I am livid with DH and men in general. AIBU?

[whatwhenwhy]

This morning my husband has gone to work, but I'm still feeling livid. AIBU?

I know that sometimes when he's away on business he might watch soft porn as a "mechanical aid" or "to speed things up" as he puts it I have seen the kind of thing he might watch and it's basically women on women group sex. He assured me he never watches anything with any form of bondage or violence and I have no cause to think otherwise. I have sometimes watched the female group sex videos with him and find it all fake and a bit of a joke to be honest, but each to their own.

Anyway, he came back from a business trip on Friday night. On Saturday morning, he was taking my daughter (10) somewhere. She went on his phone and saw an indecent image. I am not entirely clear what the image was. DH grabbed the phone from her. DD apparently had said, "Im going to tell mummy - ew" or words to that effect. DH obviously felt terrible and told her it was an advert that had randomly popped up. DD believes this because she has no concept of porn sites. DH told me what has happened when he got home - he was highly embarrassed. I asked him for the name of the site and when you google it, the homepage is various images including a woman about to give head and other flashing images inc women exposing their vaginas. I'm mortified that my daughter has even had a second's glimpse of this kind of thing.

Sorry if this is long, but I was very upset and we then had a conversation about the ethics of porn in general and how would he feel if his daughter ended up in the sex industry. In the course if this, DH revealed that "every stag do (except his) ends up in a strip club". This is historical because we're now in our 40s and I think there's only been a couple of weddings in the last ten years, but he's been on probably about 20 stag dos over the years and is "not sure" if the groom had a private dance or other extras. I know all these wives and also know that if they had known their DH had had a private dance before their wedding, they would have called the whole thing off. I told DH he had colluded with deceiving these friends of mine on their wedding day and it makes me feel sick. Plus, he never felt the need to tell me he had been in these clubs at the time or find out how I felt about them. Some have been in stags in Eastern Europe.

I am feeling lied to, even though this is all in the past and livid on behalf of some friends. Sorry, I know the phone thing and the historical stag strip club parties are two separate issues, but AIBU to feel absolutely livid? For context, we have been together 20 years, he is generally a kind and considerate husband and father. Our sex life has always been good. We have our "roles" in that I've been at home with the kids and he's the "provider" as such, but it works that way for us and we have few tensions. We have 3 DC. AIBU and over-reacting? Sorry this is so long.

To my mind, paying a woman, whether to dance for you or for sex, is infidelity of the very worst kind because of the financial transaction involved. It is treating women as commodities. I have told him this. He said he has never paid for a dance and would not want to. He admitted he had probably contributed to the cost of friends on stag dos having private dances though. He is adamant he knows nobody who uses prostitutes. He also said he has turned down the opportunity to go to strip clubs in recent years when others have gone - this is after work-dos etc. He works every day very near Soho and now I said this worries me for the first time in 15 years! He said I can always track him using I- phone tracker, but why would I want to resort to living like that now? He is overseas a lot and never once have I doubted him before. Now I feel like a fool and naive and I'm questioning everything.

I spent a long time working in central government and lots of the men I worked with went to lap dancing clubs. Their wives had no idea, but it wasn't hidden at work.

My ex's group of friends did throughout their 30s, basically a decade of having quite a lot of disposable income, no children yet. Many were already married. And yes, Eastern European stag dos.

I really thought it was normal. I assumed their partners knew. I was shocked to discover they didn't all know.

I didn't like it but my ex claimed to hate it also. He and another from the group often came home early so pretty sure he was truthful. In every other way his friends were lovely. It's difficult to fathom.

Oh god....
You really are naive.

My ex DH is a smashing chap ( we divorced for other reasons BTW) and he is a succesful businessman, abroad loads etc and this lifestyle is the norm.

Especially in the far and middle east. Some clients even pay for prostitutes .

The porn on his phone is the very, VERY least of your worries.

The complete and utter lack of ANY communication in your relationship is the concern.

You’re very naive OP.

My understanding when it comes to the private dance a stag gets is that it's usually paid for by the group. I'm not overly fussed about that when they are all together as a group as it's in most cases to wind the stag up, give him a bit of a hard time and they are all out within the hour.

It's stupid but when the stags dad/fil are in the same place it's very unlikely that extras will be doled out and y'know hopefully he's a decent bloke who wouldn't do that anyway.

Incidentally my OH has recently been on a stag where a couple of guys went back later in the evening and spent the rest of the night there. That I would have a big problem with.

What I will say OP is if your husband is saying all but his own they went to a stripper I'd not be buying it.

The porn is 100% a separate issue. You're either ok with it or not. You have to decide that and make your feelings clear.

This is a wind up , no?

Using words like commodities when you've only just realised that your high earning trader hubby and his chums who work near Soho might just possibly have been to the odd lap dance/strip club?

There are 2 issues here.

1. The porn on his phone. If you are ok with him viewing porn then you just need to have words with him about private browsing etc. If this has made you reconsider porn use then you obviously need to tackle this with him.
2. The strip clubs. It seems odd that you are just discussing this after 20 years. You have to decide whether you think he is lying on purpose or if he honestly doesn't remember which I imagine is possible after a stag do involving lots of booze and by the sounds of it some time has passed as well. It isn't your husband's responsibility to police his friends behaviour on a stag do in regards to dances. If you don't want him going to strip clubs then you need to tackle it from that POV not from him letting his friends have dances.

