To make DS2 go to the same high school as his elder sibling?

[Theromanempire]

It is a couple of years off yet but DS2 (year 4) is upset because he will have to go to a high school he doesn't want to go to. The only reason is because his close friends are all going to a different one. I get that and I do feel awful because he does struggle to make friends.

However, the high school he wants to go to is totally impractical as it is 20 minutes in the opposite direction of where I need to be to get on the motorway to get to work so would add 40 minutes on to my journey if I was to take him and we couldn't pick him up. We can't really justify additional bus fares either.

The high school DS1 goes to is within walking distance/on my way to work so totally practical. There isn't much in between the quality of the 2 schools (both aren't great but the quality of schools in the town isn't great anyway). We didn't even consider the school he wants to go to for DS1 because of the impracticality of it plus it is in a really rough part of town.

Plus for purely selfish reasons I want them to be at the same school so they have the same holidays etc.

I am fed up of having the same conversation with DS2 about it and he triggers my guilt every time as I know he will struggle to settle without his close friends. But then again, how many children remain in the same friendship groups anyway??

AIBU?

You don’t want him to go because it’s in the deprived part of town. Bit rich considering you are pleading bus fare poverty.

Children should have a fair say in what secondary school they go to. I find it bizarre that some parents totally control that decision.

Not sure what is bizarre about 'being the parent' TheHungryDonkey.
With all my 3, we looked round the options, and we talked with them about what they liked / didn't like about certain schools, but, at the end of the day, we are the adults, and find it a bit easier to look beyond the fact one secondary school were cooking biscuits and giving them out for the children to taste, and another gave them a pair of safety goggles to wear and allowed them near fire.
At 10 yrs old, the vast majority of dc do not have the maturity to make what could be such a crucial decision.

I totally disagree. I think 10 year olds are perfectly capable of looking at a school and deciding it’s not for them. Equally, they are able to look at what schools offer and see if what it offers fits their interests, if the vibe feels right, if they offer the subjects and extra curricular activities that fit their strengths and interests and if they can see themselves settling socially.

They are spending up to seven years at the school. Their choice and input into the decision making process is vital.

We’ve just been through the process. My son chose the school he wanted after we looked at the options available and got the one he wanted. I think he chose well and will support him with that. That’s my job as a parent.

I think shutting down any talk of it is really unfair. Yes, make him aware of the potential issues, but if he's actively pushing and bringing it up often then you need to listen to him.

I think we are in catchment for both so I don't think getting in either would be an issue. DS2's friends will, in any case, get in because they will have siblings there.

Surely that's the first thing you check out? I mean, if for the past 10 years no-one in your part of town has got in the it ends the conversation right away.

Also, go and look at the school. My DS now goes to the primary school that a lot of people in our town would call the 'rough' bit. That school has had a LOT of money thrown at it over the past couple of years and is actually a better school overall than the 'good' school locally (which has seemingly decent results but major problems in pastoral and other areas). Plus if it's part of the same academy chain you might be surprised how similar they are.

I think the comment re being in a deprived area and you claiming the bus fare isn't feasible don't marry up,p whatsoever.

He is old enough to choose, he's the one who has to go there every day for his high school years. If there is no difference in results as you say then it's only fair to allow him to choose where he thinks he will be most happy.

You've got plenty of time to work out the bus fare element, I'd do anything extra to be able to afford it as the children come first over handbags and expensive make clothes.

What you need to do is to big up DS1’s school over the next 18 mths to make it a more attractive option. You’re the adult/parent. He’s 8/9 yrs old and I would not let my DC make such an important decision and would definitely try to influence their mindset. My YR6 DD is joining her older sibling at a school none of her friends are going to and is happy about it. A sustained period extolling the virtues of said school would help.Try it.

Plenty of children don't get a choice about where to go to school and just have to go to "the school in walking distance" or "the school that has a free bus from near their house".

Whilst I don't think 10 year olds should necessarily have the final choice, I think the child's reasons have to be taken into consideration. Wanting to go to school for some frivoulous reason such as the biscuits on open day or even the nice new building is a good reason to vetoe but wanting to go there with friends is a good reason to listen.

"Wanting to go to school for some frivoulous reason such as the biscuits on open day or even the nice new building is a good reason to vetoe but wanting to go there with friends is a good reason to listen."

This. With several years to run, anything may happen to change the situation. But if the schools are getting equally good results and this is a kid who struggles to make friends, I would really consider going for the different high school, honestly.

If he still wants this high school when the time comes to make the decision, can you not think of some creative ways to generate some money for the bus fare? Like, discuss the idea of cutting back on something (like an extra curricular), signing him up for a paper round etc. when he gets old enough, or talking to relatives and seeing if they would help out a little bit?

If you are more of gab 3 miles away do you not qualify for free school transport?

