To think we don’t realise what modern life is doing to families?

[MrsGrindah]

I’ll own up here.. not a mother myself but a stepmother.
But I spend a lot of time travelling on trains for work and see so many parents on the phone to their kids ( in the mornings and before bedtime). Yes it’s great that technology allows this, but I just feel sorry for people missing out on being with their families. Last week there was a man talking to his little boy, apologising that he had gone before the boy had woken up and wouldn’t be back by the time he went to bed. I felt so sorry for everyone
Not blaming the parents and of course we all have to work. My point is as a society we are becoming used to this and almost expect people to be prepared to sacrifice a significant chunk of family life. Just makes me feel sad to see it and I wonder whether we’ll regret it in years to come.

I was born in 1970 and was a 'latch key kid' from age 12 when my (single parent) mum went to uni and trained as a teacher - then worked as a teacher

I spend way more time with my 3 - as a single parent working PT for better wages than she got - with a decent ex who pays maintenance unlike my dad

it's not new and it's not universal - people need to work to pay for stuff

Nobody ever said on their deathbed that they wished they'd spent more time at work.
I hate this old chestnut.

Equally, nobody ever said they were glad the had to go to a food bank.

To be honest, this is why we left the UK. We wanted to have a family, but I was working 45 or more hours a week and my husband was commuting into London and would never have seen our hypothetical kids during the week. We left the UK and had 3 children and now live on one salary, my husband is home at 5.30 every night and puts the kids to bed. Whenever we think about going back home, we take a reality check of what that would actually mean (after school clubs basically).

I too agree with the OP that it's both necessary and often sad.

I was a child of the 70s with a dad who went to work and a SAHM.

But many of my friend's mums worked too, however the big difference seemed to be that one of the top criteria for getting a council home, was that you had family in that immediate area.

I can't tell you how many of my school friends grew up living opposite/just a few doors away from their grandparents/aunts/uncles etc.

It really made childcare and care of the elderly much easier for all concerned.

That's something that's disappeared in many areas due to lack of social housing and people being priced out of the areas they grew up in.

I agree. There is absolutely nothing wrong with working full time but job expectations seem to be off the scale.

I was in Waterstones at the weekend and they had a whole display dedicated to mindfulness and 'think yourself happy' books. It crossed my mind that the world has gone ever so slightly mad. Perhaps if everyone could slow down they might not need all these 'tomes of wisdom'.

Modern life really is absolute rubbish. As someone with autism, this sums it up for me...

'I don't care if I am poor, as long as my kids are fed and we have a nice safe warm home I am happy'
*
You are not poor if you have those things!*

I’m a child of the seventies/eighties and was at boarding school for most of it.
I didn’t see my parents for months.
It wasn’t great tbh and I’m lucky that DH and I both get to spend lots of time with the DCs and one of us can always do school drop offs and pick ups for the younger ones.

It’s not great for primary aged children to spend so little time with their parents but what are they supposed to do?

People have to earn enough money to keep their families secure. Women should never have to go back to being financially dependant on men.

Wringing our hands about the effect on children just makes good parents feel shit.
Employers should be compelled to make decent provision for family life. Flexible working or working from home needs to be the norm.
We have the tech. There’s no reason so many employees should see so little of their family.

Neah, not really seeing it.

Friend born in '61 talks about being shoved out the door, age 6, with a packed lunch, with his brother. Told to be back for teatime. That's how he spent weekends & holiday periods. So did his friends. His mum was a SAHM.

Has anyone read Angela's Ashes (set in 1930s). How the kids spent their time (hint, it wasn't quality time with their folks).

It's a fantasy to think that kids sat & had long hours of quality time with their parents in the past. Not at all.

I don't think the OP is trying to criticise those of us who have to live this way, I think she is just saying that it is a shame, and it is a shame.

I have a long commute and I leave home in the morning before my little girl is even awake. I get home late and sometimes have to work weekends. My DH sometimes works away and when he does I have no idea how to do all that I am supposed to do when I should be getting the little one to school in our home town by 8.50, nearly two hours after I should have left for work in another city. Life is work, home, cook, clean, care for elderly relative, not enough bed, repeat. Each day mingles into the next and before you know it, another decade has passed by.

I think the main difference is that in the past you would spend the evening or weekends watching TV as a family so you would talk to each other ,even if it was only about what you were watching. These days even if you're in the same room you will probably all be in your own little world of phone, tablet games etc

What a load of nonsense. Lots of parents in the past worked long hours. Many doing shift work. I don't know why you have this nostalgic idea of times gone by. And what about fathers who were absent for years fighting in wars or years in prisoner of war camps.

