To ask WOHM mums about your working hours?

[GinnyLovesGin]

Yeah. Specifically mums.

I’m about to go back to work after my second stint of maternity leave. DD2 will be 9 months old and joining DD1 (aged 3) in a private nursery. I work 3 days per week in a really stressful job. I say three days but before I went on mat leave, I was working at the kitchen table every night after DD1 went to bed, attending seminars etc in the evenings etc. Basically I had a full time workload and three days in the office. I’m a solicitor in a huge firm. It is competitive as fuck.

I like my job but it is the kind of job where, to get anywhere with it, I need to study it, work late nights (client work as well as CPD/business development) and basically eat, sleep and breathe it. It isnt massively compatible with family life (if only someone had told me that five years ago). No flexible working etc.

I don’t feel great about having to work at all (I don’t think I’m SAHM material but in turn I feel bad about that), but we need both our salaries. We could exist on DHs salary but we wouldn’t have any disposable income and I want to be able to give the girls things like a nice house in a good area (where we are now, good schools etc) experiences, holidays etc. Equally, i don’t want to work and be considered mediocre or shit at my job (but my girls will always come first and I won’t make any apologies for that). So I feel like if I’m going to work then I need to try hard and do as well as I can. I want to succeed. And in turn I feel guilty about this.

My husbands work is a little more family friendly and he is usually home around six so if I need to do late nights etc then he’s there and he can (and does) do the nursery pick up, get dinner/bath/bed sorted as well as I can. We don’t have much other support so we are lucky in that respect.

I guess what I’m asking, very inarticulately, is how bad should I feel about this? I feel horrible crippling guilt. Like I know they have DH but I’m their mum and I should be there.

I’m just looking for thoughts and experiences I guess. I don’t know how to balance it.

i really suggest you think about going in house. I work for a large insurer and our legal team are mostly out the door at 5pm. Salary is not going to be as competitive as commercial law but swings and round abouts.

A friend of mind went for senior associate at a relatively large niche law firm to a general counsel at a medium size Lloyds syndicate as loves it and enjoys an actual life outside of work.

I think the fact you are compacting full time hours into 3 days - for your girls - is extremely commendable and nothing to feel guilty about. You should feel proud of what you do, whether or not you are doing super duper amazing at your job.

I work three days and its not stressful, but that's mainly because i am happy to stay in the role that I am in and not be promoted or take on anything extra.

"Equally, i don’t want to work and be considered mediocre or shit at my job"

Could being considered mediocre at your job be a compromise in the meantime? Then when your girls are at school you could step it up a gear?

Laurie I know you’re right, I’m not really sure why I brought up the point now. Maybe I’m trying to incite some kind of socio-economic revolution! I guess each person has to figure out where their priorities lie and try to fit themselves in somewhere they can get the work-life balance that suits. If only it were that easy!

Equally, i don’t want to work and be considered mediocre or shit at my job

See, this can often be part of the problem. Being mediocre in your job for a while (and getting comfortable with that) might be a good thing if it takes the pressure off family life and you as an individual.

In my experience, the biggest perfectionists are often the ones who find it hardest to juggle and end up giving up work entirely.

It's often not possible to be the perfect employee and still have sufficient time and energy to give to your family. Coming to terms with that is a good first step.

I know you’re right, I’m not really sure why I brought up the point now. Maybe I’m trying to incite some kind of socio-economic revolution! I guess each person has to figure out where their priorities lie and try to fit themselves in somewhere they can get the work-life balance that suits. If only it were that easy!

I'm totally with you. It's just that its very difficult for individuals to overthrow workplace expectations and culture like that. We would need to act as one in a way that is difficult to pull off.

What tends to happen is that people buy into when they're young and single and want to get up that ladder, so they play the game. Then they have kids and realise that corporate success is far from what it's cracked up to be and they just don't have the time/energy to do both to the standard they want to or are expected to.

But by that stage they're a bit stuck and have to hope there's a way to take pressure off by reducing hours/going in house/coasting a bit.

The best strategy I've seen is to develop some very specialist/niche knowledge (that's sought after) so that you have a card to play that's not just time. Easier said than done though.

Don't feel guilty! It sounds like your working hours/days make sense to you as a family, financially, fit in with your DH's hours etc. The children have 4 days a week with you and will be absolutely fine.

When my DS was 9 months I went back to work 4 days a week for 3 years then changed to 3 days a week in the office plus a few bits from home, when he started school. For me personally, 3 days a week from the beginning would have been my ideal - enough time at work to feel like you're achieving something (plus get the financial benefit of over half your full time salary) and enough time at home to feel you get time with DC as they get over half the week with you.

DH and I both work 30hrs outside the home. He does that over 3 days and I over 4. I also have a horrific commute which I put up with as the pay is £20k higher an hour away compared to close by (go figure).

