To be so upset about the way things are in our family: DH, my year old and our baby.

[QueenofmyPrinces]

I have two sons aged 4 and almost 8 months. The age gap is just under 3.5 years.

When the baby came along we had a few jealousy issues for about 6 weeks (but I expected that) but then my eldest started to dote on the baby and was constantly telling everyone how much he loved his big brother.

Fast forward to the last few weeks though and things have deteriorated so rapidly that I could cry about it. Suddenly he’s telling me he doesn’t love his brother anymore, he wished his brother wasn’t here and that his brother is ruining his life.

He’s started being very physically rough with the baby, purposefully pushing him hard, using his feet to roughly push the baby away, hitting him quite hard on his back, kicking him and the other day he even bit the baby leaving teeth marks in his hand. This behaviour has been going on every day for near enough 90% of the day. Our eldest has also started becoming quite defiant, ignoring everything we say to him and deliberately doing things he knows he shouldn’t.

I give him two warnings about his behaviour and if he does it for a third time, which he does about 90% of the time, he gets sent to his room. He’s not bothered though and just starts misbehaving again as soon as he comes out. I’m totally exasperated by it.

He’s normally well behaved for me (plays up more for his dad) and I’m quite calm with him but I admit I’ve lost my temper with him a lot over the last few weeks. My husband has got no patience for it at all and shouts at our eldest our lot, very loudly and harshly, sends him to his room frequently and I don’t like it.

When I ask our eldest why he’s done x, y or z, he just says “Because I did”. I then ask him the question again and he says “Because I’m a naughty boy.” I can’t bear hearing him say that as I know my DH calls him naughty quite frequently so I know my son now believes it. I also tell him that he’s not a naughty boy, he’s a good boy, but that he’s behaving in a way that we can’t allow.

I don’t know if it’s a change in his routine as it’s Easter Holidays over here so he’s been home every day as opposed to in childcare for 30 hours (his free funding) or the fact that as my DH is a teacher he’s been home every day for the last two weeks which he’s just not used to.

If anything is upsetting me the most it’s seeing the breakdown in the relationship between my DH and the eldest as they normally have such a wonderful bond. My eldest now seems to be pulling away from DH (I’m not surprised though) and wants me constantly and tells his dad that he’s on “mommy’s team” and he doesn’t want daddy to be in our team.

My DH was bought up in a very strict household and his dad was a patriarchal figure who cane down hard on any kind of poor behaviour which is where I think my DH gets it from. Throw in the fact my DH is a secondary school teacher and has to be strict and I think his attitude is a result of those factors.

Sometimes I worry DH appears to favour the baby over our eldest and I’ve told him to try and look at things through the eyes of a 4 year old but he doesn’t seem to grasp my point. I also worry though that the eldest think I favour the baby too because like I said, I’ve lost my temper at my eldest too when he’s been purposefully hurting the baby.

I fear I’m rambling now but I just needed to get it out because I’m feeling upset over it constantly.

I just needed to get it out and I’m desperate for some help or advice because it’s all just such a mess.

Not read the whole thread so probably repeating stuff, but i found having a baby and toddler (2.5 year gap) far harder than just one. Dd2 was very clingy and dd1 was very jealous. It gets easier over time. Only advice i have is to give the older one special 1 to 1 time. Take them out, make them feel special. That improved dd1's behaviour. I called it "Mum and dd1 time." Your dh could do the same.

Sometimes you have to chuck the rule book out of the window. Ds2 used to get so angry as a toddler. We did the naughy step to no avail. Then I remember ed the phrase
'if you do what you've always done you'll get what you always had'

So we did the exact opposite and gave him lots of cuddles and love when he was awful. Bizarrely itworked. Felt wrong, but worked.

I read somewhere the mummy do it was control issues not seeing daddy as part of the family unit but on the outside.... get dad to tell him... no daddy will do it....

Rather than focus on the discipline, can you both focus on a reward chart? I think, at 4, you can explain that his little brother is following him around because he thinks he is soooo amazing and wants to copy. Get the older brother on board and set out your expectations and reward him every time he is kind or controls his impulse. Ask him to tell you when he is feeling cross so you can intervene and remove the baby. Show the older one that you understand his frustration and that you are willing to listen to him and help.

I’d do a bit of love bombing and more 1 to 1 stuff. His little worlds been turned upside down. Keep punishments short and immediate. Each day start a fresh. Yes, reward charts and rewarding good behaviour sounds like it might work. More emphasis on good boy.
I think it is dangerous labelling them naughty because it gives a label to play up to.

Yes missmapp I did the cuddling too when mine were in a state. I think sometimes their emotions are too much and they don’t know how to handle it, they get in a state and just need that cuddle.

I do strongly agree that labels stick, there's 12 months between myself and a sibling, I was the one who strives hard to do well and behave, where sibling did the opposite. It was almost like the tag of being naughty was rewarding.

My Mum has gone on to have many more children, I've siblings a plenty. I realised that negative behaviour is sometimes an attention seeking tool. This came to a head when someone arrived who had no time for the negative behaviour, so the child moved onto another form of trying to get attention.

I have seen on SM when there is a new arrival, especially if you're breastfeeding or baby wearing, as an example. I wonder how the siblings view the fact it's all about baby. All the photos are of baby in cloth diapers, that kind of thing, so you can see why a child may process favouritism that is just you looking after baby and celebrating the milestones you celebrated with them.

I'm invariably ancient now, but I recall at home it didn't matter if you were good or bad, the treatment was the same.

Have a discussion with DH, maybe open ended, asking why does he think your eldest is acting that way. Then steer the conversation around how much attention you give baby verses your eldest, then to how the negative attention could be a form of attention seeking.

If there's 2 of you there during holiday periods, could DH do more with DS1?

Mine are much older now but once they were off the naughty step they told me what they had done that was wrong and meant they were put on it and then we always had a big cuddle. (I also had a rule that if you came off the step before you were told then you'd spend longer on it.)

On the crawling baby being a nuisance when your older child is playing, I didn't have a playpen but a travel cot that could be collapsed so it took up a lot less room. Might help?

Thanks everyone for your replies, they are really helping me to see things so clearly as opposed to feeling overwhelmed.

We do have a reward chart where he gets a certain number of stars for doing x, y and z, which he does each day but he still misbehaves outside of doing those tasks.

The four of us have been out for a few hours this afternoon and we put the emphasis on doing something our eldest wanted to do and we’ve actually all had a nice time and since being home he’s been well behaved.

I’m hoping that as things return to ‘normal’ next week when my DH is back at work and the routine of the eldest’s 30 hours childcare starts again things may just calm down a little.

Dd1 is 13 now. She was fine before we had dd2 and has always been good at school. Looking back, she was hurt and upset when we had dd2, so we just needed to make her feel better for her to behave well again. Lots of praise and 1 to 1 attention.