PIL issues. Wanting to see GC separately

[Coffeeisnecessary]

Hi mumsnetters, I genuinely don't know if I'm being unreasonable about this particular problem so please help me! My MIL is a tricky person, diagnosed personality disorder along with a host of other issues, she is very negative and has been nasty about me for the whole 16 years I've known her behind my back, face to face she is pleasant enough. She adores my 2 DS and they her, however she treats my eldest DS as if he is the second coming, she has openly admitted she prefers him and sees her as 'hers' whereas my second DS she describes as 'theirs' meaning my family's. She only wants to see them separately but plans for my second DS always seem to fall through so she sees him far less. He notices this and has started pulling away from them. I hate it as it seems like such obvious favouritism. My FIL always used to seem so rational but he also agrees they only want to have them on their own as they can't cope with both. He thinks they need time apart from each other, which may be true. They go to the same school and we generally have them both together so it's possible they would benefit from time apart. My DS are 6 and 4 and get on well mostly. I'm conflicted as I know my own views of my MIL may be tainting my opinion but aibu to dislike them seeing them separately?

So interesting (and sad) to read of others experience of this. My dh has been through a lot with his mother. She is permanently criticising him and its exhausting, he has had counselling which has really helped him see how her behaviour has had an affect all his life. I suppose the reason we've never tackled it properly before is that we feel sorry for her, it must be such a sad way to live, she is bitter and has extreme anxiety about things. But I agree, when it's affecting your children you have to act.

The very fact that your husband has had to have counselling to cope with his mother...and you are inflicting this on your youngest child because you feel sorry for the old bitch?

If you don't make the necessary changes, OP, your children will grow up like your dh and possibly need counselling themselves. Just do it now. It's not that hard once you make a stand. Do it for them.

YANBU, I think they are being awful. I remember my DM telling me (before I had my DC) that my DNephew would always be 'the special one' because he was her first GC - she denies it now, but I remember her saying it. MIL always showed favouritism toward her other GC (BIL's child), and these days she only bothers with one of my DC as the other has learning difficulties and she appears to have forgotten he exists. Thankfully we hardly see her anymore.

Why do you feel sorry for her?. Neither she nor her enabler of a husband has ever given you one ounce of consideration here. And yes you do have to act and decisively as well. You likely come from an emotionally healthy family, your DH has clearly not been so fortunate. Neither of you can afford to pussyfoot around his mother when it comes to your children, your most precious resource.

Would you tolerate this from a friend?. No you would not and his mother is actually no different. Unfortunately you are making a huge error in applying "normal" rules of familial relations to someone like your H's mother who is herself dysfunctional. The rule book actually goes out the window when it comes to dealing with such families.

His mother was not a good parent to him and she has not fundamentally altered since his own childhood. She is a toxic influence and now a further generation is being harmed by her as well. She is a crap example of a grandparent to both your children because of her inherent favouritism, allowing this to at all carry on will harm their relationship beyond repair.

It must not be at all tolerated by either of you and I would stop all future visits by any of you.

Completely agree with you op - yes, it must be a sad existence, but your dc need to be protected.

And don’t underestimate the damage it can do to your eldest to see the youngest being treated so unfairly. I was in the position of your eldest, and my therapist has helped me to realise that this was one of the root causes of chronic depression and anxiety. I’m 35 and it still affects me.

Yes it must be very hard for your husband.

Having said that, someone said something on here a while back that stuck with me about situations like this: either you face it or your kids do.

It’s not going to be easy, but I think it has to be done. Protect your kids

Knowing the negative impact this dreadful woman has had on your DH, why on earth are you exposing your DC to this?

Because you feel sorry for her? Are you for real?

Is this NPD? Sounds horribly like the "golden child" v "scapegoat" child...she will play them off against each other for her own gain, and of course, she will never be wrong.

Tread carefully here OP. Any other unpleasant traits she has, other than her total disrespect for you?

So interesting (and sad) to read of others experience of this. My dh has been through a lot with his mother. She is permanently criticising him and its exhausting, he has had counselling which has really helped him see how her behaviour has had an affect all his life. I suppose the reason we've never tackled it properly before is that we feel sorry for her, it must be such a sad way to live, she is bitter and has extreme anxiety about things. But I agree, when it's affecting your children you have to act.

Ok I missed this.

I wouldn't let her near my DCs. Sorry.

In light of the unhappiness she has caused your DH growing up, I'm wondering why you let her have your own DC unsupervised?