I have very little mum guilt as I think it's important to share the load. There are only two days a week where we're both working out of the home, which hugely limits the stress of it all. I'm about to have DC2 and will be asking to reduce my hours on those days otherwise I can't actually pick the kids up from wraparound care...hopefully boss will say yes!

I'm very senior (health) but only quite recently qualified. Have taken the conscious decision to coast once I get back from mat leave (or maintain a mediocre level of delivery!) as I know I need to concentrate on the balance being in favour of family in the early years. I've another 30+ years to shine 😱 So have figured I can take the hit.

Let go of the guilt, we're all just doing the best we can!

This is what pisses me off about the whole woh part-time - instead of three days worth of work you’re really cramming ft work into pt work, you’re still stressed and doing the same amount of work and your boss is getting a massive bargain as a result. We’re sold the line of ‘having it all’ but really we’re just doing it all and surprise surprise who gets to profit from our efforts

Sorry for the rant, I don’t have any advice sadly (I was pt then made redundant whilst on mat leave, then wahm, and currently sahm)

I am a solicitor who took a step back when the kids were little

I'm a solicitor and work in a mid sized regional on 3 days a week, I started this role on 3 days a week, it wasn't a step down from full time in an existing role. I've actually found a lot of firms are quite open to part time so if you did want to consider a move to a smaller firm I wouldn't give up on part time hours. There are roles out there!

Or how about the GLS?

I was a solicitor and gave it up to be a SAHM. I wouldn’t say I regret it, but I do sometimes wonder whether I could have tried harder to work a balance of work and children. My girls are 6 and almost 8 and I work as a TA at their school. It is not a bad job but I do miss my old job.

Sorry posted too soon
I make no apologies for what I chose to do and totally believe everyone should do what is best for them and their family
BUT from what I see it is very difficult at the top level to be successful unless you are prepared to give it your absolute all And that goes for men and women
And those pp who are saying it gets easier as the kids get older I am really not sure if that is true
Pre school they can go to nursery full time and they don't really know any difference
Once they are at school it's a whole different ball game Inset days,holidays and they know you are not at the gate

I'm full time (senior professional role). WOH 4 dpw. WFH 1 day. I have a long commute and am out of the house 5.30am-6pm most days.

One of the ways I cope is I am SUPER strict about my hours. I work an "early shift" and always clock off on time, do very little out of hours.

DCs are 2 and just about 4.

DP works at home, which means he does all the pick up/drop off.

I think PT working is harder in some ways, especially in some professional jobs because things happen on your off days and work spills over. I'm lucky enough to have a supportive work place and am senior enough that no-one judges me when I walk out at 4 (I suppose they might, but if they do, I give zero fucks).

The first year after DC2 was SO HARD though. Mentally getting used to the workplace after 4 years of one-year-on one-year-off. Building up routine and relationships again took a LOT of mental effort, all whilst sleep-deprived. Add in a soupcon of maternal-guilt and it's really tough.

The other way I got through was giving up any cooking, hobby and only the barest minimum of socialising for that 12 months. It was wearing but I just didn't have the energy.

I do think (1 year after my return) it's easier now. I've established boundaries and routine at work and at home, the DCs are a little bit more independent (especially the older one). They sleep a bit better.

But where you are now is the uphill-bit, both on the work and the home-front.
Please don't feel guilty. - you obviously care, and that's the best thing for your DCs - so no guilt required!

I worked 3 days a week at first locally when my child was a baby and toddler, then 3days in a job 1h15min commute each way when she was in pre school and Reception. Now in y1, I've actually upped my hours to 4 days split over 5 so I could pick her up after school each day and also be available each day for my clients. In reality I work nearly full time but flexible time and from home some days. Commute varies between 1hr each way to 1h30 but I also occasionally travel. Yesterday was a 15hr day, today 7hrs plus commuting, tomorrow I'll work from home for about only about 2hrs. So it's very stressful, but I can pick up my child (although less than planned!) and volunteer at school etc.

It only works because my DH is self employed so can be flexible with his time too fit around me and we share child care 50/50 so he does drop offs most days and picks up when I can't. There are weeks though where we are like passing ships in the night!!! I don't feel guilt so much as feeling like I run from one 'part' of my life to the other constantly and have to mentally compartmentalize in order to cope.

It isn’t “mum” guilt I feel but I do feel like
I’m constantly ‘doing’ and not off the hamster wheel.

I work 4 days and cram a 5 day week senior role into that.

I’m much better at saying no / is it priority / I can do this but it won’t be until X day, which 99.9% of the time, when said assertively and confidently, it does the trick to push back things.

But, I’m not a lawyer, although with legal dealings and appreciate the need to keep your head above water.

