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Original poster

What kind of person jumps off a cliff with two children? **MNHQ warning: upsetting content**

553 replies

Leafyhouse · 06/03/2018 17:08

I've been really shaken by that story about the woman stabbed at home, and the father found at the bottom of the cliff with 2 dead children, 10 and 7.

Their home is about 400 yards away from me. I also have 2 DS's, aged 8 and 10. It's just made me sick to the core. Police and forensic officers all over this lovely house, in a really nice area - and for what? Why would someone do that? Have your own problems, but why take the children?

Just reeling at the moment, am going to hug my kids extra tight tonight. This one's just so very close to home.

OP posts:
AvonCallingBarksdale · 07/03/2018 07:59

Perhaps we should look at numerous cases of DV as case specific too. Perhaps there is a good reason there. Or sexual assault cases, maybe they might be case specific too. I think that’s called being an apologist. (Shakes head in disbelief at how far we still have to go Sad )

OddS0ck · 07/03/2018 08:02

There are some very depressing and shocking posts on this thread, claiming a man must have had good reason to murder his wife and children, he was desperate , it was better to take the children.

It does give a window into the kind of thinking that contributes to a culture that finds excuses for murdering, abusive arse holes. Shocking.

I have recently divorced a violently abusive man. I'm constantly looking over my shoulder, my house is like Fort Knox though I have no doubt that if he decides to attack/kill me, he will.

For years I was fed the crap other posters have spouted on here. Mental health issues predominantly because no-one in their right mind would behave as he did. If only I could behave in a way that kept him happy.

This was all utter shit. Distance and time has given me the perspective to see all his abusive, violent controlling behaviours were planned and deliberate to keep me in my place. A hand maid eventually too afraid to even leave a room without first assessing the risk.

There was no loss of control on his part, he was no sensitive, damaged man who needed to be catered to. Rather an entitled abuser who would do whatever it took to get what he wanted.

We need real change. Male violence against women and children shouldn't be excused but this thread shows it is by so many.

BelindasRedPlasticHandcuffs · 07/03/2018 08:04

@AvonCallingBarksdale @Helmetbymidnight

Agreed. The combination of naivety and wilful ignorance into these patterns of behaviour and the realities of DV that is displayed when cases like this are on the news never fails to shock and sadden me.

How in the hell can we hope for things to change when people still try to excuse the worst people in our society.

Helmetbymidnight · 07/03/2018 08:05

Flowers well said, oddsock

I'm sorry to hear what you've gone through.

Frankiestidor · 07/03/2018 08:05

What is going on that people would read this and instantly think "poor man"?

Jesus.

Slartybartfast · 07/03/2018 08:06

poor children Sad

BelindasRedPlasticHandcuffs · 07/03/2018 08:08

@OddS0ck I x-posted with you there, but I also absolutely agree with you. I'm glad you were able to get away from him and I'm sorry you were subjected to the abuse from him and disbelief from others.

OddS0ck · 07/03/2018 08:10

Frankiestidor Yes what?? What the fucking fuck is wrong with people?

Helmetbymidnight thank you.

OddS0ck · 07/03/2018 08:12

Belinda -cross-posted again! Thank you.

Ereshkigal · 07/03/2018 08:22

I agree - but too often we are only seeing him as the whole person, here. And too often that "seeing the whole person" plays out as sympathy, stories about how nice the guy was, how "tragic" it all is, without ever really focusing on the fact that he murdered people.

Agree totally. This is often how the media coverage reports the story.

What was the case where it was all treated as a tragedy almost in the vein of a natural disaster, nobody to blame, and the murderer was buried with the woman and kids he'd murdered as though he hadn't put them there in the grave himself?

The murder of Clodagh Hawe and her children.

AvonCallingBarksdale · 07/03/2018 08:35

OddS0ck sorry to hear what you have been through and sorry that others, on MN threads and IRL, still feel the need to find a reason or mitigating circumstance for abusers’ behaviour Flowers

Slartybartfast · 07/03/2018 08:39

@BelindasRedPlasticHandcuffs
no i have not read the numerous threads on here detailing how women kill as opposed to men.
nor would I want to but thanks for the enlightenment. Interesting.

