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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

to be annoyed that so many on mn seem to begrudge pensioners?

334 replies

Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 10:14

for mainly being too rich
so many of you seem to think that those who have retired at 65 and are likely enough to have a good pension have somehow cheated

OP posts:
Queuejumper · 13/02/2018 11:00

I think most just begrudge those who don't recognise their good fortune. Because of the gold plated nature of many pensions, and the protections vested on the state pension at the moment the pensioners of today are not being paid for by their contributions but by the generation below. But these perks are unlikely to still be around when it is 'our turn'.

Tbh my dad retired at 54. He didn't have a hard time of it. My mum never really worked past having kids.

Ll81 · 13/02/2018 11:00

You want people to just carry on paying for other people to have things they will never receive and not even question inequality?Confused

Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:05

swings and roundabouts.
what should happen to 65 year olds?
be rich due to gold plated pensions or to being canny and saving money,
selling their family homes and downsizing
be poor and be a so called drain on society - taking up the space on the bus/in the cafe/in the hospital bed

they spend their money, they have saved their money

OP posts:
mummyretired · 13/02/2018 11:07

Here is a 1963 film about the good old days www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/p053r2q1/waiting-for-work

I am in my late 50s and far away from London. Some of my friends are still renting, some inherited houses, and some went without for years to pay off the mortgage on small properties. I cannot think of any of my contemporaries who raised a family on one wage. We had no tax credits and no free nursery places. For myself as for many, divorce has been an expensive choice but worthwhile.

My parents (80s now) had property due to inheritance, but spent years on a very low wage; surviving parent still barely reaches the tax threshold. She would not go far without a bus pass.

TheSconeOfStone · 13/02/2018 11:07

The retired people in my family haven’t been particularly sensible with money at all. Good pensions and/or inheritance.

UgandanKnuckles · 13/02/2018 11:09

@slartybartfast how is being the first generation every to be expected to have a lower standard of living than their parents "swings and roundabouts"?

BarbaraofSevillle · 13/02/2018 11:11

I don't see anything wrong with selling family homes and downsizing, but I see a house as a place to live not some family heirloom 'full of memories'.

Memories are nice, but it doesn't make any sense for single pensioners to rattle round large family houses that they can't afford to heat and maintain while younger families can't afford the housing that they need. And downsizers wouldn't be poor, in many cases, they'd be hugely wealthy.

Queuejumper · 13/02/2018 11:13

I love and respect my parents greatly, but they haven't worked massively hard nor saved a penny. The very comfortable life they live is due to property value increases and pensions as well as inheritance.

Ll81 · 13/02/2018 11:13

Why on earth is it so bad to use your own assets to pay for your own care? Confused I own my house and would happily downsize if I needed to.

We have people rasing families in tiny flats, this isn't good for society.

SinisterBumFacedCat · 13/02/2018 11:14

What saddens me is at some point older people have stopped wanting their childrens generation to have better live styles than they did. I hope my generation won't be the same business suspect it will just get worse.

Queuejumper · 13/02/2018 11:16

I never quite get why anyone seen trying to hold onto savings to buy a house or whatever and access benefits is castigated...but a pensioner hanging on to their house while the state pays for their care is different?

Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:16

why do you say that sinister?
plenty of pensioners would actively prefer to pass their money to their family but are unable to

OP posts:
Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:18

i dont disagree with selling your house to pay for your care but i bet most would prefer to pass money onto family and help their offspring.

OP posts:
juneau · 13/02/2018 11:21

I think it's because of the inequality between generations - and there IS inequality. However, many of the older generation didn't have much when they were younger. My parents and their friends all lived very modestly when we were kids. They could afford to buy a house, but they had modest cars, one SC holiday a year, home-cooked food, very few meals out, occasional visits to cinema, etc. Many of them have made a lot of money on the homes they bought for very little back in the 60s and 70s, but is that their fault? No, it's just how things have turned out.

I think younger people now have greater expectations. They want a high salary straight away. They want time off. They want to travel. They want to own the latest technology. And yes, they want to buy property, but many can't afford to do so without help. People who are pensioners now did not expect those things to come easily - they expected to start at the bottom and not earn much and to just keep working hard all their lives to be able to afford nice things - which yes, they can now afford. And yes, they've benefited greatly from inflation and rising prices and many of them don't need free bus passes and free TV licences, but is it their fault that they have these things? No.

