To be furious teachers keep sitting 'naughty' kids next to my 'angelic' DC

[Flaky]

So he is then upset by them being mean to him and doesn't want to go to school?

This is at least the 3rd occasion a kid like this has been moved next to him.

Last year the teacher admitted that she had done it so DS's good influence rubs off but why should he suffer for it?

He's the youngest in the class as well (Yr2)and some of these DC are almost a whole year older.

Isn't this just very lazy teaching?

He may well directly benefit from this 'tax' as it teaches him other skills such as compassion and how to work in 'adversity'.

Alternatively, he may take a serious hit to his confidence, his self esteem, his enjoyment of learning and his sense of safety when in school. Resilience takes time to develop and,as with many other things, children develop at different rates and to different degrees.

OP, talk to the teacher if you believe this is having a negative impact on your dc. Where the situation is adversely affect his willingness to go to school, his teacher really needs to know (they can then either ensure closer supervision or a change in the arrangements).

They should get all the norty boys and put them in a cupboard with no playtime. That’ll learn the little fuckers.

Your bae your way hun.

I'm not sure how the teacher is supposed to keep everyone happy over this one.

There are a finite number of places in the class, a finite number of kids who will just get on with their work and usually several who will cause some type of disruption to those around them.

Within that you also have pairings or groups which just don't work and kids who have to be separated at all costs for the good of everyone.

The usual approach is to move around a lot so that everyone gets an equal amount of the disruptive kids and the better kids, but of course as a teacher you will get a complaint from every single bloody parent pretty much, every time the seating moves.

Moving the seats around a lot can itself be disruptive.

Sometimes you just run out of combos which work.

Essentially it's something that just has to be sucked up - hope that it's for a short time.

Thing is if it actually worked the same kids wouldn't still be mucking about in yr 6.

Just to reframe the narrative slightly - is it not the case that the issue is not that your dc is being seated with pupil X, but that pupil X is being allowed to bully your DC without adult intervention.

So, be fully supportive of the mixed seating system but insist that this is combined with a firmly enforced zero-tolerance policy on bullying, along with some pshe lessons covering how to draw the line between normal friendly banter and gentle teasing which is OK, and actually being mean which is not.

As pp have said, your dc also needs to learn how to get through the next 11 years in a world where even badly behaved children are entitled to access to mainstream state education.

The teacher should really be sitting the other child close to her so she can keep an eye on him. No it's not fair to make your DC the example of model behaviour especially if he feels threatened from the other DC. Have strong words.

What rubbish Hesburger. I am in no way writing off a 6/7 year old. I have an older DC with SEN and resulting disruptive behavioral problems myself and got a lot of grief from other parents so I am not judging the child. I totally agreed with parents who didn't want their own DCs wellbeing (although he wasn't a bully) or education compromised by him bring sat next to them!

My Y5 child is really struggling with this at the moment. She's been diagnosed with anxiety by CAMHS, and one of the things that really upsets her is when she's not allowed to get on with her work. She judges herself on her academic work and gets very upset if something she's done isn't up to the standard she's set for herself. She's currently partnered with a boy who messes around all the time and distracts her. He doesn't want to get on with the work they're set, but doesn't allow her to either. Her behaviour is definitely not rubbing off on him!

It worked in KS1 as she enjoyed helping children who needed it, but through Y3 and 4 it was clear that the disruptive children were becoming more disruptive and the pairing of achiever/disruptive child just means (in my experience) that the achiever does not become more resilient - far from it. Instead they have to work alongside someone who name calls, sometimes hurts them, and is constantly disruptive; pinching stuff or deliberately spoiling work.

And this is an ofsted outstanding primary in a "naice" area.

Slimmer - as a teacher, surely you're aware that often the more academic children are also anxious and introverted, and struggle to work well in groups, so pairing them with children who couldn't give a shit does not build resilience at all.

I agree that it's not fair on your DD. As one PP said, the teacher should seat a child that's playing up near to her. It's not fair to constantly place disruptive pupils next to well behaved ones, it must impact on their ability to learn. It's also leading to bullying in the classroom, judging by some of the posts on here.

I do think this is (annoyingly) standard, my own DD and another girl tend to end up on a table with the same people every bloody year because they get on with their work and don't mess about. It is frustrating, bring on secondary I can't wait!

Your dc should not have to put up with another child repeatedly "being mean" to him, I would expect the teacher to be dealing effectively with mean behaviour.

But placing disruptive children next to well-behaved children is to be expected within reason - ie so long as the teacher is controlling the class and work is being done. Presumably there is a rotation going on so your dc is not always being disrupted.

