To think it's fucking shit if a tenant can get away with this???

[NamechangerRanger6]

My parents are landlords. My dad has unfortunately passed away so my mum handles it alone now. The last tenant was in the house for 8yrs. 3yrs ago being in and out of hospital and ill health meant that my mum stopped inspecting. There had been no issues at any inspections so it just didn't enter her head. She did however plan to inspect last year. I know this is heavily naive and if I knew this to be the case at the time I'd have advised her differently and offered to step in for inspections myself.

6 months ago the tenant very suddenly gave notice and moved out, mum went to inspect (I drove her) when the tenant had already left (the tenant wrote a letter and posted the key with it, so there was no time to inspect) What we found was absolute filth. Human and animal shit. Piss up the walls. Rotting food, the original furniture provided with the house was smashed to bits. Parts of the doors smashed in. The patterned red carpet was so dirty it looked a dark brown and you could see no pattern. There was a wet pile of bin bags up against the kitchen door, covered in fruit flies and maggots and god knows what else. I suspect this was the cause of the mold behind the door (the only mold on any fixtures we found - plenty of moody food, clothes and bits of carpet tho) Ashtrays turned up everywhere. The sofa had fag burns all over. Toilet ripped off the wall, bathroom sink smashed on the floor. Light fixtures hanging out by wires. There's more but honestly it would take all day to write it all. I can't think of anything that's been left undamaged.

Since then, the holes in the walls have been filled in and doors replaced. Carpets ripped up. A team of cleaners got the worst of the cleaning done. The total bill for this so far is £8000 (the cleaning alone was 2800, Trust me when I say I don't blame them for that price. It was horrific and I couldn't stand in the house for more than 10 seconds without heaving). Furniture cleared out etc etc.

My mum has sent the bill for all work to the now ex tenant, there was an initial response where they offered a £15 a month payment plan. My mum cried to me about it but accepted (fearing that if she pushed they'd pay nothing) after 2 months they stopped paying. She cannot at this time afford to have further works done. The total to have everything replaced even using the cheapest materials and not replacing like for like is about £35,000. She's looking at selling but has been advised that she'll be looking at maybe £45,000 as a sale price in the state it's in (in decent condition the house would be worth approx £150k).

My mum has been in contact with a solicitor but via some digging we've found out that the tenant has left the country - for Australia. Solicitor advises that if this is the case mum has an extremely slim chance of actually recovering any monies owed and chasing it across the globe would cost thousands upon thousands and likely require an international debt collection agency of some kind and the tenant can easily just ignore it.

Aibu to think this is fucking shit?
I know that my mum should've done things differently but it seems very unfair that you can just book a flight and go to skip out on your financial responsibilities

Cross post! I see you don’t have insurance,

The costs don't sound reasonable at all. You need to get these checked. And what about her insurance?

As a landlord, you take a risk. You can't work on the assumption that all tenants will behave. That's why you arm yourself with things like insurance.

Being a landlord without insurance is a really bad idea. It's even tax deductible.

There was a deposit held but as the monthly rent was £375 (cheap for the area now but about right when tenant moved in, they never put the rent up) the deposit paid didn't touch the sides. The deposit was one months rent (so 375)
No guarantor.

In a bog standard three bed semi, even stripped back to plaster and with floorboards replaced etc there’s no way it should come to £35k with a basic finish.

Plus, that estimate of 45k sounds absolutely bonkers for a house worth £150k.

Unfortunately in some situations the law is completely inadequate at supporting landlords who suffer issues like this (and completely inadequate at supporting tenants who have awful landlords). It's a total disgrace.

I would see what you can do yourselves as cheaply as possible to get the value up. I became a landlord when my mum died and it was a huge eye opener, I had an agency and reasonable tenants and it will still a bloody nightmare.

The costs just don't sound right at all.

A 150K house even in a shit state would not be 45K

Get on www.mybuilder.com and get more quotes.

This is a really shit situation but also this is why people get pissed off with ‘accidental’ landlords. Fucking about with property isn’t an instant easy money strea, things can and do go wrong and LL need to be all over their shit.

Yes, it is terrible, I really feel for your mum. My DM let out a property that was often left in a very bad way by tenants who did a runner owing rent too. Not quite as bad as the damage you describe though.

I don't know what you can do at this point, hopefully someone can advise. Does your DM have any insurance that might cover some of the work? Technically the deposit should be held in a protection scheme.

Inspections are important, not just to check for damage done by the tenant but to check that the things the landlord must provide or maintain are dealt with. Professional inventories on move in are also crucial to determine exactly what damage occurred when. You wouldn't be able to recoup the whole coat of the work even if it were possible to make the tenant pay, because it will be hard to prove what happened when, and because some things will have no official value. For example, if I remember rightly, once a carpet is 7 years old it is deemed to have reached the end of its rental lifetime and the landlord can leave it in place but would not be able to charge for any damage.

I rent and we always have to provide references from the previous two landlords and personal referees, is there anyone your DM had references from who might know more about where the tenant is.

I am so sorry this has happened to your family, I would hope people who would carry out this criminal damage would be rare. I hope someone who can advise better comes on.

We are renovating a house that has to be gutted, with careful management, the final bill won't exceed £10k. We have already done all the major things and well on track to stay under budget so the £35k must be wildly inflated!