• more than

I don't think letting this boy choose a secondary school in the expectation that the friends he has now will continue to be his friends in Y7 and beyond is a good idea. As pp have said, they might not be in the same form, friendship groups will change as they meet other people and develop new interests.

He might go to this school with his friends and find it doesn't meet his expectations at all because his group disperses quite naturally.

It's not fair to the friends to expect them to stick with their primary school friendship group throughout secondary because that's what one child wants.

Better surely to begin to encourage him to think about opportunities take up new interests and meet new people.

Have you actually visited the school?
Would it suit your DS better than your other DS's school - they sound very different children.

At least you admit you are being selfish .... yes sod DS2 feelings. Not giving the bus money for the school he actually wants can go to his therapy pot instead?!

I can't believe how many posters would let their dc make this decision, purely on the basis of primary school friendships. By the Christmas of y7 I no longer hung around with any of my very close group of friends from primary school. As a pp said, if the child's reasoning was based on a particular specialism at a school then yes, I would consider it - but there is no way I would put up with the inconvenience and hassle of having children in different schools just so he could be with his mates.

I don't understand why he thinks the other school is even an option, it makes no sense for him to go there and it totally impractical. He could go there and have massive issues anyway or go to the same school as his brother and be fine, neither is a given so stick with the most sensible choice op.

I don't think letting this boy choose a secondary school in the expectation that the friends he has now will continue to be his friends in Y7 and beyond is a good idea. As pp have said, they might not be in the same form, friendship groups will change as they meet other people and develop new interests.

Many secondary schools keep children together if they are friends. Many of those who are friends in Y7 and primary school remain friends.

I think that some posters are very dismissive of children's friendships. Just because you personally didn't stay friends with people from primary school doesn't mean others will. Many children continue with their friendships. If someone is in a good friendship group and is happy why would you not help them to keep their friends, particularly if that person is shy and not good at making friends. I just don't get why anyone would be so dismissive of a child's feelings for the sake of saving a few pounds (unless on the breadline obviously).

I don't think a 10 year old is mature enough to decide on High School. Neither of ours went to their first choice school because we felt another was better for them and the eldest has confirmed that decision.

You say both schools are similar in quality. In that case I think family convenience is important - especially as you work and money is tight.

Most children make new friends and do not hang out with primary school friends for long.

Most children make new friends and do not hang out with primary school friends for long.

My experience is totally different. The comprehensive school by us keeps children who are friends at primary school together in year 7 and they tend to stay friends. Having moved around a lot as a child and finding it quite hard to make new friends because I was shy I don't get why anyone would not take this into account when considering secondary school.

My ds best primary friends went to different secondary. Their friendships seem more special now when they see each other. [Year 8].
As for the primary friends he went up with to current school- they seem to want to be 'cool' which interests by ds not a jot. In year 7 few issues because of this but [touch wood] by year 8 he has made a new set of friends who are not aiming to be 'cool'.
Friendships are fluid in year 7 I think.
Walking to school a huge plus....

Many of those who are friends in Y7 and primary school remain friends.

But many may not, or may widen their circle to include other friends, so they spend less time with the first group.

If he goes to the school he wants to go to and all his friends stay together in one group, all well and good. But what if they don't? I think it's something he needs to be encouraged to think about, as part of the decision making process, along with thinking about what sounds like quite a difficult journey, which would make attending after school clubs difficult.

Thank you for all the comments (and the harsh but probably fair comments about me causing unnecessary distress to DS2) - seems quite split on this.

I don't know about free bus passes - everyone I know who has DC that catch school buses pay for it so I assumed that was standard.

I do like the fact that DS1 walks to school and back as it gives him good exercise (which he definitely needs considering he has discovered the freedom of the sweet shop and bacon butties at morning break ) plus knowing my DC as I do, I actually think that the security of his big brother being at school might just trump being with his friends when push comes to shove (I think another poster has said exactly the same thing happened with her DC).

My limited experience of primary school friendships moving into high school is that they do seem to break up a bit but DS1 is a total social butterfly who continually flits from friendship group to friendship group and could literally make friends with a wall so I don't think I can consider him to be the norm in that respect.

And just to reiterate, there will be boys from his school going to the school I want him to go to - these are boys that he has been in classes up to year 2 with and plays with at playtime and after school club - so he wouldn't be totally isolated from people he knows. He has one friend who he has spent quite a bit of time with over the years (due to the older siblings friendship, his mum being a good friend of mine, they play football together, DS2 goes there after school once a week rather than after school club) who will be going to my preferred school - unfortunately due to the class split, he does not spend much time with him at school now so doesn't consider him to be one of his main friends.

I am going to keep an open mind then and see what happens in 2 years time can always hope that one of his friend's older siblings hate the school and move to my preferred school

That is a good point about after school clubs. DS1 can choose to stay on at school at short notice any day he wants whereas DS2 would not be able to do that as from what I can see, there is one bus and after that, he would be reliant on normal buses or one of us picking him up.

Could he cycle?