To think we should all just pay 1-2% income tax to help fix the nhs

[Ieatcake]

Lots of health professionals are saying it's like a third world country. We need more beds and more money for socialcare. Not many would even notice a tiny tax rise and it would help fix it ASAP.

They should offer tax breaks for people who pay for private health insurance.

The PFI contracts - brought in under labour - were a means to fix the buildings after decades of tory underspending in the infrastructure. So yes, it was a quick fix, but something was needed.

Why didn’t they raise taxes or borrowing to cover the costs, then?

PFI was a nice way to sweep the problem under the carpet whilst being able to say that they were “investing” huge sums fixing the NHS after the Tories broke it.

I’m no Tory, but the way the NHS’s issues are being used as a political football by the left at the moment is laughable.

They’re not suggesting fixes; they’re just shouting from the rooftops about the government’s failures and spouting untruths (often repeated on MN) about spending being “slashed” when nothing of the sort has happened.

Doesn't it make you laugh , that in rosey Corbyn land the NHS would have been perfect,

The NHS is a beast, who will eat any money thrown it's way and still want more. It needs changing not just money.

There's no point pumping money into the NHS while social care funding and services are being slashed and burned. The NHS has a winter crisis...in many areas social care has been in crisis for the past 5 years. But care workers and social workers aren't hailed as "angels" and everyone still grumbles about how they don't get anything for their council tax.

You shouldn't be able to make a private profit on NHS healthcare.

Then Private companies won't do it...

If the private companies pulled out now the NHS would be shafted. Which is why the whole model needs to be looked at, along with the services it provides, before any knee jerk, vote winning, doesn't work 10 years down the line solutions are put in place....

Social care is what needs overhauling. The beds cannot be emptied much of the time because of the dwindling social care, respite and rehabilitation units (local cottage hospitals).
Education of patients needs overhauling. Coughs, colds, strains and sprains can be dealt with by drop in clinics and gps. To see that women on 24 hours in A&E with an infected nailbed made me shout at the tv!
We had 1%added to National Insurance years back, for funding improvements to the NHS and it made no difference.
We have been told that finally, the charging system has been overhauled so that countries are billed for their citizens treatment. It will be interesting to see the new amounts reported later this year. If done correctly, this is by far the largest single source of income they will see but only if 100% goes back to the hospital.
There should be a ban on golden handshakes for people whose wages are paid by the taxpayer. You do not perform? You receive the same severance as the average working person; one month's paid notice and any accrued holiday, not these huge payoffs we see for failed CEOs.
Let's see management working on the ward at least two days a month.
Let's see honest reporting of waiting list times instead of the carefully manipulated application of what defines waiting time.
Let's see nurses and doctors paid appropriately. At the rates the currently pay to agencies. Keeping staff has to be better than pulling in agency staff.
Let's see shift work across the board that includes weekends to clear the backlog and let's see staff left alone when on weekly or daily rest.
Let's see the return of inpatient mental health units so the emergency service workers can bypass the general hospital system and go straight to the mh hospitals.

Let's see more emergency aid night buses on the street at night where first aid help is offered to nightclubbers tripping over their high heels and those that are too pissed to walk. Fund these via the clubs and pubs.

Redivert the duty from drink and fags into the nhs/mh hospitals and social care, where it belongs.

There is more to sorting the NHS than just throwing money at it. Look at the layers beneath it.

Only the myopically partisan think the Tories want to damage the NHS deliberately.

have you seen the list of Conservative MPs with financial interests in private healthcare? They'd like it to fail, but without being seen as their fault.

And all the twats in the press and out of it who want to charge for drunk-tanks, charge for this, charge for that: what about the patient who just has not got the money?

Most of all why can't there be just one big NHS group who buy and then resell at no profit all the consumables the NHS use...if Tesco can get a pack of pills to us for 50p, why does the NHS cost £7 for the same item...

There is.

NHS Supply Chain is that “group”.

It doesn’t cost NHS SC £7 for the pack of pills.

As to the general comments about paracetamol and obesity....a little more thought required
A) paracetamol over the counter is restricted. For those on regular intakes, that requires a double or treble trip to the shop for a week's supply which is hard for those with chronic conditions.
B) obesity is not just about over eating. Medications, mental health issues and physical infirmity can also cause dramatic weight gain.

Also, drugs returned unopened are destroyed not reused in our area. The doc tried seven different medications on me before finding the right one which meant six went back with just a few tablets removed but all were destroyed. What a waste!

I understand that soon, anything that can be bought over the counter will stop being prescribed. The most obvious one that gets my goat is treatment for thrush. Prescription was over £8. From the pharmacy direct, a single dose pill costed just 75p (but now pharmacy banned from selling otc). From the chemist, this was £13.65. Who is making money here?

