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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think this is f*cking terrifying?

123 replies

RomeoBunny · 07/05/2018 16:37

news.sky.com/story/grandparents-right-to-see-grandchildren-could-be-protected-by-law-11363044

Genetic connection should not equal an automatic right to see a child. Grandparents are NOT the parents. How many times does this need to be stated? They are not 'entitled' to anything. In many cases they are toxic and it is beyond the simple reason of their children's divorce for not seeing their grandchildren.

Your time with them is what your children wish you to have with THEIR children.

This is batshit.

OP posts:
RomeoBunny · 07/05/2018 16:39

And as for Aunts and Uncles being entitled too? Hmm my BIL is a 40 a day, vodka swilling cretin who thinks the dole is something to aspire to. My Husband doesn't want him near, and I especially don't. But legally now he might have a 'right' to? I'd burn my house down before I let him in.

OP posts:
Discoveringpluto · 07/05/2018 16:41

I totally agree. I think it's terrifying

MyOtherUsernameisaPun · 07/05/2018 16:43

I think the law can be used for good here. There shouldn't be an automatic right for grandparents to see grandchildren but there will be occasions where a relationship with grandparents is hugely beneficial to children but is blocked by parents who have disputes with the grandparents. Lots of people are bad parents and would cut their children from their grandparents for their own reasons, regardless of the benefit to the child. In those circumstances it would be good for grandparents to have the option of seeking a legal right to see the children.

Pickleypickles · 07/05/2018 16:44

I read about that earlier and can see both POV but i dont see how its practical because of divorces that have happened because of abuse etc. I assume this is in cases where the other parent doesnt see the children either and i dont see how they can guarantee the grandparents wouldnt facilitate contact etc.
I think its too much of a safe guarding mine field to be put into law.

Timeforabiscuit · 07/05/2018 16:45

Good god no!

RomeoBunny · 07/05/2018 16:45

I hope it gets shot down quicker than a flying duck in Yorkshire. How has it even got this far?

OP posts:
StatisticallyChallenged · 07/05/2018 16:48

Nope, nope and thrice nope. I'm currently NC with my mum and like fuck is she having free access to my DC.

My understanding was that the current rules were there for those situations where this is an existing strong relationship and it would be detrimental to the child to lose it; it's hard to tell from what's been said how much further this would go in reality.

TheFishInThePot · 07/05/2018 16:55

there will be occasions where a relationship with grandparents is hugely beneficial to children but is blocked by parents who have disputes with the grandparents

Even then I don't think this is healthy, the burden of split loyalties when a child knows someone has made their parent unhappy, but they have to go with them and have a relationship with them anyway. I've seen it in DC with separated parents when there is tension between Mother and Father, child claims home from contact not wanting to talk about what they did, whether they had fun because they don't want to upset their other parent.

Plus children in separated families already have their time split and this would spread them very thinly if Mum, Dad and a GP all have their own allocated times.

TheFishInThePot · 07/05/2018 16:57
  • comes home, not claims. Don't know where that came from!
Ickyockycocky · 07/05/2018 16:59

What’s best for the children?

Elendon · 07/05/2018 17:01

It's hideous and I agree. YANBU.

It's reducing parents, especially mothers, to breeding machines.

ALongHardWinter · 07/05/2018 17:01

I heard about this on the radio in the early hours of this morning. While my heart goes out to grandparents who've lost contact with their grandchildren due to divorce,or whatever reason,I don't think there is anything to be gained by 'legally enforcing' the issue. I can imagine that it will cause ill feeling and resentment all round. If it DID become law,it would have to be very carefully monitored,because as a previous poster said,there are unfortunately some grandparents out there that parents would not wish to have anything to do with their children for very good reasons.

Aimingfor9stone · 07/05/2018 17:03

I would imagine that each case will be reviewed on it's merits. If a grandparent poses a risk, this will be assessed.

This is more about helping decent grandparents, who get cut out of their grandchildren's lives, for no other reason than spite, by a disgruntled Ex.

confusedlittleone · 07/05/2018 17:05

This is already a thing in NZ, however it's not a case of "I'm seeing my grandchild you have to let me" like all custody agreements settled in court they take into consideration everything including what contact if any was in place and best interests of the child.

