To be upset with school?

[DeltaPitch]

Ds (12) has ASD and has just returned from his week residential trip, We had planned to not send him but after much pestering from school about him missing out, agreed. I was informed that he wouldn’t be forced to do anything he was uncomfortable with and he would have a great time. He’s came back looking and acting a shadow of his former self, it’s heartbreaking to see. He has massive fears of water, the dark, danger etc. He says he had to take part in activities such as rock climbing, walks in the dark etc as there was no alternative and he was scared. He was told there was no other way back. I unpacked his case to find his clothes stinking of urine. He reluctantly admitted he wet himself as the instructor was ignoring his requests to use the toilet and they were in the middle of a forest. I instructed the school to give him his daily medication in food as advised by his gp to stop unessessary upset, yet they have taken it upon themselves to make him swallow the pills whole, not a problem as such but again undermining my instructions for him. School is now closed for the Easter break and I need to figure out how to tackle it when they reopen or if I’m just being overprotective. I appreciate their tactics may have been fine for a neurotypical child but they know ds has ASD. Opinions appreciated.

Like others on this thread, I’m a teacher and have a child with ASD. Every residential he has been on, I have been involved with the ILP and specific risk assessment for the trip, and it has been thorough and tailored to his needs. From a Y6 residential to a Y9 trip abroad to a Y11 Geography field trip.
What your DS has been trough is completely unacceptable, and you need a meeting or two to sort out what happened and to ensure that the school never fail him again. Keep notes, back up conversations with emails, keep a paper trail, involve the SENCO and next time get all agreed procedures and accommodations in writing before the event.
So angry, most schools manage this sort of need well, so all schools should. It’s their responsibility.

Oh your poor boy! You must feel devastated for him to come home from a school trip in that state!
I can see why the school felt it would be good for him to go but it wasn’t handled very well was it!
Twogoround we are talking about a lad with needs who clearly finds going to the loo in a forest an issue!

For all you me horrible to me
I am the mum of
two grown ASD kids with out a statement. Called some thing else now .
I have been in school trip and paid 100s to do so as my son need injected. Med s.
If your son could cope with our a 1 to 1 you should not have sent hum . As for med you have go by the rules . If what to go against them then you have go with your child. And pay ....
If your child does not normally have a 1 to 1 why not he odversely need it.
How is going to cope in secondary school. You really need to think about that.

I’m sorry you went through that.

Twogoround: the OP had school’s assurances this would be handled differently. She should be able to trust them. That applies to the medicine and the activities. The OP was told the medicine would be given in food and was even asked to provide yogurt for this purpose. She isn’t going against the rules at all.

Another one who would be absolutely furious with the school and would send an email asap to say that you need an urgent safeguarding meeting with the head and senco as soon as school reopens, but not given them too many details to start with, so they can't get their story straight over the break.

I would however write down an account of everything your ds told you, maybe email it to yourself today or tomorrow, so it's date stamped and is a contemporaneous account that you can use later on. I would also write a separate document pulling out all the issues and problems, as bullet points or in a table, so that you can go in and go through every little detail, covering each failing that your son had to endure.

I would also get your son to write his own contemporaneous account if he is able to, separate from the nightmare that he recounted to you on his return. If he is writing it down, different details might also appear.

I would also contact the centre they went to and find out exactly what they were told about your son - as much as they can reveal without breaking confidence so might be tricky - but even just to ask them if they were told that your son had asd, and if so, how much they were told about the special requirements he had, the special risk assessments he needed and so on. If they won't tell you, then put it in writing that you will be contacting them once school has returned after easter in order to get them with the school's permission, so not to throw anything away, and to write down what they remember now... Hopefully they will want to cover their backsides too - so will prefer to say that they weren't properly briefed (if that's the case) so they thought they were dealing with a NT child rather than knowingly treating a child with asd badly.

And I'd also ask to see the risk assessments that were done for your son, given that they pestered you to let him go and knew they were going to have to make special arrangements for him as there were things he wouldn't be comfortable doing, thus they knew that he would have to sit out of some activities and that making him do them would scare him... Unless they were planning to make him do the activities all along on the basis that they knew best (!!) then they should have known that from what you have said that he wouldn't be able to do some activities in which case he is young enough that he is going to need supervision - in which case what provision had they made for him.

It's obvious in hindsight - and if they were saying all the right things in advance that then why wouldn't you believe them - but it really doesn't sound like they actually had made provision for him or his particular requirements at all.

Just out of interest, Is it one of those trips that everybody is expected to go on and so they would have had to have dealt with one student staying behind if he didn't go, making it tricky for them in school if he didn't go? Or is it one where half or two thirds of the children go so still plenty remain in school so him going or not wouldn't make much difference either way?