You can always track him but do you want to be that woman?

I think there's a lot you don't know and he's giving you the pg version.

Women have every right to use their bodies as they see fit. As long as it is their choice and they havn’t been abused, coerced or trafficked. Men also strip for money - but no one seems to see that as an issue. There is nothing wrong with it if it is a choice and they are happy/comfortable. It’s an available service, and I don’t judge people for using it.

You seem to be a bit hysterical over very mundane actions.

My DH didn't have a stripper at his stag, it was his choice but he works in an industry where he has come across trafficked women and it changed his whole view on porn, lapdancers and so on. Not that all women in those jobs have no choice or are trafficked but you'll not know if they are and he's not willing to risk it. My dad, his dad and my brother were all there and have no reason to lie. In fact I know my brother avoids stags like that since having a daughter and his perspective changed. DH came home early from an old school friend's stag when the evening turned to strippers and lines of coke, it just made him realise people go different ways in life. The issue here is your DH needs to stop trying to minimise what he does by comparing to others and make sure he locks his phone!

luper As I put on the previous page, very odd first posting. On a subject bound to get the juices flowing. But not responding to anyone replying, just continually adding stuff.

I am so sorry OP. I would be very disappointed in my DH if he behaved like this too but l don't think it is fair to tar all men with the same brush. Talk this over with your DH until you are feeling much happier about the whole business. I think actually working near SOHO may have lessened his sensitivity to how grotesque the whole industry is.

He obviously has different groups of friends, but apparently despite the diversity, the stags have always gone the same way.

There's one common denominator...

Ugh. I would feel angry too op. Tbh if my ten year old dd had seen porn images because of DH then I think would leave him. Ditto strip clubs. Dh has never been to a strip club or watched porn, it really isn’t compulsory, even though the culture among some groups of men makes it seem like that. I hate this culture of buying women’s bodies, the total lack of care about trafficked women and children. I’ve never met anyone who would be happy for their daughter to go into porn, so the hypocrisy is an issue too. I just could not respect a man who behaved like this and I couldn’t stay married to a man I had no expect for. I think it is completely reasonable for you to ask for this behaviour to end. The porn use, the clubs, the whole shebang.

Strip clubs are not really the issue here though. The issue is your dh was stupid enough to let his 10 year old see yucky porn images on his phone! For that I would be livid. I’m not even sure where to begin with tackling that to be honest.

I'm not ok with porn because you can never be sure as to the circumstances that have brought the women to do that. But when you actually watch it (and I do not watch hardcore stuff) it's so fake and naff frankly, its ridiculous.

I'm disgusted that DH, who is generally on the moral high ground about all sorts of issues, has apparently avoided giving any depth of thought as to the potential circumstances of the women involved in poem. Yes they may have chosen to do a particular job and you could say nobody has forced them into it, but what circumstances have brought them to that point and what have they done before? How can you be sure? He has chosen to conveniently turn a blind eye to this and conveniently disassociate the kind of porn he watches "sporadically" (as he puts it) to the wider context of the industry. Yet he's the first to get on his high horse about recycling and the environment, for instance. I am livid at the sense of entitlement and the lying by omission.

Not all men are like this op, some are decent and kind and honest.

You have married a ratbag, one that has been stretching the boundaries for decades. You need to get it straight in your own head how you feel about this, and what you can and can not accept.

The fact your dd has seen these horrible images on his phone is a new low point, and a wake up call. How dare he bring this into her life?

Your dh is showing very little respect for either of you. I wouldn't want to be in a marriage like the one you have described.

If a stranger showed your child those images you’d be talking to the police. I think you need to work out what to say to dd on the subject. If he’s going to carry on using porn he MUST make it completely private from your children. Kinda obvious.

How do you feel about ladies' nights, OP? Magic Mike? Whatever they call Chippendales these days? Is that OK, or is it just women's bodies you don't like objectified?

Shatnet - Im sorry if it seems like I'm just adding stuff and not replying to specific posts but I'm just feeling very angry and probably just ranting. I have obviously name-changed rvsuze thus is very embarrassing .I don't know if I'm over-reacting because it's historical. I do believe he would not take himself into a strip club these days, but then I would have said that before so it now throws everything into question.

The phone thing- you’ve established that you’r angry and he’s probably angry and embarrassed about it himself. I’d be angy, so YANBU about that but at least now he knows how important it is to delete his history.
Regarding the strip clubs- YABU to harp on about it 20 years after the incident. You say you know these women but I VERY much doubt that they would have called the ‘whole thing off’ because their fiancé had a private dance. They might be angy, sure.
Do you expect the men to call the whole thing off if the hen had a stripper? Seriously, there is a lot more to life...and love...and marriage

Magic Mike and whatever is a load of bollicks and women take this kind of thing as a joke, if they bother at all. The context and the power dynamic there is totally different and it's not comparable at all, as far as I'm concerned. I have never been to that kind of thing anyway because I couldn't be bothered.

The context and the power dynamic there is totally different and it's not comparable at all, as far as I'm concerned

Having seen the way some hens behave on a hen night with a stripper, while I might agree the power dynamic is totally difference, the behaviour is not in some cases.

Have you ever seen a group of women at a male strippers? It can be pretty disgusting the way they behave.

I think you have shown double standards there.

The strip club yabu the porn images that your dd saw no.