To think it's rubbish that you can tell if someone is of Jewish descent?

[brentlondon]

I'm not talking about stereotypical features etc. as I'm pale and ginger with a very ordinary surname...

I have a very good (Jewish) friend who claims he can tell if someone who isn't Jewish has a Jewish background. Be that a Jewish grandmother or something. Without taking him too seriously I asked him whether it was some special power he possesses but he is adamant it's something he is able to do. He guessed it about me, or so he says.

A few years ago someone told me that it was very likely that I have some Jewish ancestry.

The other day I got chatting to a local reform rabbi by chance and we got talking about my background and history. I mentioned that I am of partly "Jewish" descent. He remarked that he "wasn't at all surprised".

AIBU to think this is rubbish and that you can't tell. I mean, I can take a guess if someone is of Irish descent but that's because of features and a surname. Surely this kind of thing is impossible and they're having me on?

In response to There’s a Jewish accent?

I have a teeny amount of Jewish ancestry (one grandparent). We have a large local Jewish community. Around the time of a couple of Jewish festivals some of the orthodox community approach people they think are Jewish to bring them closer to the faith in the local precinct. My colleagues and DH have never been approached, but they always ask me.

There is a ethcentcy associated with jewish and Muslim (lebonnenise Christians too) people who are descended from that area as these people all display certian genetic traits, but it is a geographical area not a relegion but jewish people until fair recently genetically speaking did not marry/ interbreed with people outside their religion much as was forrbinand / frowned upon (this practice stopped about 200 years ago or so though).

But if you are decended from people of the Levant they have a pretty good chance of having jewish ancestry.

Sorry for spelling i am dyslexic and DH stole my laptop with my spell checking software for work.

I'm interested in this sort of thing, but from a human history perspective. Guessing where people are possibly from, and wondering about the story behind this on how people have moved around and why, that's the stuff that interests me.

you can frequently tell a North London Jewish women from a Leeds Jewish women

Wouldn’t that be because one had a north London accent and one had a Leeds accent? like a north London atheist and a Leeds atheist? The accents are different because they’re from different parts of the country. Regardless of their religion.

" I can spot a British person when abroad regardless of their ethic background,"

that is true. You can easily see if a Black person is British when ur in eg Spain way by the way they wear their clothes, somehow..

Or once i was in Patras Greece and two white guys walked into the ferry terminal, they might as well have had 'BRIT' stamped on their foreheads.
Again it was the way they wore their clothes. They had bermuda shorts, deck shoes, and stripy shirts unbuttoned at the top...

People have claimed they "know" my decent and mist get it right (probably because of what i call certain things) but I'm more "why do you wanna know?"
I remember when I was 8/9 My grandad wanted to take me & my mum to his home village to show me where he grew up etc and me & mum went to a small cafe. A few older people were fussing over me but when my mum went to the toilet 1 guy asked me which school I went to, thankfully my mum came out and told him quite crossly that I went to school in England. I didn't understand at the time but I remember my grandad wasn't happy at all and took me back to the cafe the next day. I still don't know what was said but the little group did look ashamed of themselves. So now when I visit some who don't know me might ask which school I went too (not often) and I refuse by asking "why do u NEED to know" in that 'i know what ur trying to pull' voice, they never answer me.
x

Wouldn’t that be because one had a north London accent and one had a Leeds accent?  like a north London atheist and a Leeds atheist? The accents are different because they’re from different parts of the country. Regardless of their religion.

Yes of course! I phrased that very poorly

What I was very inarticulately trying to get at was that if you had two Leeds girls (one Jewish and one not) and two north London girls (same), and could hear them but not see them, you'd often be able to tell the Jewish girls by voice alone

Tends to be the more 'Becky' Jewish girls (British equivalent of JAP in the US - Jewish American Princess) who have the distinctive drawl

oh i remember the 'Becks' they used to hang about in Bar Linda at Golders Green station, and at Edgware station too...:D ha ha that is a blast from the past.
Becks always had lovely hair and often Avirex flight jackets...

Ahh yes I understand you now banana! I don’t think I know any Jewish people to be able to distinguish an accent.

Right, I can understand that Mighty, but it is still his choice rather than anyone else’s.

I am really interested in my ancestry but I won’t get a test done because the companies keep your sample indefinitely.

Rather like posting on a public site and finding your post in a newspaper, once it’s out there you have no control over what is done with it.

I'm from Jewish heritage but nobody can tell. You can tell with my grandfather but it hasn't come through in my generation.

I think it's more to do with mannerisms, expressions, idiosyncrasies, that type of thing.
I am Jewish and I can definitely spot a Jew in my home country, but I do not think I can here in the UK.

I am really interested in my ancestry but I won’t get a test done because the companies keep your sample indefinitely.

@AdoraBell, why do you see this as a problem? (totally sidetracking, sorry OP!)

Like I said, I don’t know any Jewish people but I’m very used to hearing both those phrases. I’ve seen them on MN too although of course I have no idea if the poser is Jewish or not. But definitely hear them quite often in real life.

I didn’t know that adora and neither did he but I certainly won’t be suggesting anybody to get it done now I know.

His Mum wasn’t a very nice woman and he doesn’t want to lose the connection to his Dad so he didn’t want to know.

My nan had Jewish ancestry from her. father - her Jewish ancestors were called Gern & Daniele, not sure where they were from.

As a result a lot of my mums family do / did look Jewish with Jewish surnames but my great grandad converted to Christianity afaik in the late 19th century.

On my dads side there is some 'foreign' possibly Romany ancestry - I've traced his grandfathers family to 16th century England where they had Latin names. The 'foreign' ancestry is on his nan's side but I can't trace that so it remains a mystery.

I love genealogy!!

My MiL would have counted as a Jew under the third Reich definition. I always joke that it comes through in her need to feed everyone,a habit that DH still has.

I don't think anyone has ever asked if either them have ever been asked on their looks though

porcupine I cannot remember the source now but it was in the press, probably TV news, possibly a couple of years ago.

Given that companies make money by selling data I don’t feel like adding my DNA to someone’s portfolio.

I have been questioned about being Jewish on several occasions (once by a Rabbi) - I have "the look" apparently. I'm not Jewish but it is possible that some of my ancestors were, I suppose. I guess that's true of many people.

I'm always suspicious of the motives of people who ask such questions (well maybe not the Rabbi). I always wonder why people would be so keen to know. I think 10 minutes in Israel would be enough to discount the possibility of a "Jewish look" other than the obvious "human".

Are people really so ignorant? I don't think much of the 1500s were great.

Back before the internet you could tell many orthodox Jewish women because they had such a limited range of wigs available outside London that they always had almost the same one or two hairstyles.

The internet has changed all that and apparently now the most popular style is the ‘Sarah Palin’. Ultra-orthodox women who can’t use the net are stuck with the old fashioned ones.