To wonder how the hell drs, nurses and surgeons cope with dealing with death and emotional distressing situations as a regular occurance

[LardLizard]

Like the ones that work in areas of high stress like surgery or a and e etc

A lot of my family have been at the 'sharp end' of healthcare, emergency and trauma nursing, ambulance and ITU etc. Also a couple of police officers in there. I'd say as a family we have a natural aptitude for caring/crisis management etc. All of them have a dark sense of humor, and growing up in that environment has made me pretty tough in some ways, you get told to stop moaning and get on with it if you're ill/injured in my family, unless something is pointing in the wrong direction or you're losing pints of blood or on deaths door. I would say they all had coping mechanisms for the tough cases, but what has caused early retirement, mental health problems and leaving their posts is the blame culture, the unrealistic demands, zero support, and arsehole patients just looking for a pay out or to cause trouble and the lack of back up to deal with them.
We'll get to a point where there's no one left because of all that.

Yes, the incidence of suicide and MH issues in staff is unfortunately high.
Access to CD, stress,cumulative pressure all factors that can prove too much
It can be insular working in health and social care,as it frequently pilloried and misrepresented.Gold plated pensions anyone?

lougle

Yes it’s completejy true what you are saying about maturity. You have a whole different outlook as you get older and also back then early 80s, grooming and even paedophilia itself were not recognised and talked about anywhere near as much as now.

Baby are you kidding me. From hearing some of my teenagers stories about certain kids and having the total privilege of knowing some of their totally fantastic teachers who go above and beyond anything to care for the teenagers they teach I say hats off to teachers. I certainly could t do they.

You guys are incredible and just like social workers get a kicking from the press.

Sad to hear the usual stories of lack of support, management bullying and ridiculous expectations of when you should retire.

A member of my family is a paediatric palliative care consultant. I genuinely don’t know how she does it.

I'm a student nurse and I've already experienced a lot of patients dying. This is due to the area's where I've been doing my training (and in comparison to people in my year who still haven't experienced any patients die).

How am I coping?

We're taught to reflect - but so far I don't think it's enough to help deal with death of a patient.

I had a bit of a breakdown a month ago and went to my GP. He was brilliant, he listened and helped me to remember that it's normal to feel sad when someone dies it's completely normal and acceptable to grieve. This was a break through for me because in that moment I realised I was telling myself I wasn't allowed to "feel" because it was"unprofessional".

My GP has also referred me to the talking therapy service, I'm currently awaiting an appointment.

I'm still learning and figuring out how to cope. But the day I stop caring is when I know it's time to leave.

I've worked in neonatal intensive care. Also adult ITU and A&E. In adult ITU we had a 50% survival rate. Those who died were generally very sick already although are had a few trauma patients. Neonatal was really tough. We lost about 3 a month but generally those who were born very early or with birth defects of some sort, those were the easiest to cope with as they had the odds stacked against them to start with. The hardest were the term babies who were otherwise normal but had issues during the delivery etc etc. You learn to cope but you NEVER get hardened to it. I have dogs and a horse and they are my coping mechanisms.

ICU Sister her. I have seen some truly awful things and have cried on my may home from work many a times. Sometimes at the end of a particularly traumatic event, we just stand there and say "what the fuck just happened there". We do have a black sense of humour and if you heard our comments/conversations afterwards you would think we didn't care or were heartless, we aren't, we are the complete opposite, but what you have to remember is, following whatever we have just seen, done, witnessed we have other patients to care for, other relatives to deal with, and that patient and relatives deserve as much care and attention and they deserve to see you at your best.

In ICU, we can have a withdrawal of treatment or a resus that fails , that pt will be washed and moved to the morgue and that before that bed is already made up it will be being ear marked for another patient who is just as sick and who needs a nurse/Dr who is at their best.

So we cope, because we have to, I do think you have to be a certain type of person to cope in ICU/A&E etc, too many times I have seen people come who are not mentally strong enough to deal and it isn't fair on them or the patients they are looking after.

Just to add, there are patients that haunt us for the rest of our lives and make us cry every time we think about them. The 90 year old with ischemic gut, the 7 year old with relapse of leukaemia (I heard that mother's hotel of anguish down the corridor when they were told and 2 years on I still hear it).

So don't underestimate the mental impact of working in healthcare. People might seem hardened but it's just a front.

"Sometimes at the end of a particularly traumatic event, we just stand there and say "what the fuck just happened there?"

I always found 3.30 am to be that time in the morning! Either up to your eyes in poo, or 3 sick patients at once, or rampant delirium wreaking havoc, and you'd suddenly catch eyes with a colleague and say "what are we doing here?" A quick giggle at the absurdity of being wide awake at 3 in the morning, tackling an insurmountable task, and you're good to go again.