StormTreader · 13/02/2018 11:23

"retiring at 65 people have no idea how long they will need to support themselves.
what the future holds.
how their health will hold out."

Lucky for the rest of us that we don't have to worry about any of that, then? Hmm

Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:23

well put jeneau

OP posts:
Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:24

I wonder if any of the pensioner begrudgers will change their minds?

OP posts:
SinisterBumFacedCat · 13/02/2018 11:26

Because I hear the word entitled so often when younger people talk about not being able to get on to the "property ladder" actually just buying or renting a small flat is unaffordable, so the ladder is now mythical to most. Apparently young people want everything immediately. This is untrue, they would like to be settled down with a home, a job and no debt before they are too old too have children. This is becoming impossible without help from parents.

Original poster
Slartybartfast · 13/02/2018 11:27

This is becoming impossible without help from parents.
are these parents pensioners?

OP posts:
Ifailed · 13/02/2018 11:32

But what can be done about it? Well, get organised for a start - join a union or a political party, or even form one. It's a bit ironic that on the centenary of some women in the UK getting a vote, after a long and sometimes bitter struggle, it has not occurred to people today that there could address their grievances in a similar way.
We all know most politicians are re-active, to the point of knee-jerkedness when it comes to a media driven campaign, so why not give them something to react to?

As a start, where are the plans to seriously address the housing issue, beyond sound-bites and the re-presentation of the same money over and over again? A possible silver-lining of Brexit is the UK would be free to award construction projects to UK companies and not have to go out to tender, thus creating a huge opportunity to properly train people in Trades to work in the required massive construction projects.

what is to be done about the looming care crisis? Pension crisis?

Like I said, sitting around moaning & blaming older generations won't get anything done, it just brushes the issues under the carpet, which is in the best interests of current politicians.

meredintofpandiculation · 13/02/2018 11:32

When people in this country are struggling and not receiving help then rich pensioners shouldn't be getting things like free bus passes. Maybe rich people should have to pay to use a public library? Maybe rich disabled people should pay to use a disabled parking space? There's no point in means testing unless it actually saves money (and the cost of means testing means sometimes it doesn't), and there's the argument that unless they get something tangible back from the state, they'll be less happy about contributing to it in taxes.

I think most just begrudge those who don't recognise their good fortune. ... which includes younger people not recognising their good fortune in living in a time when there is longer maternity leave, the right to go back to your job on return, the expectation that you won't be bullied by your boss, not to mention the material changes which have made life easier in many ways. Yes, many (not all) older people have benefited from house prices rises, but the picture is more nuanced than some would recognise.

a pensioner hanging on to their house while the state pays for their care is different? ... for me it's the unfairness - dementia is an illness, but because we don't know how to treat it, the sufferer has to pay all their costs. Whereas someone who acquires an illness that can be treated pays nothing, even though the illness kills them in the end.

Ll81 · 13/02/2018 11:33

Most young people I know are desperate to buy anything, I know several that bought shitty small flats and are now stuck in them as this ladder doesn't exist anymore.

Boomers just like to believe the world is exactly the same for the yoof today and any problems are their own fault nothing to do with the seismic shifts that are widely recognised.

SinisterBumFacedCat · 13/02/2018 11:34

This is becoming impossible without help from parents.
are these parents pensioners?

Obviously they are the ones with the money! Grin

SinisterBumFacedCat · 13/02/2018 11:38

mere I totally agree about dementia, it should be funded, as should other progressive degenerative diseases. 1 in 3 of us will get dementia.

BarbaraofSevillle · 13/02/2018 11:43

OK, so I am going to start a political party that is going to build loads of houses and set maximum prices for housing in line with local incomes, sell off all the properties that are currently privately rented cheaply so they can only be bought by owner occupiers and end the concentration of the highest paying jobs and investment in the south east.

I have no idea how much taxes are going to have to increase to pay for this madcap scheme, especially as cleaning up brownfield sites for housing is hugely expensive and it's almost impossible to build on greenbelt, but seeing as it will hugely deflate the wealth of current owner occupiers, especially those in London and the South East, and plunge all those who have a giant mortgage on an expensive property into crippling negative equity, I can't see enough people voting for the 'houses for young families' party really.