What I will say is that I did 3 days and felt more stressed and guilty than 4 days. I think because 2 days out of the office seems like you can’t be on top of things at work, and then the 2 days at home are not quality time as you’re still checking email / keeping in touch / mind working etc. And being 3 days, you’re seen as a “part timer” (which is awful but does have a perception) whereas 4 days, seems to not have the same negative perception.

As soon as I went up to 4 days, the pressure seemed to ease both at home and at work. I hired in help (cleaner, ironing etc) so that my time off wasn’t doing that stuff and focussed on quality time with DC.

I love the quote “we are supposed to work as though we don’t have children and parent as though we don’t have a job” 🙄

Hope you find a balance OP

I don't really have much to add but I'm currently on ML and agreed to go back part time and I know I'll still have w full workload.
Similar area of work and company, exact same issues.

I also work 3 days and have to cram a lot in plus have my work phone to hand on my days off etc. I do feel guilty and wanting to be able to do more things with my kids like ballet etc that I simply can't get them to, however I also want them to know that Mummy works and has a good job too and to see that as a positive. It is hard, you can't win and definitely agree with doing the 5 days in 3.

I'm going back to 34 hours over 5 days. I also have a substantial commute so i won't see DS in the mornins at all. I'm nervous about it tbh but i also don't want to get put on the mummy track at work and get written off.

Echo the in house route. 3 days a week, 8-4. Pressured when there but easily coverable in my absence, planned or otherwise. Decent money and good work/life balance. I could earn more elsewhere but the flexibility and perks mean more at the moment. 8 & 6 year old, both at school.

Hello! I am a lawyer in the civil service. I work 3 days but now that my DC is in school I stretch the hours so I can do pick up most days.
It’s incredibly family friendly and there is scope to progress - my boss and her boss are both women with children. I do not bring Home with me and I am able to leave work early to attend school events. It’s perfect. It’s not brilliantly paid (I took a big pay cut from a city firm to come here but it worked out as the same per hour!) but it’s not terrible. I really recommend it. I would not do a job where I’m paid for 3 days but have to squeeze in a full time job. It’s not ok. Another good friend who is a lawyer works 3 days a week as a PSL at a city law firm. She does 9-6 and has a nanny. It’s a great balance for her. Another friend works in legal research 5 days a week by mostly from home and around school hours. It’s possible to find good lawyer jobs (but rarely fee earning) that work with children.

Not a lawyer, but a medic. IME 24-30 hours contracted a week is doable if your OH is on board. Trying to do all the drop off / pick ups is impossible and a fast route to insanity IMO. I would try to have set days where you each get back in time for tea/bath/bed and then a couple of nights where there is no expectation for you to get back "in time" so you can work to 8 or 9 uninterupted on those days.
Do stick with it I went back FT when mine were yr3 (8) and yr 6 (11) and I am so glad I stuck with it through the tough years. 😀

I work in the public sector. I changed after 13 years in private sector when kids were school age. It is a lot more flexible with flexi time so I can start at ten and do school run every day. You can also buy extra holidays so I have bought 3 extra weeks this year to cover summer school hols. I work 4 days and a few other colleagues do 3 days or job share. We don't have any childcare support locally and my husbands job isn't flexible so I do majority of school run, school meetings , homework, after school clubs and dentist etc by using holiday days or working from home around the appointments. I think it is still hard to juggle when they are in school as you really need someone there at 3pm for pick up/after school stuff. My 2 are older now an can walk to their grandads on the 4 afternoons I don't collect them and that has made a difference. Have u had a look at any public sector opportunities? I know our place has an in house legal team. Xxx

My advice

• look at the costs of getting a nanny. May not be much more than nursery but a lot more flexibility.
• you have 4 days with them. This is super. No need to feel guilty
• you need to work out if you are overly overstretched by the standards of your department or not. Presumably you have target hours whether hard or soft targets. If you are working at say 130% and everyone else is the same then there probably isn’t much you can do about volume when in that role. But if you are notably above then you do have good reason to speak to your partners about how you need to put some boundaries around your work in order not to be disadvantaged as a part timer.

If you're a lawyer in house you generally need to have experience in commercial or corporate or employment. Public sector takes in childcare and planning. Very few public sector legal teams where I live and I haven't worked in commercial law for 3 years (was public sector) so don't think open to me any longer. I'm way too specialised I think which I'm stuck in the private sector full time slave to billing and clients gulag til I drop dead

I'm an independent management consultant/project manager. I work full time, leaving at 7am and getting back about 7.30pm.

DH is a SAHD. I don't feel guilty at all TBH (I'm only doing what all my male colleagues do).

I see them for bedtime and we have really quality weekend time. The rest of the time they have DH there.