To think to say wearing the hijab brings you 'respect' and 'security'.

[Eltonjohnssyrup]

Just to start off - this is not a 'ban the burka' thread. I respect the right of all women to wear exactly what they want be that a burka, a bivouac, a hijab, short shorts or a bikini.

It was World Hijab Day yesterday. An event which was promoted by government agencies including the Home Office.

The organisation promoting this event has claimed that the hijab brings you 'liberation'. I'm fine with that. I can see how it would feel liberating not to have to worry about bad hair days or styling every day. And feeling liberated is a personal thing. One woman might feel liberated wearing a full length skirt and long sleeves, one might feel liberated in a bodycon dress and bikini.

But then they went on to say that the hijab brings you 'respect and security'. I feel really uncomfortable about this. It implies that there is a type of respect which women who do not wear the hijab are unworthy of. That showing our hair makes us unworthy of automatic respect.

And 'security', security from what? Harassment? Rape? Terror attacks? This sort of language is moving the responsibility for women's security onto women by saying 'wear this and you'll be secure'. In other words, don't wear it and you're taking risks, asking for it, sending out a signal it is okay to grope or harrass you.

This makes me really uncomfortable, especially in the era of me too. AIBU to think that this campaign should be moderating it's language to avoid tarring those who don't wear it with negative associations? And that the government and Home Office shouldn't be endorsing an organisation that uses it? It's not sending a message of 'women are free to wear what they like' and instead is sending a message that if women want to safe and respected they must cover up.

What I see here is a lack of respect for the Islamic culture.
You can't force people to respect something if they don't. As a Christian i often feel a huge lack of respect for my culture, not much i can do about it really.

Friend works in a Catholic High school in Oldham - huge percentage of Muslim kids.

I'm very surprised that a Catholic school has a huge percentage of Muslim children.

Being Catholic myself and being a school governor and dealing with Admissions...we never had enough places for Catholic children who applied...so would never get to having a huge percentage of other faiths.

I would also add..that any child attending the school...Catholic or not...signs up (their parents do) to the school rules...including mass attendance .

I don't respect any religion. Respect is far more than simply acceptance.

You can't force people to respect something if they don't. As a Christian i often feel a huge lack of respect for my culture, not much i can do about it really.

I agree...but it's when it's disguised.
What I meant was not actually needing to respect...as much as not to disrespect.

Personally...I just leave people to get on with their culture and religion...as it doesnt affect me after all. I don't agree with all aspects of Islam...I had an Ex who was Muslim and I find the religion doesn't align with equality.

I also work in a diverse organisation...to the point that we have prayer/Faith rooms for staff to pray in.

Some people get annoyed that these provisions are made....but it really doesn't affect them. They just feel the need to comment.

Yes hulk I was talking about the batoola. I know it’s a tradition among older people but you should see some of the 40 something ladies arriving at markets in London with theirs adorned in gems and the likes.

I’ve been to edgeware road plenty of times and still never seen a burqa there, though of course, I have seen plenty of niqabis.

I have no idea where savile Park is Tap. I have no axe to grind. I’m just standing up for the rights of people to wear hijab in whatever form they like without being mocked.

Actually, if the idea of 'world hijab day' is that women all over the world put on a headscarf (whether they are athiest, Christian, Jewish, Sikh, Hindu etc) then isn't that as fucking naff as all those shamrock hats people wear in pubs on St Patrick's day?

Some women choose to wear hijab or niquab or whatever and that's up to them. Unfortunately, some women are forced to wear the things, and hate this, so you can't just go on about how lovely it is and that more women should discover the joy of covering themselves up.

kiereninthecommunity does not believe me. Some people just cannot accept the truth. Check out

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-stoke-staffordshire-25066688

and the letter

Where does it say in that letter anything to do with mosques? Admittedly I’m squinting at it on an iPhone as I’ve left my glasses upstairs.

The ‘racial’ mark is a bit mental admittedly but the implication it was to placate Muslims is still factually incorrect isn’t it?

Sandy2K
In areas where large populations of the town are Muslim, you will find the admissions are very different!

Line of duty, that letter didn’t mention Islam at all. It talked about an event at a university where to children could look at religious artefacts. I find the racist element to the letter most bizarre though.

Just to point out that while I am sure there are parents of a variety of faiths refusing to allow their children to visit other places of worship with school, the only one I ever knew of from when my children were at school was a Christian boy whose parents didn’t let him visit a mosque.

hmmwhstatodo
Apologies - I meant Savile Town which is in Dewsbury.

