Is my DD spoilt or am i expecting too much?

[mumsy2015]

I picked my DD(6) up from school and took her along with my DD(2) to an ice cream parlour as a treat. They have a decent play area and a few animals you can look at. After buying them a large ice cream we went to play and my DD(6) wanted to do the crazy golf. I said no as DD(2) would be lethal with a golf club, i had already spent money on ice cream and there was plenty of free stuff to do.

She kept on and on about the golf so i said if it was mentioned again we would go home. Of couse she did so i said it was time to leave. She started crying so i sat her down on a bench and explained that it was spoiling things, i wouldn't change my mind about the golf and that we would sit for two minutes and she could calm down and decide whether to play on the free equipment or go home.

Two minutes later she is still wailing and crying about the golf so we left. In the car she was screaming and kicking my seat and i lost my temper and really shouted at her that she had spoilt what was supposed to be a nice treat. I feel so awful that i shouted but something like this happens every time we go out and i say no to anything.

AIBU to expect that we should be able to go out and not have tears and tantrums? And how on earth can i handle it better? I am not enjoying spending time with her at the moment and feel like a terrible parent.

They all have their moments though don't they? My eldest was like this at times, I worried that she was spoiled too, she grew up just fine. Keep doing what you are doing, and letting out the odd roar doesn't do them any harm. I mind 2 girls age 6 and 4, they are lovely, well behaved kids but they were a nightmare today. Hot and tired and grumpy. The 6 year old made a massive fuss about not liking her socks, she fussed and whinged for nearly 2 hours about them. The 4 year old whinged every time anyone didn't go along with whatever she wanted. Even the best kids have days like this.

It's all normal behaviour, I think, hers and yours.

She got a bee in her bonnet about something and just could not understand why her fun, and her being able to be in charge of a golf club, was being spoiled by her baby sister!

You can go that way next time or you could

Ignore, the bad behaviour, and try and engage her in activities
Come back another time with just her, or with a friend to look after dd2
Try and make it work with the three of you playing and dd2 not braining anyone.

Sadly, I think generally threatening to leave and then having to leave is actually a punishment to you and to dd2 as well as dd1 so I would always make it my last option.

PS I do sometimes shout at my child. Recently, I did it once when I just really lost my temper. Totally my fault. Very similar to your gold club reason.

But more recently my son was being mean to a younger child and I did shout (again, lost my temper). However, once he had calmed down and I had cuddled him I was able to explain that my speaking to him in a not nice way was actually not nice and that was exactly how he was speaking to another child!

The best lesson for them to learn, I think, is when you do shout or get cross you can always choose to stop that behaviour, say sorry to the other person and resolve to do things differently. Your child (I mean my child) needs to see me modelling that because he has a bit of a temper too!

My DS was a bit like this and things dramatically improved after I brought in a lot more structure and routine into his life (at my house anyway) chore charts with smiley faces for jobs done etc (not really chores tbh just normal daily routines like brush teeth, put uniform on etc)
I also read 'raising an emotionally intelligent child' and adopted the strategies from that, It really helped.

Hi, I think your daughter behaved like a typical 6 yr old & to begin with you handled it very well. Unfortunately the more you shout at her, the more she will learn that when people are cross or angry it is normal to shout! Like mother, like daughter. If you wait for her to be quiet, however long it takes, & then respond, she will learn that having a paddy will get her nowhere. You sound like a lovely mum. 🌞

OP, ‘no more treats until your behaviour improves’ is rather OTT not to mention vague for a 6 year old. Shouting and taking her home was more than enough punishment.

As you regularly face this sort of behaviour, you have time to plan in advance some consequences which don't lead to you and your younger DC missing out. A consequence which feels like you are punishing yourself and the rest of family as much as grumpy DD is a bit of a failure. Don't let her catch you by surprise.
Also try ignoring - say in a loud voice to DC2 "When your big sister is calm shall we go and feed the ducks (insert alternate activity here), do you like feeding the ducks, it will be fun won't it, they are so funny, what noise do they make (at which point my DC1 would have felt duty bound to show off her superior knowledge effectively ending the tantrum)" Act like her behaviour is just minor background buzzing.
You can also try distracting her "Right what's next, ooh I know shall we see if there are any baby pigs/space on the trampoline/whatever floats her boat" and hope she moves on from the tantrum quickly.

At the moment she is getting to be centre of attention, not nice attention but she managed to get the whole day revolving around her. Let her know that you aren't going to let her derail the fun and that you will go ahead without her if need be (fun - through gritted teeth if need be). She will soon learn.

I do think really shouting escalates tantrums in the future. Just follow through, ignore the tantrum, I mean she did go in the car with you, she basically complied.

