To put dd's names down for Scouts - DH thinks they are a "psuedo militaristic organisation that pledges allegiance to the monarchy and reinforces class divisions."

[morningpaper]

Well I thought that the Brownies and Scouts were okay but DH has objected that I have put their names down because they are "psuedo militaristic organisations that pledges allegiance to the monarchy and reinforces class divisions."

I told him they are probably full of working class Muslim eco-warrier children but he says no.

AIBU?

never thought i would say this but scouts cubs beavers are great. was a bit concerned about the religion aspect but such a small aspect you shouldnt let it worry you. Dh is scout leader and one ds scout and another beaver(wish they hadnt picked such an unfortunate name for the 6 to 8 yr olds organisation though!) It teaches self reliance and independance and an interest in sport and outdoors and nature and all those things you wish your sons were doing instead of shooting an alien on the play station. Has even made me appreciate camping!

YABU

Lol at woodies "joint venture" with beavers

I too was amazed when I found out what they were called, luckily I don't have any sons so don't have to snigger inappropriately once a week

Beavers is open to boys and GIRLS.

After years of teasing my DH with "dib dib dib" (having been chucked out of Brownies which was boring) I have become a beaver leader, because I have seen what fun and opportunities my boys have had, such as abseiling, archery , camping, kayaking etc (and we could never afford PGL),but above all it has been a way for my aspergers son to have fun with other children in a way that he is otherwise incapable off. I have suggested Cubs to other mothers of aspie children and they have had the same experience. BP set up Scouting in the hope that frienship among the youth of the world would lead to world peace, Hitler banned the Scouts, they played a large role in the resistance movement and in africa help with anti aids and malaria and immunisation programmes, in some countries there are even troops for streetchildren, I bet they have achieved a lot more than a load of kids drawing peace posters every week1

pmsl at op!!! And here i thought their evil aim was to fill our collective houses with crap crafts!!

Now I know I am slightly late to join this discussion but have only logged on after the weekend to find it in my newletter email from mumsnet and as I am a new breed of young and trendy brown owl I thought I'd get my tuppence in there quickly.
When I moved to my new house with dd and dp I thought it would be nice for dd to join brownies as before I had worked full time and hadn't the time to pick her up from after school club and cart her straight off to brownies/rainbows. I knew as it is a middle class stronghold in my new area that the waiting list for brownies would be fairly lengthly so I said I would volunteer as a regular helper knowing this would fast track her into the unit. I was pounced on by the district and asked if I'd like to re-open a unit that had to close last year as the old brown owl had left. OK...I said.
I now run a unit of 25 girls and yes, we did have to promise to love OUR god and serve the queen and country as part of the brownie guide promise and I have to say I thought long and hard before commiting to make my promise as I am not a christian and have very little allegiance to the queen although I do love my country (in an "it's a beautiful place with lots of greenery and I wouldn't rather live anywhere else" kind of way rather that "woohoo - stick to those foreigners - go british troups" kind of way, which I abhor). In the end though, I decided that MY god could be the fridge if I so wanted it to be and that I could swallow saying I'd serve the queen, after all she is just another person and if she required something personally from me I'd more than likely be obliged to help her in any way I could. I took my promise and now run a great pack. I am unorganised and unconventional and we don't necessarily work strictly to achieve the housework badge but the girls have so much fun and the parents love my non miltary style of running the place. We don't check finger nails or require shiny shoes, we pow wow about topics I find relevant which are green issues and family issues and I enjoy it so much more than I ever thought I would.
Having said that - had I known about the Woodland Folk I would have signed up for them as I subscribe far more to their way of thinking than the brownies motos. However, I also feel that if people want their kids to join these organisations, better there's someone like me who is quietly rebelling against the stuffiness of it all and letting their children have fun with other kids of their age than someone who is requring a roll call and a salute at the beginning of each meeting.

I was a Brownie for a short time but always found the standing in a circle reciting allegience to the Queen & C of E quite disturbing, especially as a Catholic.

Not sure what it's like now but think I'd avoid it with my children & involve them in sports instead.

This is a rather old thread but hell, since it's been revived...

There were plans to use scouts as messengers, had Britain been occupied during WWII. They would have formed part of the resistance.

I tried to find a story about this online, but found this instead, which is almost as thrilling, talking about how Girl Guides were emplyed by MI5 during WWI - Boy Scouts were too feckless apparently.

Very old thread, but thanks to the people that linked the Woodcraft folk and St John Ambulance. Have phoned up to see about my DS1 joining both.

IME - Scouts drink more but Woodcraft Folk had more acid.

This is indeed an old thread, but I always like to chatter about guides/brownies/scouts and woodcraft folk

Oh, since it has been revised I'll tell you what a fantastic Huck Finn time scouts gives my Ds. They built rafts the other day, the hottest day of the year, and pootled about on our local river. They go hiking, camping, they tie knots and build fires. It is wonderful.

The mumbling at the flag is a piece of daftery whose only effect imo is to keep the irrelevant union jack from being exclusively the property of vile nationalists.

revised revived

I meant, since the thread has been revived.

My DS1 has found more encouragement, fun and acceptance at Cubs than he has, a lot of the time, at school.

Ds goes to scouts, loves it, camping, hiking, 'space camp', and not a military thing in site, apart from the degree of military organisation that it takes to entertain 20 kids for 2 hours; or the degree of preparation that is needed to take them away for a weekend.

Fab organisation.

Exactly - scary - the DCs know where they are and are incredibly well-behaved and respectful of each other. It engenders co-operation, not competition

Yeah yeah, you can do all that in scouts and guides, and I did. But you can do it all in woodcraft folk without any flag stuff or issues for atheists or hints of militarism, and not a "housework" badge in sight.

No contest really, in my opinion, even though I got lots out of the brownies/guides/scouts in my younger days.

No issues for atheists her - I'm the atheist, not my sons. I'm educating them to make their own minds up

her - not her

FECK - here - not her

"It engenders co-operation, not competition"
Fantastic post jamie- and v very true.

My children are making their own minds up too but I think it's better for them to do so without a framework which insists they say they adhere a particular view at a young age.

Also I run a woodcraft folk group but couldn't run scouts or brownies, so it's relevant in that way. As Niks pointed out, the promise causes problems for a lot of people who would otherwise be happy running scout/guide groups.