it, and look at other ways of making it easier- getting people to help you, planning activities... i used to do things like bf until the last minute, then bundle up and walk to the library/park/cafe/soft play, then sit and resume bf while the toddler ran about. Sod cleaning and housework. Also get proper bf help.

Try a dummy for a break, although bear in ming a lot of comfort sucking is still stimulating supply.

If you are fine about ff, and would be happy to stop bf, then give mix feeding a go. If it works, great, if not, you’re ff.

Or..... On the off chance you are sw London surrey or close Anna Page is amazing