Say sorry to her that you shouted. She’s learning to control her emotions. Mostly from you. So if you can’t control your anger nor will she.

Next time be calmer.

You would be doing her no favours if you relented on the golf, you have nothing to reproach yourself for.

It was good to explain that her that, in essence, she had shot herself in the foot, because she missed out on other enjoyable activities by not listening and behaving.

I think you handled it well and will reap the benefits of being consistent with it, it down the line.

Honestly, I would have done just the same and not feel badly about it.

Instead of imposing sanctions no more treats until the behavior improves how about you explain what you expect of her when you go out? The no treats thing isn't going to work, because you are continuously punishing her, which could cause more issues. And trying to behave long enough for treats to be reinstated is just not something that will motivate her

So if you go to this place again, say "we are going to see the animals and play, and we will not be able to play golf" and repeat a couple of times on the journey. If she starts to fixate on the golf, distract her. Take her to look at the animals, take her to look at/do the other stuff. It does kind of sound like you let her wallow in it, rather than try to help her move on.

Maybe say that you & she alone could come back and play golf one day when dd2 can be looked after by X (dad, friend etc)

There could be many reasons for the tantrum, I wouldn't automatically assume spoiled. Can you pin point any particular triggers, as you say they are worsening?

It's hard, I have a 9yr old asd dd who can get very overwhelmed, very quickly and meltdown. I have to take a few deep breaths, remind myself that she is struggling, and help her calm down. To do that, I need to be calm too.

I would avoid any outing directly after school. Children of 6 are still having difficulty with transitions (home> school-> shops-> granny's-> into/out of uniform-> into/out of bath-> TV on/off---> bedtime, etc). Best to decompress after school either at a park or at home on her own, depending on what her personality dictates. Some like to shake off school with exercise and some prefer quiet and being left alone for a while.

I would make a deal with her before any outing, and shake on it. Then remind about expected behaviour in a sideways way a few times as the outing progresses by telling her that she is doing a good job of sticking to her end of the deal. Thank her as you leave if an outing has been problem free. Don't buy anything to say thank you. Your verbal praise is enough.

If things go tits up, remind her calmly that you had a deal, that it looks as if she is breaking it, and ask her is that what she intends, reminding her of the consequences you have discussed. If yes then leave. If she tries persistetly to engage you in discussion of the thing she wants, complains about you being mean, unfair, etc, tell her that those topics will not be discussed - it is a breach of the agreement to keep on fighting. If she persists take that as a Yes, and leave.
If no (she wants a second chance), and she stops whining/crying/accusing you of meanness, etc. then ask her can she return to fulfilling her part of the agreement within a few minutes as others are waiting/time is short, whatever. Thank her for her effort if she can behave. Proceed as before and remind about good behaviour obliquely by praising a good job if you see that.

Tell her after a tantrum or any episode that has made you leave and everyone is in the car that you will not drive if there is any carrying on there. Wait her out if she is still in fight mode (accusing you of meanness, unfairness, etc, or still crying, whining about mini golf, etc). After a tantrum subsides, you need to tell her that any further tantrumming or unsafe car behaviour (tell her what this is - throwing stuff, kicking your seat, teasing, bothering, smacking other passengers, etc) will result in you pulling over and stopping until she can behave safely. If she goes berserk remind her you cannot drive safely while she is doing that, pull over safely, and stop the engine. Tell her you will not drive while the ruckus is going on and you will wait until she is calm.

If she tries again to engage you on the topic of the treat she wanted or how mean you are, how unfair, etc., tell her you are not discussing that. You are all sitting there waiting for her to produce safe driving conditions. Do not engage with her on any topic she kicks off about, whether the original one or the offshoots.

Thank her for getting herself under control before you head off into the traffic again. Ask her for a deal for the rest of the trip home. Remind her that the consequence of any more unacceptable behaviour will be pulling over again.

To repeat - don't discuss the topic that she is making the fuss about, ever. Stonewall her.

Don't drive angry or distracted. Don't argue or shout while driving. Do a little conscious breathing before entering the traffic.

It is a very good idea to offer an apology if you look back and realise you have been unreasonable or have modeled behaviour you would not want her to copy. Do this a few hours later even if you realise soon after that you were wrong.

Also a good idea to reconnect by means of a hug and an affirmation of some good point of the child's.

I think a DD of 2 is young enough not to be really bothered by leaving, and not really able to discern what is going on, apart from being conscious of the noise.

If you curb the tantrumming in the next few months by being very explicit about expectations and by following through on reasonable and immediate consequences, everyone can have a better time soon.

I agree with apologising for shouting- modelling what you would eventually like to get from her.
The books that really helped me get through those years were “How to talk so kids will listen” and “Playful Parenting”.