Your poor son. It's an incredibly cruel and callous thing that those teachers did to him - and I hope that he is able to recover. And that he gets a proper apology from the school, the residential trip staff and the school teachers that too him.

If your child does not normally have a 1 to 1 why not he odversely need it

Meanwhile in Magicland, there are just thousands of spare 1-2-1's supplied by the government who are just ready to swoop in on their magical unicorn for every child that desperately needs one.

Neither of mine needed 1:1, at school or at university. They did, however, need reasonable accommodations made for them in unfamiliar or challenging situations as children. Now as adults, they organise those coping mechanisms for themselves.

Secondary teacher with experience of organizing hundreds of trips.... You definitely need to complain -pm me if you would like me to read it first.
I am presuming this is a state school, if not what follows may not be relevant. Am including just so you know what is required by the school. I would complain to the head and the local authority (who gave permission) - I would never normally suggest going to the local authority first, but they also have responsibilities.
Schools have very strict procedures in place for ed visits and your son's needs should be evident on all the paperwork submitted. As far as I am aware, all educational visits must be authorized by the local authority (at secondary this certainly even includes stepping outside the school gates ) - I think this is a nationwide requirement. We are required to submit all paperwork to the local authority via a website - i am not sure whether every LA is on there but there are loads listed. Academies are required to adhere to these rules too.
As a trip organiser you are required to know your students; this involved firstly checking what information the school has on the children (sen/medical needs) and cross referencing with information provided by parents on the trip's consent form. Any concerns should be discussed with the parents and a protocol written into the trip's handbook (it is good practice for staff accompanying to have a trip handbook; staff briefing documents have to be submitted to the la too so there should be evidence of that).
For future reference your own paper trail of what was said before the trip would be helpful, but not essential if the school is aware, and i presume they are, that he has asd (while obviously in this case they do know, i am adding it as it is amazing what information you suddenly get about some children once you are organising a trip, that the school was not aware of).
As they were using an outside provider for the trip (another presumption, but from the activities mentioned and there only being two members of staff i am making that assumption, uk based centre lead activity 1:15 ratio from the school at that age), the provider should also require a list of students and a list of additional needs and all their staff should be briefed too; usually at the start of each activity, the centre's staff will ask the school staff if there is anything they need to know about any student and if for any reason they didn't, then the school staff should make them aware.
Re meds- as you discussed beforehand and provided yoghurt for administration, i do not see why that would be an issue, so you should have been informed of any objection to that beforehand.
One of my biggest concerns is why on earth they badgered you into sending him. If a child with additional needs wants to go on a trip I will happily bend over backwards to take them and accommodate them, including changing accommodation and itineraries to do so; I am surprised that knowing the extra work involved they were so insistent.
Finally i would also question the experience of the staff involved. My la rates each staff member for what they are authorized to do. For example, i am authorized, should i wish, for handgliding in outer Mongolia, the nqt in my department couldn't take them to the end of the school drive as they do not have the experience yet.

Send your complaint now, but please do not expect a response until the start of term (i would explain you don't expect response until then in the first lone of the complaint). Nothing can be done by the school until term starts again.

The website I refer to is evolve edufocus. You can see if your la and or the school is listed there

Ofsted. Ofsted. Ofsted. Report this incident now to them
Write to your MP and put in a complaint

Surely OP should give the school a chance to respond to her complaint first.

This sounds awful. I'd want to know why.

"Meanwhile in Magicland, there are just thousands of spare 1-2-1's supplied by the government who are just ready to swoop in on their magical unicorn for every child that desperately needs one"

Indeed, MidniteScribbler

I am a TA. I can think of several children who need a 1:1 who don't have a chance of getting one

Oh and I can see why there would be strong rules around not hiding drugs in food - but that's very different from needing to take your tablets with food - different tablets need to be taken before eating or an hour after eating or while you are eating and to not do so can completely change how they are or are not absorbed thus completely changing their effectiveness; the pharmacists don't put these types of instruction on the food just for fun.
Likewise the not letting him take with yogurt to ease the passage of the pill - again, important to your ds to take the tablet properly. Particularly if you had sent in yogurt. Did your ds ever get the yogurt do you know or did it get lost?

Another thing that occurs to me - it sounds like the residential was for more than a single overnight. It's not on that they didn't keep you informed or let you speak to your son or maybe that they didn't let your son speak to you to let you know how badly things were going, so that you could have a) put a rocket up them while he was there for letting things go so badly wrong (worrying if you say he is a shadow of his former self that they didn't notice) and/or b) made arrangements to get him early as it obviously wasn't working.

As a teacher I think you are a being unreasonable. Why did he go on the trip? (surely you were aware of the activities so why not just keep him at home).

He's 12. Surely he can remember to go to the toilet before a journey and hold himself.

Staceybowersrocks

Have you read the OP? The school wanted him to go and made assurances about how he would be catered for. They failed to meet their promises.

