To ask why the Brits hate apartment-living?

[PaulaLollie]

Hi all, I have been living in the UK for a few years, but I am originally from Europe and I have lived in multiple countries before moving to the UK.

I have never understood why the Brits seem to be so into living in a house vs. living in an apartment.

Where I come from, the wealthy live in huge, renovated, fancy apartments in nice historical buildings, right in the city centre. That is "the dream" for most, if you see what I mean.

In my home country, living in a house most of the times means living in the countryside/ suburbs, which is not what most people aspire to do, if they have the means to live in the city centre. The concept of having a family = living in a house does not really exist.

For example, I come from a comfortable family background, went to private school, and grew up in an apartment. Nearly all my childhood friends did the same. It never crossed my mind that growing up in an apartment was anything less than ideal.

Here in the UK (as widely shown here on Mumsnet) it sounds like the dream is living in a house, while living in an apartment is really not that great if you have an alternative.

Please, British mumsnetters, can you shed some light on this aspect of the British society? I genuinely just don't get it!

Thank you!

Did you see "Gardeners'World" last night? There was an item about a few high-rise flats in Milan - all had fabulous balconies with lots of trees which was called something like 'boscage horizontale' (sorry my Italian is practically non-existent)- they really were fabulous. If I had to live in a flat I'd choose something like that if it existed in the UK, though I fear that the price would be astronomical. They certainly weren't the 'run of the mill' type of flat.

I think that here there's an assumption that apartment living is good for a certain stage of your life, but it's not convenient or desirable with young children. That said, I think I'd like to live in a city again once I'm a bit older and can keep a neat tidy small swish pad without the toys and running around.

It depends on the apartment / house.

I don’t like the layout of most UK houses where I do like more apartment layouts.

My current apartment doesn’t have a balcony but it has an amazing view over the sea and a 30 second walk to the beach. I could not afford a house in this location as they are all 4 story Georgian homes.

I also feel safer in an apartment.

oh yes, that hilariously impractical block in milan. the trees have to be bought at the right size and presumabl y th e abseiling gardeners just chuck the clippings to the ground and hope no one is beneath.

I think the U.K. authorities led the way in many instances. Outside big cities local authorities built most of the housing. It literally just served a purpose during post war era. I lived in a council owned flat when I first married without children. My memory of it was that it was fantastic, I loved it. We went on to buy a freehold house. Then literally rid the wave of the housing market buying “up” each time. So I’d say in answer to OP it’s not particularly that Brits don’t favour apartments, it’s just that the authorities and the markets seem to favour houses.
In my opinion the new build houses that are going up today are terrible. I would love to see a suburban apartment block be built

In order of importance
Noise, size, garden
To achieve all the above is very rare in a city based uk in flat. You should be addressing your question to town planners, councils and architects, not Mums Net.

Noise.
And I'm the one wanting to make it. I don't want to be scared to have a few people round until 1am.

Flats are bloody expensive compared to houses too. The ones in my city invariably get marketed as luxury. Even in my lovely area you'll only pay maybe 10k less for a two bed new build flat, nowhere near as nice as the posh city centre ones, than for a 3 bed ex council house with a big garden and parking. And the two bed luxury flats in the city centre are more expensive than the majority of the two and sometimes three bed houses in the whole city.

I don't think it is snobby to live in a house. We chose house with an hour's commuting to work over flat nearer to London. The prices were the same. Ditto my grandparents - my grandmother's house (which she of course rented did not own) in the NE of England is a house with 2 rooms up and 2 down, pretty standard and costs £50k if you are rich enough to buy the freehold today.
Also some areas of the country have more houses than flats just beacuse that is how things were built. I have a picture of the row of houses my great grandmother was born in the 1800s. They wer ehouses, not flats. They were built for miners and their families and those people needed a bit of garden at the back to grow some stuff; later she kept a pig in the garden to eat. My father's parents bought a house and they had a bit of garden and in the war WWII he could keep rabbits there which again they needed for food.

”Loving all the snobby replies from people that live in houses!”

How is it snobby to prefer a house?!

I love it when we fly home from holiday and you can see all the streets of houses with gardens at the back and a bit of space at the front, it's very UK. I also think our suburbs work well compared to some other places.

Some people think it's "snobby" to want anything other than what they have. It's just as narrow minded a mentality as someone who couldn't even contemplate family members having to share a bathroom.

I live in a tiny inner-London apartment. It's too expensive in the city for smaller properties - more for your money further out. Furthermore, I feel less safe in the city, all the schools are oversubscribed, and I worry about the pollution. I want my daughter to be able to play out after school somewhere safe.

That said, I wouldn't mind an apartment further out in the suburbs!

flowery-How is it snobby to prefer a house?

I can't answer for the original post but and It isn't but there seems to be an assumption from a lot of posters that everyone has a mortgage and can afford to choose. There is hardly any mention on the thread of rented council flats/houses, small terraced housing and low rent private houses/flats

The thread is about having a preference for houses over apartments/flats. This should include all housing, of all classes

The thread is about having a preference for houses over apartments/flats. This should include all housing, of all classes

The thread asked why people prefer houses over flats. People have stated why they prefer houses over flats. Some people have said actually they prefer flats. How is that snobby?

SoyDora-The thread asked why people prefer houses over flats. People have stated why they prefer houses over flats. Some people have said actually they prefer flats. How is that snobby?