Your DH's life has been made a misery by her and he has ended up in counselling. Now she is singling out DS1 for the same treatment and since she can't work on 2 young DC at the same time she is doing it to DC2 by proxy.

Personality disorder? Sounds more like she is a sociopath.

Your DH needs to man up and say he doesn't want his DC going there without supervision.

Many years ago a friend of my mums had this problem with her mother and the kids.

Was so bad the mum stopped all contact with her mother, for herself as well as the 2 dc. It badly affected the youngest.

And btw I’m NC with my mother, haven’t seen her in years. She was a very negative, controlling, nasty person who I only saw for the last five years of contact because of guilt and feeling sorry for a lonely, old woman with nobody else in her life.

I’ve never regretted my decision. She was starting to play mind games with dd and my brother pointed out that I needed to protect dd (as did half of MN). It took other people to point this out to me but I’m glad I listened.

I would be insisting they could only see them supervised by you and together. The first sign of favouritism or criticism of you will result in no contact. This will affect the brothers relationship growing up your MIL is trying to manipulate the sibling relationship for her own power hungry needs. She has obviously manipulated FIL. Tell the bitch to fuck off

If I were in your position they would have both of them together or not at all , or they can see them when you or your dp take them for a visit , they visit you . Frankly I’m baffled why you allow this woman unsupervised access at all .

My GM disliked my mother - made very clear to my sister and myself - and blatantly favoured me over my sister as I apparently took after my grandfathers family while my sister was more like my mothers.

It's damaging, and no, yanbu.

I encourage seeing the GP separately. They can concentrate on each child on their own and it gives them special time

But the GM isn't taking the second child! When it's his/her turn the GM finds an excuse to cancel. That's favouritism and is totally unacceptable.

OP, there is no way on hell the GM would be seeing the kids again at all, let alone separately.

She played these sick mind games with your DH and now you're both willing to sacrifice your own DC's wellbeing to this insanity? Why?

The separate thing isnt an issue it's being unfair. It's simple next time ds2 visit falls through then ds1 doesn't go until ds2 has had his visit.

You are all right. We've talked a lot since I posted this, it's been so helpful to clarify things. We've always known what to do I suppose but when emotions are involved it's hard. Reading other threads I've always thought people should cut people out of their lives but it's hard to do in reality when you are such people pleasers like me and my dh. Will be strong though as its the right thing for our children. Thank you all.

YANBU it's the favouritism that would upset me the most and is unacceptable. This could cause self esteem issues with DS2 as pp have said and is just plain nasty.

I completely understand your comment about what it's like in reality. However, At the moment it sounds like your MIL is in charge of both you and your DH and you can't say no to her. What would happen if you did for a reasonable issue? It sounds like you both defer to her wishes or if you don't do exactly as she says there is perhaps a vague notion that you are doing something wrong or perhaps an unspoken threat of her having a meltdown at you.
But what I think might be helpful is to ask yourself . What is the worst that could happen if you stood up to her and she did? What is the worst that could happen if you both took charge and decided what was best for you and for your children and told her that calmly in no uncertain times. I don't think you have to justify or argue with this notion. I think you just need to both say calmly and firmly "Actually we have decided to do this." You don't have to cut them out but you are allowed to order things on your own terms to protect your children. Your poor 4 year old will thank you for it if she is so nasty that your OH has had to have councilling for it. Sounds like a not very good parent, not a good track record as a grandparent. Just because she wants to call the shots, does not mean she should. You know your children best.
I also don't understand people not wanting to have two kids to look after at the same time. Its much less work. And less stressful for a young child to have a sibling there and not be the sole focus of attention. They entertain each over and are happier for it, especially on overnight stays when they are young. IMHO

I personally think seeing your DS' separately is strange and that that would obviously taint their opinion of you PIL especially if the younger DS does not seem to spend as much time with them as the older.
I have many problems with my MIL, she lives 20 mins from us but sees our DC maybe once every couple of months and would prefer to travel 2 1/2 hours to see her other 'perfect' grand children. I would attempt to have the conversation with your PIL and get your opinion across, it may fail but surely you'll feel better getting it off your chest. Good luck.

Glad you have seem that this can be so damaging, I would refuse all contact without you or OH present.
Setting up DS1 as the golden child is damaging on every level, his relationship with YOU , & his brother can be screwed completely.
DS2 can be damaged, it's all sort of wrong