And there is no 'surely' - some children can't take themselves to the toilet without instruction. He's autistic. That could easily mean he needs to be told when to use the toilet.

Please don’t let this drop OP. I went on a residential and my mum made it clear I was nervous of deep water and I could do water activities but I was not to be made to do anything outside my comfort zone.

We went canoeing and the teacher told the instructor this but he then took it as a challenege to get me to fall in the water, he made me run across the canoes calling me a wimp if I would not do it and I ended up falling in. I could not catch my breath and it ended up with a classmate pulling me out while the instructor laughed.

Next came the dragon boat race and I was so cold but was told by the dickhead of a headteacher there was no time to change so I had to do it freezing a wet through.

I got back to where we were staying and i ring my mum in tears, she then rang the headmaster to find out what had gone on and Instead of being sympathetic he said I had made him feel awful and had ruined the whole trip. He stood me in front of everyone in the class and told them I was a wimp and everyone laughed at me. He then made me ring my mum while he stood there and tell her everything was ok. Only the class teacher helped me but she was scared of the headteacher.

Since then I have had a deep fear of cold water and being out of my depth. It has got to the point when I can’t even go in a slightly cold swimming pool without having a panic attack. If i came across that instructor I would smack him so hard and tell him that his dickish behaviour had left me with a huge phobia which means I can’t swim with my DS in the sea or in a pool abroad as I always find outdoor pools to cold. I did get the chance to tell the headmaster what I though of him.

It was a male instructor on Derwent Water in the Lake District in 1992 in case anyone else came across this arsehole

Choccywoccky

That instructor and that Headmaster - cold water is not for dicking about in - speaking as someone who does wild swimming and watersports even I've had times when I've caught my breath.

I hope that you can conquer your phobia at your own time and pace.

I cannot believe your headteacher did that! I only hope that sort of behaviour is a thing of the past. Thing is, providing you are doing things for your kids like taking them out and doing outdoor things with them I'm not sure about how much school adds to it.

It sounds terrible but I would wait and get the school's side of events before doing anything like contacting Ofsted.

I can easily imagine how an outward bounds school trip (I've been on a few) could seem as you describe to a child with ASD.

The activities:
We tell children that we will always encourage them to do every activity but never force. For a child with ASD the instructors' encouragements might have seemed like force? The way out might not have been obvious once everyone had started so a combination of anxiety, ASD and being 12 might have made him think there was no way out and he was trapped?
I have seen children, with and without ASD, sobbing 'you promised I didn't have to, why do I have to?' and not even being able to process the instructor saying 'you don't have to; come down' etc. They're too worked up to listen. It can also be the most incredible achievement for a child to get through an activity that has made them cry, scream, get stuck, say they can't do it etc. Whole classes get involved in encouraging and helping someone and the smile on the child's face when they make it to the end can be really special. I wouldn't assume the instructors weren't just trying their best to help your son have a full experience.

The toilet:
There won't have been any. Once trip I went on we were out on the peaks from 10am to 4.30pm. Every child (and most of the adults) had to find a bush at some point. It was an all day hike with some climbing/abseiling and weasling thrown in. Absolutely nowhere to go to the toilet but lots and lots of great outdoors. It can't always be helped but it should have been clearly explained to your DS and he should have been shown somewhere private if he needed help. Maybe he was too worried to ask?

Tablets:
We can't conceal them. But you should have been told that when you asked.

As for med you have go by the rules . If what to go against them then you have go with your child. And pay ....

No!

If a child needs meds in a way that do not fit with the usual processes, that school needs to discuss this with the parents and possibly the school nurse and ensure a plan is written that meets the needs of the student and the school. This may required additional training for school staff so it needs to happen well in advance of the trip.

No parent should have to pay to join a school trip just to give their child medication. That is discriminatory.

Staceybowersrocks, What sort of teacher are you? One heading up shit creek with that attitude hopefully.
It is illegal to exclude a child from an activity in a state school on the grounds of their disability in this country. What he needed was very little, and he had a supportive parent who gave good advice. The school failed him.

YANBU.
My daughter went on one of these a few years ago and whilst she enjoyed it she struggled as very few allowances were made for her.
She had very severe scoliosis plus a heart condition and limited lung function but was getting shouted at as she wasn’t able to keep up with the group!

That's awful sexnot

It is tansyviolet, she does her best not to let her disabilities hold her back and tries to keep up but with lung function measured at around 30% and a leaky pulmonary valve she is limited in what she can physically do.

"Tablets:
We can't conceal them."

The op's child knew they were in there so it wasn't covert medication.
My child has medication in food provided by me whenever he stays overnight at school or on trips as does probably every other child in his class so it can legally be given although I understand some teachers may not want to do this. Paediatricians will not usually supply the liquid alternative because it is 20x the price.