To really hate it when atheists take the piss out of those who believe in God?

[sharkirasharkira]

I have several FB friends who are obvious atheists, and often share things about science and/or about the concept of God being stupid -basically saying that anyone who believes in God is an idiot, a child (with an 'imaginary friend') or someone who has no idea about science and the universe.

I get that not everyone has faith in a higher being/religion etc but why the childish name calling and the necessity to take the piss out of those who do? It just really irritates me! Belief in God and an appriciation of science are not mutually exclusive. I find it quite offensive that people who don't know my personal beliefs are essentially saying that if I believe in God I must be an idiot or a child who believes in magical sky fairies, because theres no possible way I can believe in evolution (for example) and be an agnostic.

Aibu to think that people should just let others believe what they want to believe without mocking them for it, even if they don't agree with it?

There should be no faith schools at all. I remember as a kid having endless arguments with staff over my refusals to attend assemblies. It’s indoctrination.

But JassyRadlett. It is perfectly possible to make these arguments without being rude or slagging people off as you have just capably demonstrated.

Jonny Scaramanga spent 4 years in one of these schools.

newhumanist.org.uk/articles/4472/accelerated-christian-education-is-a-useless-b-a-helicopter-c-fudge-cake

Educatingarti

The Soviet Union and communist China didn't kill all those people in the name of atheism though did they? They did it because they were hard-line communist states. The atheism is a side issue.

Can't really say the same about any of the fundamental theocracies around the world can we?

We live in a notionally secular state, and the worst thing than can happen to religious people is a being challenged to justify their belief, or seeing a hurtful meme on Facebook. Remind me again what it was like for atheists when the religious were in charge?

Awful things have been done by communist regimes. It’s a bit disingenuous to say that they were done in the name of atheism though. They were certainly not in the way that say ISIS kill directly in the name of religion

Stalin killed many millions in the pursuit of communist reform, not atheism. NK kills its people in the pursuit of the juche ideology - not in the name of atheism.

You cannot hold up the horrors of the holodomor or Stalinism as purely driven by atheism - it was a social system /genocide.

I disagree that atheism was a side issue because of the way Christians and those of other faiths were persecuted and tortured etc. It is still happening in North Korea.
They were atheists who committed atrocities and used their atheism as justification at least in part.

Plus how would your religion STOP you from gaining a promotion? You must have some seriously outdated schools in your area?

RC school can and do have policies that stop anyone not RC being in senior positions.

This is from my local RC school.

^We are committed to the implementation of equal opportunities principles and the monitoring and active promotion of equality in all aspects of staffing and employment. All staff appointments and promotions are made on the basis of merit and ability and in
compliance with the law. ^However the new regulations do not diminish the rights of our Governing Body under section 60(5) School Standards and Framework Act 1998 to give preference, in connection with the appointment, remuneration or promotion of teachers at
the school, to persons: Whose religious opinions are in accordance with the tenets of the religion or religious denomination of the school^or - Who attend religious worship in accordance with those tenets, or

• Who give, or are willing to give, religious education at the school in accordance with those tenets. Similarly, regard may continue to be had, in accordance with section 60(5)(b), in connection with the termination of the employment of any teacher at the school, to any conduct on his part which is incompatible with the precepts, or with the upholding of the tenets , of thereligion or religious denomination of the school.^

Fairies exist. Fairies don't exist. Both statements of belief

They are not, though its a common mistake. There is no evidence whatsoever to support the existence of Fairies, yet someone can have faith in their being, they hold a belief despite no evidence to support it. Others just accept they don't exist, the lack of proof enough for them not to believe in their existence.

Yanbu

I’m an atheist. I do agree the putting someone else down to feel superior is low. Healthy debate is great though. Wish we’d get out of our silos more often to respectfully debate. I tried with my Muslim friends who kept telling me that they had morals and I didn’t. I hope it challenged. We make so many assumptions to divide us. Plenty of intelligent Christians and Muslims etc. Plenty of very moral athiests.

I think those things done 'in the name of faith' were/are also really about a social system/ genocide. Most Christians/Muslims etc manage perfectly fine without doing these things as part of their faith and speak out about how awful they are.

But JassyRadlett. It is perfectly possible to make these arguments without being rude or slagging people off as you have just capably demonstrated.

Indeed. I’m going back to my original point - that people need labels like ‘atheist’ because of the function of religion in public life, because many people of faith won’t keep it to themselves.

Plus, expecting special treatment from the state because of your faith, knowing that special treatment will have a negative effect on others, is inherently disrespectful. And that’s before you get to when faiths campaign against other people getting more equal treatment (such as same sex marriage or secular schools).

So as Christians were pioneers for education for the poor in the 19 century, perhaps they should be pioneers for atheist schools in the 21st.

How does religion negatively affect non-believers?

Well, it’s true they don’t just burn us as heretics any longer, so thanks for that.

But they are still campaigning to have a say how everyone in society has to live. At least here in Australia they are. Many religious groups were very active in the same-sex marriage debate just gone. And continue to fight the good fight in any discussion on euthanasia, abortion, sex education in schools.