To the student nurse upthread, it's great you've sought extra support.
I hope your nursing tutors are helping too.
Self preservation is key - you can't help others and be the nurse you want to be unless you can find coping strategies to get you through the tough times.
It can take time and experience, so please be kind to yourself.

What helped me particularly in NICU and PICU was that we were able to give babies and children a proper fighting chance to recover and live.

The advances in medical treatment and nursing care were incredible in these areas when I first started - so I did find solace in knowing that at least there was a better chance of survival than there had been only a few months or years previously. That really helped me.

There is also the total joy of the job - seeing patients get better and families moving on.
I recently met ( by very strange coincidence) a strapping young man with a very bright future ahead whom I'd nursed as a very sick baby with quite a poor prognosis.

As well as the tears of sadness shed over the years, there are also tears of joy and the chance to reflect on happy memories.

Our son's surgeon was quite frankly inhumane in the first years where he did surgery he obviously regarded as routine.

Once it became clear our son's life is very limited he switched into being a very compassionate and caring human being.

There is a reason the NHS is short of 40,000 nurses! I used to be one and left. The emotional labour of the job isn’t worth it. Stress, abuse, long hours, back injuries and very little support for staff. All for a starting salary of 22k! I earn way more working in an office.

With great difficulty. Something the campaigns like a new heart for Charlie and Alfie Evans just absolutely worsened

samewitch it's interesting the story about the nurse who readied the babies for mortuary.

I have readied a few adults in my time. I always found it a profound privilege. They would only have been dead about 10 minutes and you had to prepare them so the family could come in. So you take out their central lines or any canulas, you wash them, take off their pad and wash any soiling, you comb their hair and put fresh pyjamas on. You wrap them up in a warm blanket. You try to close their eyes. And the whole time you're talking to them "Now Jim, I'm just going to freshen you up, OK? I'm just going to take out this line here, I'm just going to change the top".

I don't know if that's just an Irish thing or if UK nurses do that? But we were trained to talk to the body. It was respectful and made it a gentler experience. Also if any family members were outside the door it was appreciated as nobody wanted to think of Dad as being a corpse yet. It was too early.

I remember after my FIL died, my MIL wanted his wedding ring and the nurse had to get baseline to get it off and she was saying "Sorry now, Mr X, but I'm going to have to wiggle this a bit to get it off....." like she was warning him. It was a beautiful gesture. No pulling at him like he was a slab of meat.

I'm so grateful I've had the privilege of preparing those people to meet their family for the first time after they passed. It helps everybody with the transition from life to death, including the nurses.

*vaseline

Elspeth. Every body I have washed and laid out, I talk to. I tell them what I am doing and why. I also say to them goodnight and wish them well on their journey.

Oh yes, always talk to our patient. Always explain what we're doing, apologise when we're turning them, ease them over gently, comb hair gently, lift limbs with care, position them gracefully, etc. It's the most privileged position we'll ever be in, and their last moments with their family.

Their body will stiffen, too, so anything we can do to promote a pleasant posture will make a huge difference to family. Always try to make sure dentures are in place. Close jaws, so that their mouths have a pleasant expression. Bring their arms over their waist, so that they rest loosely on top - it's unnatural to have hands down by your hips, and relatives like to hold a hand.

I really appreciate the care and compassion that was shown to me by the staff at Stoke hospital the night my husband was killed. Everyone, from the A and E receptionist to the consultant and nursing staff, were wonderful under very difficult circumstances. I can not praise them enough.
North Wales Police are wonderful too. Thank you for your kindness and professionalism at the most devastating time in my life. You are all stars.

In my 25 years of nursing I have never known any colleague treat a deceased person with anything other than kindness, dignity and respect.

Everyone from nurses, HCAs, doctors, porters, morticians, pathologists.

It is a privilege to be a part of someone's death, as it is to be a part of their life. Death comes to us all, some sooner and more unexpectedly than others, so if we as HCPs can make a death "better" then that in itself is a privilege. Whilst what made them them has gone, the family still needs to know that their body was treated respectfully and carefully.

My DM is a intensive care nurse. And I agree with other posters she has an element of very dark humour.
She does reflect on things and I believe the way she copes is by working in a very close nit team and also by having a very healthy relationship with death. (Something that is often missing in our modern lives.)

@Lougle I remember once standing in the sluice holding a bedpan full of pee and turning to my colleague who was holding a full vomit bowl and saying "we do the weirdest job in the world!"

@HippyChickMama I know!