Not sure who is mocking people - the majority are discussing the principle of the ‘event’ and the underlying messages it sends out (broadening into what such gender specific covering up really means for women).

Wearing burkas in the UK is very rare. But I have seen women wearing them, although not in London. So it is wrong to say never, it is right to say rarely.

www.standard.co.uk/topic/burka

That letter is interesting and should probably be deleted

I am guessing it’s in area where maybe races don’t coexist as harmoniously as they do in a large city ? As I can’t see that being an issue in some places

It should also probably be deleted !

I think people are collapsing two things

This effort is in a western country and I believe is intended to promote harmony after some rather fraught years

The forced wearing of the full veil in some places is a disgrace and saddens me

But I don’t think the two issues should be mutually exclusive , and I for one would like to promote integration and acceptance in ‘my country’ and that includes accepting and supporting women to wear the hijab. Women who wear the hijab here can go into be accountants , Doctors and scientists . We can’t demean them all as being ‘opressed’ That’s really offensive .

That letter is horrendous! It will be in the press soon, if it hasn’t been already. As parents make the decision about trips and not kids - why put it on the kids report! That is a letter likely to incite division, not encourage cohesion.

@DreamyMcdreamy - just to answer your question about the hijab; I visit Saudi regularly for work and increasingly see girls who don't wear the hijab. I don't cover my hair - even in Riyadh, which was traditionally the more conservative Saudi city. I do wear the abaya - but no one bats an eyelid at my uncovered hair. Equally, many of the women I work with in GCC states actively choose to cover - it's a reflection of their culture and religion. (But Khaleeji women are often incredibly glamorous with it.)

@GnusSitOnCanoes

I agree with you about Saudi, but it is still very conservative, last time I visited in October I really fancied a McD's but it was men only restaurant!

Tapandgo I had a look at savile town just now, I found an article that used the word burka a number of times and also featured photos of Muslim females. However, none were wearing burkas. I’m amazed that the article went on and on aboutnhow downtrodden the burka clad women were and yet couldn’t actually find any of these women to take photos of. So they went for niqabis instead. Not really a big deal but I do wish people would stop misusing the word.
I’ve lived in a area very similar to savile town in west York’s and I’ve had friends come from the kind of homes depicted in the newspaper articles about them. I did find a lot of the families in the area to be backwards but they aren’t really representative of Muslims on the whole, they are just a small section of mainly Pakistani people. When I lived in such an area they were mostly quite poor and uneducated and would have been suspicious of even Muslims from areas other than Pakistan. Heck, they were often suspicious of Pakistani Muslims not from the same region as them. All you can do is hope that as future generations are born they get out and see that there is more to life than Dewsbury. But honestly, visit a North African or Malaysian Muslim family for example and you will find a very different way of life.

A few years I was in a relationship with a Muslim man. His sisters all wore hijabs and were very derogatory about other Muslim women who didn't wear one. So much for the sisterhood.

That’s just one family spangles, for every family like that there will be one who couldn’t care less, just like in non muslim households some females will be derogatory towards other females for a whole host of reasons. Maybe his sisters hadn’t had much life experience or maybe they just weren’t very nice people!

I heard an interesting conversation on the radio early this afternoon. The radio presenter was asking a caller (a Muslim man) if he would try to force his wife or daughters to wear a hijab. He said of course not,it was their own choice. The presenter then asked whether he thought it likely that some Muslim men DID try to force it upon their wife or daughters. The caller responded with words to the effect of that that was very unlikely to happen,how can someone force someone else to wear something against their will? They would simply remove the garment in question a as soon as they were out of the sight of the person forcing them to wear it. The presenter responded to this with the exact same thoughts that went through my mind,that it wasn't just a case of removing the garment as soon as they were out of sight. It was more a question of someone trying to control someone else,with all the connotations of domestic or emotional violence involved.

hmmwhatatodo. Point taken. I think they just weren't very nice people tbh!

Hmm I'm married to a Muslim man and lived in a Muslim country and you're obviously correct to say that not everyone has the same attitudes. However it has my experience that the majority of veiled women do feel superior to non veiled women and that sentiment has increased over years.

This is about promoting an increasingly conservative version of Islam. This has been going on for some time, and clueless liberals support it.

This is a good article about it.

maryamnamazie.com/world-hejab-day/

I support anything that tackles racism. But World Hijab Day is using the cover of anti racism for another cause.