OddS0ck · 07/03/2018 08:40

Thank you Avon.

So fucked up is our culture's way of looking at violence against women that I am wary who I tell.

Because victim blaming, perp excusing, why didn't I just walk away, must have been something I'd done....

My bookshelves are packed with self-help books. Because if I was just a better person this wouldn't be happening.

This isn't all about me, but the instant sympathy for a child killing, murdering bastard - yes, I'm familiar with that kind of thinking. Keeps women and children in their box.

GnotherGnu · 07/03/2018 08:48

There are plenty of people with mental illness who seem to get through the day without murdering their wife and children

Ridiculous generalisation. You might as well say there are plenty of people with physical illness who seem to get through the day without coming out in a rash. Or that there are plenty of people with mental illness who seem to get through the day without obsessing over whether they've gone through specific rituals. Everyone's different.

bittern79 · 07/03/2018 08:51

Poor man????? WTAF????

He could have killed himself. Sad. But his family get to mourn him and carry on living.

But to kill his wife then take the dc to the cliff - bastard. They must have been terrified.

I have no idea of the background here but it appears that men who kill their families have a history of dv.

Why do men do this???

bittern79 · 07/03/2018 08:52

Flowers oddsock. I'm glad you got away.

AvonCallingBarksdale · 07/03/2018 08:56

International Women’s Day tomorrow. I will be thinking about the long road we have ahead in terms of garnering awareness, understanding and support for all women. Thoughts are with the woman and children from the news story that started this thread and the many others. Flowers

AnimalDaze · 07/03/2018 08:56

There are a lot of women that are too afraid to leave their children alone with an abusive man for any amount of time,so they never leave said man. As long as they're there they can mitigate,act as a buffer, keep the kids out of his way etc. There's more than one way of "staying for the kids".

Yes the laws regarding contact with abusive fathers really need an overhaul. This rhetoric that a child maintaining contact is in their best interests even where abuse is present is ridiculous and leads to women staying in abusive relationships. Any man who abuses his children or their mother should lose PR and be banned from ever being near them again imo.

I'm not even going to respond to the poor man comments or I'll get myself banned. I'll save my sympathy for the poor woman's relatives and friends, the children's friends and teachers. These murders will affect an entire community. The youngest child was 7, I cannot imagine having to tell my young children their friend was killed by their father.

IllustriouslyIllogical · 07/03/2018 08:57

These sick fucks like to make a bit of a headline when they go, it's as much about ego as it is mental illness.

He could have just left his family alone & jumped off by himself - but no, he had to be as destructive as possible.

ToffeeUp · 07/03/2018 08:59

He is a bastard who murdered his wife and 2 children.

Ereshkigal · 07/03/2018 08:59

He could have just left his family alone & jumped off by himself - but no, he had to be as destructive as possible.

Yes I agree. It's pathologically controlling behaviour.

bittern79 · 07/03/2018 09:00

If this man had gone on a killing spree involving victims who weren't his wife and kids nobody would be saying poor man, or we musn't rush to judge

This ^^

Violent men believe their wife and dc belong to them and they can do what they like with them.

IllustriouslyIllogical · 07/03/2018 09:01

I wouldnt immediately conclude simplistically that those who kill their children are evil, something has driven them to extremes

What about those who kill other people's children?

Stop making excuses for these bastards. It's people like you that facilitate it - they see people like you making excuses for them & it helps them justify it in their own minds.

Aridane · 07/03/2018 09:11

Nasty double standard. Sick women have done this yet I don't see the same reaction.

Perhaps sympathy for what mental illness can drive you to unless proven otherwise?

I’m inclined to ag

BakedBeans47 · 07/03/2018 09:13

Of course it is ‘case specific’ - but if it walks like a duck and quacks like a duck then guess what?!

I’ll eat my hat if this doesn’t turn out to be the same as every other case of men destroying their families we’ve heard about in the news over the years. An abusive entitled controlling arsehole finally tipping over the edge . Not ‘becoming evil overnight’ but the culmination of years of abuse and terror.

Some of the excuses on this thread for this brute and his violence are thoroughly appalling.