AIBU to think yr5 is young to learn about the Holocaust

[Nolaughingmatter]

Dd is learning about the war at school. She’s been really interested in the topic and I thought it would be more about life for children, battles, bombing, DD day etc.
They’ve now started to teach about the Holocaust. Dd personally isn’t upset about learning this, she more found it incredulous that people would commit such attrocities..
As an only child and with me not going out to work, we have time to talk and I am able to explain things to her in a way it won’t phase her. However, not all kids are like her, some may be going home upset and possibly not even talk to their parents.
Dd told me they viewed a film about the camps with dead bodies today and touched on the gas chambers. Again it didn’t upset her. I imagine the film was footage taken at the end of the war when the allied forces arrived.
Just wanted to ask mumsnet about school teaching this so young.
I’ve used a different username as this post is very identifying.

But the problem is that by leaving it to parents, a sizeable proportion of children are NEVER going to find out about recent history, because the parents are ignorant of it themselves, or they don't think it's important, or they never talk to, read with or educate their kids at home. These are exactly the kind of children education should be reaching. I don't want to politicise or generalise but I'm fairly willing to bet your average extreme right winger - the type who marches or shouts abuse at Jews and Muslims - did not benefit from a decent education, and interested engaged parents.

Hester
Yes, I get that. But it still has to be done at an age appropriate way for a child of 9 or 10. WWII is compulsory for KS3 so there is plenty of time to teach the attrocities of war.

I understand not everyone is like 18toys for example, who is being societally responsible and choosing what to teach and when to for children.

The all-important phrase here is "age appropriate". Primary four here are 7 and 8 years old, and were taught about the Home Front - gas masks, call-up, bombing, etc. simply beyond their understanding and emotional development.

you will find that the Holocaust is very firmly on junior schools' curricula.
In my children's school they did it in year 4, year 5 and then again in year 6.

How old is year 4?

Year 4 in England are currently 8 or 9 years old (born Sept 2008-Aug 2009).

I’ve been taught about the wars since I was in yr 3-yr 13

I just think age 7 1/2 is too young.

But I don't know what is the right age. To my mind, it depends so much on the individual child.

It also depends on family history when it might already be part of discussions while you're growing or have neighbours and friends affected.

Dd did the Holocaust last year in yr 5. They watched The Boy in the Striped Pyjamas which I thought was a 12 rating. They also visited the National Holocaust museum and spoke to a survivor.
I have no problem with it being taught, would have perhaps like to have been notified first in case Dd had questions.

I knew about the camps when my grandfather was alive (he fought in ww2 and was present when one camp was opened).

He died when I was 4. We used to watch The World At War on Saturday afternoons too. Mum was a child during the war and had vivid memories of the London blitz.

Well it's considered acceptable to teach a fake story of a delusional preacher being tortured and then sacrificed on the cross to four year olds, at least the holocaust actually happened and there is educational value in teaching it.

Op. I think what your Dd was shown was not right for her age. Being taught about WWII and the Holocaust without graphic images is one thing, as I said, I grew up with WWII as a regular topic of conversation. But I was a teen before I saw real pictures of Holocaust victims. And it was disturbing (as it should be) then, but I understood why at 13 I needed to see this.
Your Dd is old enough to learn about the holocaust, but to see pictures????

It's strange. I'm trying to think back and I don't remember "finding out" about the holocaust. I think like a lot of other posters that having a grandfather that fought in WW2 and a great grandfather that fought in WW1 meant that the war and all things associated with it were discussed a fair amount growing up.

@Nolaughingmatter my uncle had to drive the tractors at Belsen too. He suffered PTSD until he took his own life, unable to cope with the horror of it replaying in his mind. If it did that to him, it is so much worse for those who were imprisoned there. We have a duty to remember. I have a field day with twats who put racist things on social media claiming our forefathers who fought in the war would want whatever they are advocating. Neither my uncle or my dad would (dad was REME and never left Britain but still served).

DrCoconut: The nutcases who gave our families PTSD with their criminality in the first place are now posturing as the saviours of 'Western civilization'. They've spent centuries calling most of us terrorists at some point and liquidating us. They honestly believe that we loved living under their boot.

Rowgtfc
I would have much preferred this teaching. Dds School ironically would have sought permission to view a cert 12.

DrCoconut
That is really sad. Apparently my gf never talked about it. Before he saw the horrors, he didn’t hate the German populous. Once he’d witnessed what they did to the prisoners at Belsen, he realised the wider population knew atrocities were happening.

I’ve tried to speak to dd. She doesn’t want to talk about it at all. I asked her how she felt about what she saw, trying to get her to talk about her feelings. She doesn’t seem to feel anything. I think she’s numbed.

no especially with the antisemitism routinely displayed by the labour party

I'm glad you are sorting it out with the school. I would have hated to see those images as a young child and I think your DCs age is too young.

I don't think it's appropriate at all at 5 years of age. Children of that age just aren't emotionally mature enough to deal with it - especially not graphic videos with dead bodies in. Why is everyone on this thread just glossing over that?

We were taught about WW2 towards the end of primary school - so year 5/6 when we were 10 or 11 and none of it revolved around the Holocaust - that was taught in secondary school. In primary school our education of WW2 was mostly a brief overview of why it occurred but then it focused on the child evacuees and watching films about that - all acted out, not real life stuff. Our work was to do tasks such as writing about what difficulties they would face, how we would feel if it happened to us etc. I personally think that is enough to be aware of at that age.

By the time we saw the realities of WW2/the holocaust in secondary school we were more mature - although the whole class was in tears after we were shown 'Saving Private Ryan' in year 7.

The head has now replied to me. He’s saying they didn’t see footage of the gas chambers and crematoria. I’m really confused. I know they saw more than he’s admitting to because my dd told me she was piles of belongings for example, which he’s also denied.

The children could also feasibly have been shown less than I said upthread as my friend was very angry and she/we may have misinterpreted what her son told her.

Anyway. I’m leaving it there for now. It’s no point pursuing this further. The head completely whitewashed an incident a couple of years ago with dds relatively unknown medical condition. That caused me a lot of sleepless nights at the time and was a safeguarding issue. I’m not going to put myself through the stress of it. He is a good head in many respects. But when it comes to this sort of thing, he is far happier to close ranks and back the teacher even when I was very reasonable and treated the situation as a training issue.

Halie
Dd is yr 5, so 9. But still I agree, it would be much better to have shown the children The boy in the striped pyjamas or even small, non violent clips from films such as Schindler’s List. The opening scene is incredibly powerful.