My dc tend to be well behaved at school so often have this situation. I use it as a good opportunity to teach them about accepting differences and understanding why some children are disruptive- ie personality differences or learning difficulties or just being unhappy. It helps my dc understand that some children struggle more with school than others and helps teach them empathy.

But I would not accept another child repeatedly being horrible to my child, that's different imo.

What the hell are you on about, Zerosugar?

Yes, sit them together, impose proper discipline and not inflict them on others who would like to learn something.

I agree. Then they can observe the behaviour being ‘modelled’ by the well-behaved kids without distracting them.

But placing disruptive children next to well-behaved children is to be expected within reason - ie so long as the teacher is controlling the class and work is being done

Well then you kinda need to not moan at the kids and make them feel bad fir asking you questions about what they missed due to being obstructed from their work/learning.

Unless of course you deliberately pick the ones who won't disturb you even if the work can't be done as well as it should/could be. That way it appears to be working doesn't it. Well behaved kids are the ones who put up and shut up

I completely agree that there should be no unkind behaviour in the classroom. This needs to be reviewed as soon as it arises.

For every angelic-naughty pairing nightmare there are often more success stories.

Class seating plans are a fine balancing act - regular changes lead to better working relationships between pupils.

This happened with my ds. Teacher thought sitting the kid who blullied him relentlessly next to him would make the other kid behave! He had pencils etc stolen, work ripped, poked, pushed and he couldnt concentrate cos the other kid wouldnt shut up. Got him moved as he didnt want to go to school either.

Its not my kids job to monitor bad kids behaviour and try to get them to behave in class. Thats the teachers job. Sit them where you can keep an eye on them.

As the cahms lady said its not up to my child to develop coping strategys to deal with bullying. Its up to school to deal with it and stop it.

How would you feel if another parent complained that your DS is not as angelic as their child & asked the teacher not to sit them together?

I’m not the OP (obvs), but I would feel embarrassed that my child was so badly behaved.

Oh and in terms of her developing compassion - she totally gets why other kids find it tough and behaved badly as a result - she understands that some kids have worse home lives than others (although the problems in our school mainly come from parents who think their children can do no wrong and give them every material benefit going, when teachers point out that little Amelia is - in fact - being a complete shit to the other kids, they post outraged diatribes on facebook about how terrible the school is and how rubbish the teachers are).

It doesn't make it any easier to deal with when these children are bullying you mercilessly.

Dd was always seated with the more difficult boys in Primary. Having three brothers she had perfected the withering look, the death stare and the ability to ignore anything smaller than a volcano erupting next to her. Her teachers used to seat her best friend one side and the difficult child the other and she would freeze them out and with no audience they gave in generally.
Dd never complained to me and if she ever raised anything with the teacher they would immediately address it (one boy took her ruler) Somebody has to be seated next to more difficult children so a teacher's hands are tied and children do need to develop some resilience and the ability to ignore distractions or else school and real life would be very difficult otherwise.

Happened to both my dds. They will try to tell you that your child will actually learn more by teaching the others, as well. Which was never ever true in my experience.

I get that you need to mix things up, and that you can't just round up all the children who behave poorly, but it's really unfair to those who do want to learn and behave - what stuck in my craw most was not just that it happened, but the blatantly cynical and untrue pretence that it was somehow good for my kids!

“Basically on a table of 4, there would be a higher achiever, average pupil, someone 'disruptive' and some one below average”

OMG just realised what the teachers were doing all those years ago. I can easily pin point each child now. Grrrr. I was bullied on those tables as I wanted to work and the others didn’t. OP ask for your child to be moved.

A few years ago the teachers sat DD next to a bully, he started bullying her saying he hated her. I went straight to the school and insisted that she was moved. They did it straight away, no drama.

The penalty of having a kind child.

I don't understand how teachers can say it works.

It's been the same kids for 6 years. They haven't learnt a thing if anything they have got worse.

Perhaps if it was dealt with instead of just hidden by shoving a kid who won't bug you about stuff you wouldn't have to do the same thing every single yr

I might ignore it. I might tell them to stop. I've learnt a myriad of strategies.

You're also a good deal older - probably with 20 years plus of life experience more than this child - and have time to develop those strategies. OP has a 6yo child, one who is rightly looking to a responsible adult to help him manage a situation he is not yet equipped to manage himself. Given that the situation is ongoing, the teacher in charge is either unaware of the 'mean' behaviour or not responding to it (hopefully the former) - would you want a child to be subject to distressed coming to your class?