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Original poster

Would you consider this racist? H&M advert

999 replies

BornInSydneyy · 08/01/2018 21:12

A young black boy wearing a jumper that says -

“Coolest monkey in the jungle”

I genuinely can’t understand how anyone thought that was acceptable.

OP posts:
Thread gallery
10
BertrandRussell · 09/01/2018 16:19

“I think some people look for things to get offended about”

Sadly, there is no need to look far.....

Ghanagirl · 09/01/2018 16:20

Babybauble
But look at all the post defending racist behaviour
ClaryFray comment is typical of certain Mumsnet users, sad and ignorant

ToffeeUp · 09/01/2018 16:20

It's not just Britain where monkey is used as a racist insult, sigh. Maybe some people really do live under rocks.
And any way h&m is an international company

LinoleumBlownapart · 09/01/2018 16:21

It has deep connotations and a history. You were not called milkybar to degrade you and make out that those calling you milkybar were doing so to inform you that being white and being a milkybar means that they felt superior to you and that they needed you to stay in a non-human category so they could trample your self esteem. Or was that actually the case, they were trying to shame and degrade you and you have overcome it so it didn't have any lasting damage on your feelings of self worth?

Racism is not choosing to be offended, it is calculated and deliberate acts to degrade other humans. Just as sexism is used to beat, spit at, assault and deny rights to women. It won't stop if people pretend deeply traumatic or degrading experiences didn't "offend" them.

Rosewatersoap · 09/01/2018 16:21

H&M is not a British company. Perhaps they didn't see the issue because it's not offensive to them?

It's a Swedish multinational clothing-retail company operating in 62 countries whose shareholders will have an interest in the company's global image and communication. You'd have to be a pretty useless art director not to realise that monkey and jungle connotations have the potential to be offensive to some of your customers. Global business is usually pretty aware of culture, diversity, racism, not so much sexism sadly. Pissed off customers = loss in shares. So.

Glintysea · 09/01/2018 16:24

I’ve been out for over four hours and I can’t believe some people are still trying to defend this advert as not racist. How are they so unaware that monkeys and jungle are abuse that black people have had to deal with for at least 50 years (I’m 57 and these vile insults were going strong when I was in primary school.)

noeffingidea · 09/01/2018 16:25

Maisypops it's enabling racism though. If you don't do anything to stop it even by just speaking up to say something like 'you may not be aware, but this might be considered offensive' . It's like the #metoo thing where women expect men to challenge other men's sexist language and behaviour.

Gilead · 09/01/2018 16:27

I think we have to use some common sense and think of the intention. Cute kid, monkey top, awww he must be cheeky.
I think we have to remember that monkey is frequently used as a derogatory term and that we have a responsibility to all people to call out racism when it is there. Why wouldn't you? There are people, many people on here stating a calm and reasonable case, they cite news articles and their own experience, but it's safer for you to ignore it. Why is that?

LinoleumBlownapart · 09/01/2018 16:27

H&M is not a British company. Perhaps they didn't see the issue because it's not offensive to them?

It's Swedish, they know it's offensive. Sweden has a very racist past, even worse coming from a Swedish company IMO.

Ghanagirl · 09/01/2018 16:28

NewYearNewMe18 children are not wearing same logo look at the facts before you add your flip comments

RicottaPancakes · 09/01/2018 16:34

But there are lots of tops with the word monkey (normally "cheeky monkey" though, and no mention of jungles) on them and they've been around for many years. Is it because it's a black boy wearing it in this case? Would it be OK if the model was white?

Rosewatersoap · 09/01/2018 16:36

Sweden has a very racist past, even worse coming from a Swedish company IMO. Worse than English colonialism?

ricotta there are many posts upthread that address your question Would it be OK if the model was white?

Bimbler · 09/01/2018 16:37

Is it because it's a black boy wearing it in this case?

Uh, yeah!

Ghanagirl · 09/01/2018 16:38

KnobZombie7
I’ve been called this in last 3-4 years my beautiful daughter was called this by a boy in her class.
It’s not “historical” it still goes on!
I forgot to add former First Lady Michelle Obama was also called “ape in heels” and compared unfavourably to Melania Trump who has done nothing empowering except marry a racist.
Michelle Obama is a lawyer who has support equality for women etc but she’s compared to a Monkey!!

noeffingidea · 09/01/2018 16:39

I was called the milky bar kid at school because I'm white, do I have a problem the milky bar kid is portrayed as white. No
This is like when men say things like 'women shouldn't complain if they get catcalled. Women do it to men sometimes, men just don't make a fuss about it. We just laugh it off, so women should too.'

JAPAB · 09/01/2018 16:46

Glintysea I’ve been out for over four hours and I can’t believe some people are still trying to defend this advert as not racist. How are they so unaware that monkeys and jungle are abuse that black people have had to deal with for at least 50 years

I doubt anyone is unaware of that. But not everyone has to agree that monkeys and jungles become intrinsically racist because they have been used by racists. Some people might believe that they are only racist if used racistly (if that is even a word).

Though regardless of whether it was racist in
itself, you can argue it was a bad PR decision due to the fact that many have taken objection.

Heartoffire · 09/01/2018 16:47

I think the company has done it on purpose to be honest. No one with half s brain can argue this isn’t offensive and racist and I just don’t believe an international retail giant wouldn’t know this.

LinoleumBlownapart · 09/01/2018 16:55

Worse than English colonialism?
No not top trumps on historical racism, I was referring more to the on going problems with white supremacy and neo-nazi groups, slightly worse in Sweden than Britain, although both have them.

BitofaPoorEffort · 09/01/2018 17:06

It does seem a bit bizarre that such a major advertising campaign, with huge amounts of time, expertise and money invested in it, would have done this accidentally...'no such thing as bad publicity'?? Certainly seems a lot of celebs are all over it...

(It really surprises me how many people here are ignorant of the use of these terms, on the football field particularly. It's a simple fact, these terms of 'monkey' and 'jungle' have been and are used today, specifically for purposes of racial abuse. That is not debatable. And it really surprises me that the wisdom of emblazoning these words across a black child's chest in a high profile ad campaign is up for debate. Only one reason for doing this that I can see...)

MaisyPops · 09/01/2018 17:06

But not everyone has to agree that monkeys and jungles become intrinsically racist because they have been used by racists.
This.
I'm not going to stop calling my nephew a little monkey just because some racists have used monkey as a racist insult
Though regardless of whether it was racist initself, you can argue it was a bad PR decision due to the fact that many have taken objection
Exactly.
I don't think the top was inherently racist because calling kids little monkeys/cheeky monkeys is a standard term of affection in my area.
However, putting a black child in it for a PR campaign was probably misjudged and insensitive and didn't really consider some uses of the word monkey.

BitofaPoorEffort · 09/01/2018 17:07

Heart of Fire...I am a crap slow typist on phone...sorry you said first and more concisely!!

Ghanagirl · 09/01/2018 17:08

SheGotBetteDavisEyes
Yes highly payed black football players are still subject to racist taunts and bananas being thrown at them.
Unfortunately lots of white people are saying it doesn’t matter to them including Mumsnet HQ guess if it doesn’t matter to people who are not on the receiving end of this abuse it’s not a problem.
So it will continue😔

DixieNormas · 09/01/2018 17:13

This reply has been deleted

Message withdrawn at poster's request.

Ghanagirl · 09/01/2018 17:13

Mumsnet HQ will pull comments deemed to abusive but seemingly only regarding white children...

hendricksyousay · 09/01/2018 17:15

I wouldn't have seen the connection as I'm sure h and m didn't . Why do people need to make such an issue out of everything !!🙄🙄

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