In the state I live religious Special Religious Education must be offered by schools, it is not comparative religion, but indoctrination by any church member who feels called to rock up. It took many years of campaigning to allow parents to opt their children out, but they are not allowed to do anything educational while SRE is on. Many more years of campaigning led to secular ethics being offered in the same time slot, to which the churches pouted and said they didn’t approve of children discussing ethics. True story. And now they have managed to claw a little bit back by making schools unable to inform parents there is an alternative to SRE until after the parent has opted their child out.

Also, the federal and state governments have had a lovely time outsourcing a great deal of the social welfare they used to do to religious organisations. So these churches are being funded by my taxes to help job seekers, domestic abuse survivors, the disabled etc etc all the while being exempt from any anti-discrimination provisions in regards to their employees.

They lost the fight to be able to discriminate against LGBTI people in the services they provide, but can still refuse to employ them.

So employees may fear losing their job if they come out as gay, get divorced, have a child out of wedlock, etc, all the usual things.

So I live in an area where one of the major areas of employment is church-based community services, but it is highly unlikely I would be employed as I am an atheist single mother.

That’s how churches affect non-believers and I don’t think it is ok.

Slapdasherie

Interesting and horrifying.

Going back to the Faith School thing, just a quick google tells me that is 1/3 of schools in the UK.

Not RTFT, but if believers post on FB about their beliefs, then they can expect to get a reaction from those who don't. Unfriend them if you can't be doing with it.

Disadvantages of not practicing a religion? My DC cannot go to a very good, oversubscribed local CofE school because DH and I don’t attend the church. Plenty of people who would otherwise not bother attending church do solely to get in.

Even in “ordinary”, non faith UK schools the law requires schools to hold christian worship in assemblies. At my DCs’ school christianity is also being taught as if it is fact in RE.

We do not have a secular state at all.

I'm atheist but I wouldn't dream of mocking someone who believed in any religion.

I do have a bad experience with religion though.
There's 10 years between me and my sister, she moved in with her mother in law when I was around 10 years old and I often used to visit her on the weekends, except my sisters mother in law was very religious.
The word Christmas, easter, birthdays was banned in her house, I remember having the absolute floor wiped with me one day when I was telling my sister all about what I'd had for Christmas and she threatened to not let me come over anymore if I so much as hinted at the word again. Fair enough - but I was a kid and its not like I said it to wind her up!

When my sister finally managed to move out into their own home and I used to visit quite regularly when I was a bit older, it was mid December and I asked why there were no Christmas decs up - she explained that she wasn't allowed them up as her mother in law was visiting that week! It was HER house ffs!

Luckily although her son was supposed to follow this faith he decided in his teens not to follow anything and his mother must have reluctantly accepted it I suppose because my sister, her husband and children have always celebrated Christmas, at least since they had their own place together anyway.

Until I see actual hard evidence that God existed then I choose to not to believe

Belittling anyone for their views is never right.

Most people I find who criticise religion don't even know anything about it, if your going to have a view so strong at least know what your taking about.

Also everyone saying religion doesn't have any proof and therefore that's why they choose not to believe, why are you so quick to believe science - when really there isn't any proof in that either?

You can't prove evolution any more than the creation of God - it depends entirely on what people find more believable, but ultimately no one actually knows. There is much more stigma that comes with having a religion.

Everything we think we know, we have been told.

Namechangerbob

Science is testable and repeatable, religion is not.

If you destroyed every single scientific textbook, and also destroyed every single religious book, in 1000 years time you could come back and all the religions would be completely different, but all the science would still be exactly the same.

You can't prove evolution any more than you can prove the creation of God

🤨

I can't decide if this is deliberate trolling or not.

you cant prove evolution nor gravity?

what?

PatriarchyPerisonified

In effect you've kinda proved my point.

Science is based on theory and if you destroyed all scientific textbooks you cannot categorically tell me that the same theories and concepts would be discovered again. You personally have made a conscious decision to believe theories which you personally do not understand.

You also cannot confirm that religion would come back differently, as for all we know Jesus could make a second coming to start Christianity again.

In both scenarios you cannot prove the origins and have made a decision to believe the findings of another party.

@namechangerbob people will still wonder why an apple fell on their head, so the theory of gravity will come back again.

where do we come from will always be a big question and people will eventually come back to the theory of evolution as the answer

there are so many versions of the bible already, i doubt the same will ever be written again. unless you have infinite monkeys

You can't prove evolution any more than the creation of God - it depends entirely on what people find more believable, but ultimately no one actually knows. There is much more stigma that comes with having a religion.

Of course you can prove evolution. You can demonstrate it in a lab (fruit flies are useful for this) you can see it happening all around you. There are fossils, there is carbon dating, there is genetic finger printing, that is changing some classifications eg we now know that way back in time Neanderthals inter bred with modern humans.

Religion that says evolution is not proved is well, deserving of ridicule.

araiwa - I totally get that the same theories would come up again but you can't know for definite that the same answers would.

Some guy may say that gravity is actually a magnetic pull from within Earth which keeps us grounded, come up with a big equation to 'prove it', and why would we question it, he is a scientist after all - but it goes way over the average persons head, yet they claim it as fact.

I'm not trying to dispute science or religion. I was just trying to make a point that the average person on the street has made a decision on belief and therefore cannot tell one or the other that they are factually incorrect or wrong.