It is shit that a tenant can do this, but this is why you have regular inspections and insurance! Also, im sure you could get the work done for way less. MILs property has had all new windows and a central heating installed for less than 10k. A clean up and redecorating would be way less. If you're going to sell or rent, you don't need furniture. Sell or let without.

Unfortunately things do go wrong with renting sometimes. You need a lot more than £8000 saved as an emergency fund, especially if you have no insurance. Did she not get any financial advice after her husband died?

I'm so sorry but insurance lapsed for THREE YEARS??? The house could have burned down and been worth nothing.

please check your mum's own house insurance policy as a matter of urgency to make sure she isn't vulnerable elsewhere.

as for the wrecked house; yes, it is disgusting. But if the rent was paid that is something. Has she been doing gas safe (if gas?), provided how to rent booklet, smoke alarms, EPC etc etc etc? She's dodged a lot of bullets. The landlord game is very risky if you don't know what you are doing.

there will be better quotes and it won't cost as much as she's been told to fix. Get it insured, fix it, sell it.

Dreadful - your poor mum

Can you not strip it out and sell it as a shell? I am sure if houses are worth £160 in that area, and fit out is £35k you would get a better return than £45k.

If I'd known she wasn't inspecting I'd have offered to do it with or for her but yes as you say the horse has bolted.

I'll let mum know to get more valuations done on the house, but the quotes look pretty reasonable to me on that end. As I said there's more to it than just carpets, bathroom and kitchen (floorboards, ceiling, etc) Will check out the link, though and double check mum has enough correct quotes.
She is elderly (in her 70's and in poor health) so you've all got me wondering if people have been taking advantage of her by doubling the price here and there...

The thing is, being a landlord is a job and should be approached professionally, it's not just a nice little earner where you sit back and wait for the monthly cheque to roll in. Your mum didn't treat it like that and has been spectacularly unlucky. Maybe if she carries on she should consider going through an agent and pay for a full management contract. The profits would be less but they'd be responsible for inspections etc.

Is there nothing that you and your extended family can do to help pitch in. Now you’ve paid three grand for a cleaning company. Stripping and cleaning the house down and redecorating can be done cheaply if a gang of you go in and get it done. I would suggest she sells as ,and I mean no disrespect in saying this, she isn’t cut out to be a landlady especially based on the lapsed insurance.

X post If she's in her 70s and in poor health then maybe she should sell up, or pass management to you (if you're willing)

Most people advise saving 2k per annum from the income on each rental property you own with a view to a complete refurb every 8-10 years. Regular inspections (every 3 months) are the way to go to pick up any issues at any early stage. I would think you could get a decent refurb for 10-15k if you're careful.

Just out of interest, you mention you had no insurance - what would you have done if a serious issue had arisen with the house that was your responsibility as a landlord to put right?

Those costs sound extremely high, and I agree that the interior condition of a house won't knock two-thirds off its price. In fact, the house might make a decent investment project for someone to add value, so although it obviously wouldn't fetch what it might in decent condition, there might still be interest.

Unfortunately, accidental landlords (and I'm one myself, but have made sure to do everything by the book) are more and more common. There are so many legal requirements to do with renting a house - gas safety certificates, deposit has to be held in a scheme or the landlord will get into trouble, proper tenancies have to be issued, rent declared as income to HMRC etc. that everything needs to be done properly and above board or you can find yourself in a lot of trouble.

It's shit and awful, but I think I would chalk this up to experience and get some quotes from other tradesmen. If your mum hasn't been declaring her income and hasn't had the right legal stuff in place, pursuing the tenant for costs legally could end up backfiring.

Try small individuals or odd-job men rather than bigger companies. We got an odd-job man to repaint our rental house, lay new floors in two rooms, repair some skirting board and paint all the woodwork, and it was under £2000. I'm struggling to see how even redecorating the entire house and replacing the kitchen and bathroom could have cost anywhere near £35,000.

I really feel for you and your mum, but this is a costly lesson on how important it is to do things correctly. There's so little wiggle room when letting out property - tenants have a lot of rights and everything needs to be done by the book, doesn't matter if you're just renting out one house as a way of getting a bit more cash or if you have a portfolio of properties.

You could try contacting www.landlords.org.uk/ and seeing if they have any advice.

It is terrible that a tenant can get away with that. I'm so sorry for your mum.

Being a good landlord doesn't just mean being reasonable to your tenants, it means protecting your investment too, which your mum failed to do in several ways. Failing in business is often an expensive lesson to learn

I do think an estate agent has cause to lie about the value - they aren't supposed to, but they can be very manipulative and may have a relationship with a builder of some type who turns around buildings like that. So it may well not be as bad as it currently appears. I would worry for your mum though, whatever route she takes, that she would be ripped off by a lot of people. She sounds like she isn't too on the ball about business and I think quite a lot of people see women and older people as being easy marks.

oh how awful, i feel for you and your mother OP. But others have said, this fell down when 1) you had no insurance 2) no guarantor 3) no inspections.

Sorry there's not much practical advice to be offered, but as PPs have said please check your mother's other insurance policies haven't lapsed (e.g. her own home etc) and generally her financials are in order.

@Chanelprincess we rent and have done for 10 years.

We've never lived anywhere that does quarterly indirections. That's way too frequent.