LadyRoughDiamond · 07/05/2018 17:06

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FoofFighter · 07/05/2018 17:08

The Family Courts can't get it right a lot of the time even for the two parents, so I don't see that this will help, both in terms of getting it right, and in terms of clogging up the already clogged system for the parents who should be sorted out first.

StatisticallyChallenged · 07/05/2018 17:09

The challenge is that, certainly in my case, my DM was an awful mother - drunken, emotionally abusive, etc etc - and I have always seriously limited contact because I don't want her to be able to hurt my DC the way she damaged me. But it would be very hard for me to prove that she's a risk as she's a typical narcissist who would play the little old lady who only wants to see her grandchildren to perfection.

RoomOfRequirement · 07/05/2018 17:09

I think this is difficult, because atm everyone commenting is a mother, with very valid criticisms of the proposal.

But I'm sure there are also a lot of grandparents who absolutely adore their grandchildren, but their parents are not great people and may suddenly stop contact for no valid reason - which does happen. And I can't imagine how heartbreaking that is for them.

I don't have any personal input, but I can see both sides. Not all parents are great people with their children's best interests at heart when it comes to grandparents.

Hygge · 07/05/2018 17:11

It's terrifying to me.

DS and I haven't seen DH's parents since 2010. DS wasn't even two years old and has no memory of them. DH has seen them occasionally and has limited, very infrequent contact with them.

A relationship with them is not at all in DS's best interests. His whole awareness of them consists of times they've turned up at our door and shouted and demanded to be let in, and on those occasions they have scared or upset him.

They are not people who should be in his life.

Catscakeandchocolate · 07/05/2018 17:15

This is appalling. There are very specific reasons DD only sees DHs father twice a year for very short highly supervised visits. I dont want him to be a part of her life due to his disgusting behaviour. To think I would have to give him free reign hell no. It is my child and my right to decide who has influences on her life until she is old enough to know her own mind. Am I nothing more than a breeding mare with no say now? The only people who think this is a good idea are those fortunate enough to have never had to be related to toxic people or the toxic people themselves who once again want to control the very people who have broken the cycle.

WingsOnMyBoots · 07/05/2018 17:18

I agree 100% OP. It makes my blood run cold.

StringandGlitter · 07/05/2018 17:20

But how do you assess risk when nothing is documented?

A parent might know that their own parents were awful throughout their childhood, but how would they prove it? Often when there's a golden child / scapegoat dynamic even the person's own siblings might not back them up. They're told it's the past, it wasn't that bad, they're misremembering things.

Look at the broken wineglass thread (assuming it's true), how do you prove an expensive gift like an egg pram was given out of a need to control and not just generous gps?

Hygge · 07/05/2018 17:22

As for this Nigel Huddleston MP and his comments that grandparents have been accused of harassment for sending birthday cards or Christmas presents, he really needs to understand that this can be another way of forcing contact and continuing abuse.

We have told PILs in no uncertain terms that we will not accept cards or gifts.

It feels morally wrong to accept cards and gifts from someone we do not wish to see in person.

PIL's have used cards and gifts as an excuse to come to our house when we don't want them here.

PIL's have involved other people by asking them to pass on unwanted cards and gifts on their behalf, even after we've repeatedly asked them not to, and caused significant upset in our relationships with those other people when we've refused the gifts again and asked them not to bring them.

Two of our children have died. PIL's have been particularly cruel about these losses, asking me if it still hurts to give birth if your baby is dead, asking if our daughter was born with all of her face or with bits missing, and used our dead daughter's birthday and anniversary of the day she died to come to our house with unwanted Christmas cards and money and caused us a lot of stress and upset.

That's just a tiny snapshot of what they have done to us so if this Nigel person cant see that sometimes cards and gifts are unwanted and are harassment, then he needs to listen to people like us.

Not all cards and gifts are wanted or welcome. And while most normal people can take no for an answer, my PILs can't and won't and they use things like cards and gifts as weapons to hurt us. They used their dead grandchild's birthday as a weapon to hurt us, more than once.

And I absolutely will call the police if they do this again, because PIL's have no respect for us or our wishes. They won't listen to us. So legal steps may be our only option in the future and this grandparents rights nonsense is pandering to them harassing us.

StringandGlitter · 07/05/2018 17:24

Oh blimey Hygge. That's awful. I'm so sorry you've experienced that.