I didn't say it was snobby (that was another poster)
However, the thread is about British people prefering houses. Most British people are working class, this hasn't been considered by some posters when answering the question.
What makes Brits different is their history of massive industrialisation. In the 1970s, after the widespread slum clearances, most people lived in council houses/flats. I think this played a part in the 'wanting a garden' choice. After the war suddenly millions of families had a garden, something their industrial ancestors had been deprived of

i have done my bit for my working class roots though.. there are plenty of small houses near Sunderland or indeed in Luton where you aren't in a flat but have very little money. And yes we all know loads of people have no choice over where they live and plenty don't even have a place of their own or sleep on the street. I don't think the thread has much to do with that.

My poor ancestors tilled the soil so not surprisingly when they first worked in mines and shipyards (in areas with a lot of cheap land around) they would pick houses with gardens. Interestingly those who moved into big cities lived shorter lives than those 100 years before in the country presumably because of better living conditions in the country and growing your own food there.

In London a lot of people were moved out from inner city tenements in the East End to 30 minutes out in Essex and the o uter London boroughs to 2 or 3 bed council houses in many terraces all with gardens.

Lived in London when flats were not known as the Americanized apartments. Flats I lived in were good, well soundproofed, had no balcony, one had a garden which was great. As to British preferring to live in a house; unless you have a fortune and can buy a flat knowing your neighbours will be responsible and not cause disturbance, the communal area will be kept clean and well maintained so but a house preferably detached would be my choice in the UK. Scandinavia - flats are good.

PersianCatLady - Unless I have missed it, the OP hasn't posted anything since her initial post. Makes me wonder why she bothered to ask a question in the first place

No, she did post Persian, when the motivation for her post was revealed, she's one of the insecure European 'have a dig at a British person' brigade.

People gave a ton of reasons as to why they prefer living in houses and why flats are considered, generally, to be an inferior choice but she chose to ignore ALL of those and quote the single poster who referenced urban slums, overpopulation and made the bizarre suggestion that people like houses because they're trying to emulate landed gentry. Really.

My son who travels to Europe a lot, just popped his head in the door as I laughed with irritation at the deliberate twisting of the replies to fit something the OP preferred and explained that lots of his European friends have absolutely huge deadbolts and shootbolts in their front doors and generally feel quite afraid of crime/being broken into - something that here, most of us don't really fear.

The reason people here like houses is pretty easy and has been made clear, we like gardens, we like our own space, we don't want people above us and we don't want to annoy people below us, we don't want lease agreements and all the disputes that go with it, we don't want shared anything. We like to live in peace, without interference from others while we're inside. Most people in terraced/semis would prefer to be detached but even then, you're still in your own home and responsible for the upkeep and maintenance of it all without need to refer to anyone else (save a listed property) or pay huge sums into a bottomless management company's account, you still have a private garden and in many cases a private driveway. We're not afraid, in general, of sleeping 'alone' in our houses and we mostly don't have massive shootbolts on every door side to keep ourselves feeling safe.

It's not difficult to understand and OP, my own children are as privileged as you and also attend independent schools. They'd HATE to live in a flat as a first home and love running wild and free in their own private space. I've lived in tiny houses with tiny gardens and I've lived in a larger than average luxury flat and I'd take the tiny house anyday.

But you don't really want to know that do you and that wasn't the purpose of this thread was it?

We (me, DH, 2 DC) live in a maisonette apartment in the inner suburbs of a major European city.

We have 3 floors, our own balcony and roof terrace (where we grow flowers and veg and have a fire bowl for BBQ), a communal ground-floor courtyard with grass, trees and play equipment, plus an indoor playroom with table-tennis table where the kids can hang out safely without leaving the premises, own parking space in in-house underground garage with lift straight up to our floor, communal laundry room with Miele machines if needed but enough space in flat for own washer and tumble dryer and drying space outside, 2 storerooms inside flat plus own storage unit in communal cellar. We are on chatting terms with many other families in the building and all our immediate neighbours. No neighbours above, just beside and underneath. Secure postboxes in communal hallway, and parcels and online grocery shops get delivered to the apartment door. A caretaker lives on the premises.

We're on comfortable but not spectacular middle incomes yet own it ourselves and have already paid off our mortage. And we can be in the city centre in 15 min. by tram from the bottom of our road. There are three small parks with decent kids' playgrounds within walking distance, plus supermarkets and other urban facilities. We could actually manage without a car if necessary but keep it for trips out at weekends.

We'd like a larger kitchen and one extra bedroom (I work from home and use one as a study), but it would take a lot to make us move. I certainly don't think we'd get anything remotely comparable on our budget in the UK.

We like our gardens.

I think the concept of the ‘forever home’ with garden front and back, plenty of room, bedroom fir each child, a ‘living space’ is a fairly new concept.

The gust time I heard it was on Location, Location, Location in which Kirstie pontificates on all aspects of achieving that bourgeois ideal as the basis for a good life and happiness.

Most people will never achieve a ‘forever home.’

Life is full of compromises and a Home is What You Make It - even if your kids share bedrooms (quite normal where I grew up) you live in a flat (again, normal) or many other permutations (some people on narrow oats, in caravans and in falling down mansions) of the way people live.

Barefoot and dancing - that would be my ideal.

Snork there really is no need to be so snarkh (no pun intended). I already posted up thread to say that I appreciate that all the reasons that were given are absolutely valid.

I love my house over the previous place (a flat) because-
-antisocial behaviour in stairway, including but not limited to drug taking and dealing, graffiti and noise at all hours from teenage brats
-lift forever breaking down
-more space in my house
-there’s something to be said about having stairs! And putting your kids to bed and finding peace and quiet a whole level away
-I couldn’t live without my garden now. Space for the kids, a place for me to dry my washing
-having an outdoor space for your animals to run around is amazing
-nicer neighbourhood where I live in the house as opposed to big grey concrete high rises
-neighbours are fab. Close enough to feel safe, far away enough not to hear their footsteps over my head!