...to be baffled, sad and angry that Paris Lees is speaking at the Women's March tomorrow?

[ArcheryAnnie]

So, Paris Lees has been invited to address the "Time's Up" rally opposite Downing Street tomorrow, organised by the Women's March London. The "Time's Up" initiative "provides advice and support to women across all industries who have experienced sexual harassment or abuse at work."

But wait! Paris Lees is in favour of street harrassment of women, and writes articles in places like Vice, making sure lots of men know that catcalls are cool and sexy, and making sure lots of women know they have been "infantilised", and aren't nearly as brave as cool, sexy Paris, if they don't like it.

www.vice.com/sv/article/zn7b79/enjoying-catcalls-paris-lees-column

AIBU to be absolutely baffled, as well as sad and angry, that Paris Lees has been asked to speak for women at an event opposing sexual harrassment?

Women's march my arse.

Sigh. Just sigh.

Not only does this damaged person court sexual harrassment, they shame women who don't.

Exactly this, Datun. If you don't love harrassment, then you just aren't cool and sexy, and you certainly aren't brave or really liberated.

Fuck that.

Apparently Jack Munro tweeted earlier about making the London one inclusive by not "centering reproductive systems".

Fuck that indeed.

I thought jack was born female but is living as a male, and had given birth to a child. So comments on women’s issues as...?

Jack change their mind every half hour.

How lovely to be able to pick and choose.

*changes

That’s Munroe Bergdorf (whoever she is) who’s wanking on Twitter about not centring the March on reproductive systems. But I always thought that’s what it us here in the first place. And have Tweeted as much. Under an anonymous twitter handle because it’s dangerous for me to use my RL name. There’s oppression for you

It is the role of the human female in the reproduction of the species which is at the root of women’s oppression. So reproductive systems are very much at the centre of feminism.

If this was a natal man talking, there is no way in heaven he would've been invited. And there is no way that people would think that is the way women talk, just because he says so.

except sadly it is the case that just recently natal women have expressed similar bullshit, namely Catherine Deneuve et al in their Le Monde letter where they appeared to defend men's right to insistently or awkwardly hit on women, in the name of sexual freedom.
It is not about a transwoman speaking out against abuse it is about this particularly transwoman speaking out about abuse.

Gross

I think we all need to write and complain to the organisers. We wont get it stopped, but they should be made aware that women object

LardyMardy

Ahhhh. Thanks for that. Someone said Munro and I just thought Jack.

Reproductive systems centered?

My head has just imploded. It really bloody has.
That sentence just makes no sense, on any level to me.
What am I missing, will someone tell me?
Is this about women or not about women. Is it about men's reproductive systems or not.
Are women reproductive systems the problem, the issue, our fault?
When, or fucking when, does my reproductive system stop being some other fuckers issue...they either hate it, mutilate it, shut it down, start it up or steal it.
When can it just be mine? Please.

It is not about a transwoman speaking out against abuse it is about this particularly transwoman speaking out about abuse.

No of course. Transwomen should absolutely have a platform to talk about abuse they receive.

But that generally stems from homophobia. Men do not like to see gender nonconforming men.

Women's abuse stems from misogyny. It's completely different.

I object to somebody born male talking on my behalf about abuse they will never have received. Because it's not on the basis of their female reproductive potential. Whereas mine is.

I would have absolutely no problem, and fully support, transwomen calling out men who abuse them for being trans.

Fucking hell. Munroe tweeting this shite about the march -

"I also want to stress that if you do attend, it is CRUICIAL that you do with an INTERSECTIONAL mindset. Centering reproductive systems at the heart of these demonstrations is reductive and exclusionary."

"Not all women have reproductive systems, not all women have a vagina, not all women's vagina's are pink. Think about your message, use your voice for ALL women. Not just yourself."

Vaginas are all pink Munroe! Not so hot on the old biology are we?!

That's the pink pussycat that they claim was exclusionary. They are now deciding that black women's vaginas aren't pink, which they are.

Confusing vulvas with vaginas. Yet another biology 101 they missed.

Plus appropriating intersectionality which was designed to demonstrate how you can be oppressed for being both black and a woman, on two separate axes.

Not by being a man.

particularly hypocritical

incidentally Hucknall is a shithole and I thought she had spoken of having a bloody tough time there so not sure why in the article she speaks of not being brought up in fear as I thought she at some point was afraid there - given the amount of abuse some transwomen get I would not resent a transwoman talking about their experiences of harassment but given what Paris wrote about catcalling, even if it was a provocateur piece of clickbait designed to make a quick buck that is why she should not be invited to the Time'sUp march. The organisers either have not done their homework or don't give a fuck.

Right then.
Put on a bra, panties and some lippy and that ought to cover all aspects of femininity. Oh, and don't forget simpering at the cat calls. All in a days work for a proper woman.

That sex article is grim. So blokey and half bullshit because a pseudo vagina/inverted penis doesn't self lubricate or do half the things Paris claims. I can't believe Paris is 'a new suffragette'. What have they (I won't call Paris she as transwomen are not women) actually done to merit that? Does Paris have something on Vogue? Gross little bastard.

Not to mention the twat is a thief too, not a very good one seeing as they spent 8 months in prison. I could weep for womankind. This idiot is who we are supposed to look up to?

I object to somebody born male talking on my behalf about abuse they will never have received. Because it's not on the basis of their female reproductive potential. Whereas mine is.

Abuse is abuse - we will have to agree to disagree on that one as there are probably transwomen out there who do 'pass' so the bloke who chooses to abuse or harass does so, not necessarily knowing they are harassing someone without female reproductive potential.

Paris Lees is nonetheless not the right speaker for this event. Same as Brigitte Bardot would also not be credible as an ally.

Ach. Don’t be so silly, wimmz.

There were probs no women available who had any opinions worth listening to about sexual harassment. I mean, if we all just loosened the fuck up, there wouldn’t be any sexual harassment, would there?

It’s down to us being all prudey and shit. We should listen to someone who does womaning better than us,

How many transwomen have been sexualised from a young age

From the age of 12 (when I still looked about 9) until a few years ago I have been harassed and catcalled

Maybe some transwomen have as adults but not so as a child as a self conscious painfully shy teenager will they had to deal with daily remarks because they have big breasts no

Why can’t transwomen set up their own groups to discuss their issues I wouldn’t feel I could talk on their behalf my experiences are different and I wouldn’t want to claim I could so why should they for me or feel that they can

Abuse is abuse - we will have to agree to disagree on that one as there are probably transwomen out there who do 'pass' so the bloke who chooses to abuse or harass does so, not necessarily knowing they are harassing someone without female reproductive potential.

That's true. It does however make you transphobic. Apparently.

I agree that if a man passes the motivation from the cat caller will be misogyny.

But I still disagree that it is the same.

There is no fear of pregnancy if raped. A man stands a better chance of fighting off his attacker. And a man, with male socialisation, will not be walking around constantly afraid. Lees is living proof.

Lees is also not at all unusual in finding cat calling validating. It's a common refrain.

All abuse is bad. All of it.

But misogyny is the basis of women's abuse. Based on their biology.

You don't find women representing gay men and deciding to talk on their behalf about homosexual abuse.

The gay community would think it was a bloody cheek.