Well I have a nostalgic thing for times gone by! My childhood on a farm in oz was absolutely amazing and I'm trying to work out how to get back to that (cottage on parents farm is mine, just have to work out how to afford (UK) DHs spouse visa).

It's also not a race to the bottom,. Things should be better than they were in the past, not worse!

Although this is nothing new to the working classes, perhaps capitalism has finally hollowed out the middle classes?

It's a fantasy to think that kids sat & had long hours of quality time with their parents in the past. Not at all.

No it isn't.

It might not have been your experience or the experiences you read about in some books, but for me/most of my family/the majority of my friends and peers, it really was real.

Nobody ever said on their deathbed that they wished they'd spent more time at work

Well she isn’t on her deathbed, but my mum has regretted taking her marriage gratuity (ie leaving work after she had me) ever since she did it. And I’m 40. She still brings it up to this day, and warns me never to fall into the trap of sidelining my career for family life “because you’ll always regret it”.

She did go back to work when we started school. She still hasn’t retired at 68, although she is drawing her pension and doesn’t need the money. She likes to work. It keeps her mind active.

I’m not sure if this has really changed over the generations though?

I’m not young, currently have teens and had them as an older mum. As a younger child I never saw my DF/SDF until the weekends, as an older child I was still up when they got in later in the evening.

Back then we only needed one parent worked to keep a roof over our head and food on the table. Was the same situation for most in my neighbourhood. However most mums started working when kids started school and we were looked after before/after school by grandparents or neighbours. I remember my friends mum didn’t work but volunteered in a charity organisation/shop 3/4 days a week so they joined in with the ‘community’ childminding - some days it would be x persons grandparents, some days it would be a neighbour. On the days their mum didn’t work we would be at their house before/after school. It was basically before/after school care provided by the community rather than official paid services.

Once we reached high school all mums worked and generally long hours. You would never see a parent before school and not again until later in the evening (if you were lucky). I remember it was very common to be left money to order pizza for dinner as parents would be working late. On several occasions I recall we would all stay at friends houses for a week or so at a time when both of the parents were (seperately) overseas on business. No way were mums interested in chucking away educations/degrees and sitting around looking at their kids any more than necessary. Only difference between those days and these is formalisation of child care and possibly enhanced child protection rules around leaving teens alone or significant periods of time.

I think the problem is the need for two full time wages, especially for families on lower incomes, just to run the basics of a home. The days of one main earner and a part time top to pay for the holidays are long gone for those at the bottom.

The other issue is that society expects parents of younger and younger children to be working asap. Even on sites like this where we are all aware of the demands of young children there is the expectation that the mum will need to be back at work while the baby is still tiny. When my eldest was born (hes nearly 20) single mums could still be on income support until the child was 12yo. Whilst I agree by that stage most single parents are able to leave their child to work, at least there was support for those who couldn't.

I don't think children should be away from their parents so much. I have to work away a lot and often might not see my children for up to a week at a time. It saddens me and my children, though they are used to it now. When I grew up I used to spend summers working with my dad helping him out or sitting quietly near him if I couldn't help. My mother was at home mostly. She worked mostly from home but again was often able to bring us with her. My school friends were mostly farmers who similarly spent time working and being with their parents all day they weren't at school.
I think this is how humans are meant to be but it has been completely lost now.

My school friends were mostly farmers who similarly spent time working and being with their parents all day they weren't at school

Unfortunately in the UK that way of life went out went out the window for most people with enclosure of the commons and the growth of towns in the 15th century. I really have never heard of anyone who worked alongside their parents in the fields as a child - are you from a developing country, or have I missed the sarcasm?

I worked with my parents and am pretty sure Australia wasn't. A third world country in the 9os

Ha ha! I'm not being sarcastic though most definately overly nostalgic! Most of my friends would have helped milk cows, help with fencing, sat in tractors, fed animals etc. They probably weren't out cutting crops by hand or anything. But I'll bet some people still have that lifestyle.

Bollox is it a modern thing. Poor women have always worked and rich women have always had nannies...

I apologise for not reading full thread...
I know not everyone has this luxury or even patience but I do believe that homeschooling is the way forward for those that could for our kids and ourselves- where time/budget allows.
Everyone I see is on this wheel, and it’s depressing.
People are too materialistic and I say that as someone who until recently was VERY much that.
We should be putting our experiences with those we love and time before anything else.
No one needs the latest iPhone, trainers, makeup etc. We’ve cut way back on all things we don’t need to pay out monthly, and honestly we are happier.
Switch off the tv, put down the phone and look at how we have been made and pushed into these roles.
I don’t want to sound like a conspiracy nut, however there is a lot of evidence to support the fact we’ve been coaxed into our current life roles.