And would that allow you to complain if your elderly mother was stuck in an ambulance bay for 6 hours if she didn't have private health insurance?

My elderly mother still works and pays tax on her income and pension and has paid huge amounts of tax over the years, so yes, I would complain on her behalf since her taxes help fund the NHS.

There is no hypothocation of tax in this country (except some vet ly poor exceptions). The nhs model is unsustainable and needs a complete overhaul. A model based on the population split, life expectancy and treatment options of over half a century ago is not fit for purpose today. The nhs needs to focus on what it does best - saving lives. Other treatment being offered at subsidised rates akin to current nhs dentist model for example. Charges for gp visits, use of A&e whilst drunk/ more drunk tanks in city centres. Tax breaks to have elderly relatives living with you might help sort out bed blocking/ better provision for the elderly in the community. Mental health should have a separate budget to make sure help is available to the most vulnerable. Employers over a certain number of people should have to provide healthcare. Healthcare professionals trained in nhs should have to stay for 5-10 years or face a clawback of costs. Better use of triage systems/healthcare assistants at GP surgeries.There was a recent thread about retirement and overwhelmingly people said we can’t expect the same retirement as the baby boomers, unfortunately neither can we expect the same healthcarecoptions. If throwing money at the nhs solved the problem the blairite years would seen a perfect Nhs. We need to see the nhs as part of a web that spreads through society, making sure the rest of the welfare system supports people in their old age so they aren’t stuck in hospital, making good food affordable, less pressure at work (eg banning working for say more than 12 hours per day 5 days a week), encouraging and educating bosses to not put so much stress on employees, making sure people have time to exercise. Better relationship support, being nice and supportive to our neighbours to Help with mental health, taking responsibility for ourselves. Stopping frivolous lawsuits against Nhs. Looking at all the chemicals in our environment which affect hormone levels. The nhs seems to be a sticking plaster for so many of the wider issues in society and this has to stop.

The Tories are deliberately making it fail, back door privitisation by stealth.

All that need be said really.

Andrewoff.youvsay what happens to people in drunk tanks who have no money- well they obviously had the cash to get so drunk they need medical assistance in the first place so they will just have to spend the rest of the year sober!

The Tories are deliberately making it fail, back door privitisation by stealth.

All that need be said really.

That’s it then.

All we need to do is get a Labour in and the NHS will be fine and dandy.

All we need to do is get a Labour in and the NHS will be fine and dandy.

Sadly, that's what some people believe!

Everyone keeps talking about the NHS and the UK - the NHS is a devolved issue so there is no such thing as the UK NHS, you are talking about NHS England. In Scotland the system is completely different, we don’t have trusts and we don’t have the backdoor privatisation which is happening in England.

I don't think tax breaks for individuals would work - but what about incentives for more employers to offer private healthcare to more employees?

I've wondered about this as a solution to transport issues too; incentivise employers not to be so 9-5 where possible and it might free up roads/trains a bit.

Nameless - you just have English taxes paying for it (tongue in cheek)

Actually in Scotland we pay more tax than you pay in England (there is a Scottish Levy) which helps fund our services, including social care and NHS Scotland.

Twinkie1 - Your post is absolutely spot on.

To your list I would add that something needs to be done about the number of elderly with dementia who are filling many hospital beds for long periods of time. Last time I was in hospital after a fall I was on traction for eight weeks. During that time there was a such a woman in the bed next to me who was healed physically but they were having difficulty finding a suitable home for her, her previous home refusing to take her back. So that's one bed taken out of use for two months which I'm pretty sure is replicated many times over.

I would also say that however much the NHS pay to the outside food provider is a total waste of money as it's mostly inedible and I watched every day as most plates of food, including mine, were emptied into the waste bucket. They could save a fortune if they enabled patients to order take-aways or have friends/family bring in microwaveable ready meals. Surely eating properly helps a patient recover too.

ButteredScone
The idea that the Tories want the NHS to fail is moronic. They want it to be a success as do Labour as do the Lib Dems. Only the myopically partisan think the Tories want to damage the NHS deliberately.

Very well said. The same old drivel is spouted every time the NHS is discussed.

Rebecca I think you make an important point about incentising people to be less 9-5. I think that it would be good to encourage more home working. Less stressful, less office politics less travel time would free up more time to cook/exercise and be less stressful all round. Cut environmental pollutants too. Would also cut the presenteeism culture too. Most of the time in our office with hotdesking we are sat several floors from our colleagues so might as well be at home. I think modern life rather than just the nhs needs an overhaul.